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Old 26-06-2021, 15:20   #1
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4JH4 siezed

In a bit if a confused panic. I will explain what Incan of this mystery later.

Bottom line….SOMEHOW I filled the engine with potable water!

The engine ran about a month ago just fine. We tanked up water 2 weeks ago: Today the engine wad FULL of water, 2-1/2 gallons plus the normal oil. That mystery is for later. Right now I am trying to figure out what to do with the engine.

I have pulled the injectors off. #1 showed some oil and water, the others were dry. I put a bore scope in oil fill and that looks fine.

The starter engages but the engine will not spin.

I put a breaker bar on the front pulley and can move the shaft 5° to 10°.

i would like to put PB Blaster or something in injector holes but there are some metal bits with holes closing off the hole, the injector itself is out. Somewhere I read these are “heat shields”.

Can/how do I remove them?
Can I replace them or do I need new?

And a million more questions.

For the moment I am going to try to rock the engine free. Need to burn excess nervous energy.
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Old 26-06-2021, 15:26   #2
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Good luck with that. Go slow. Not sure I follow on the "heat shields." It may be part of the block. Just drizzle some oil in there or a good spray of pb blaster, whatever suits you, gravity is your friend.
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Old 26-06-2021, 15:35   #3
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

I would remove the valve cover too and make sure no valve is stuck in open position (valve does not return with the rocker arm). If stuck open, the piston would hit the valve.


The pieces in the injector hole you mention maybe just the protective sleeve for the injector nozzle and a sealing-ring/crush washer. These usually come out together with the injector. By looking at the tip of each injector you should be able to tell if you have all those parts out.
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Old 26-06-2021, 15:36   #4
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Sorry for your troubles.

I managed to 'bathtub' my I/O in the speedboat a couple times.
Remember to re-install those garboard drain plugs people...
It was plugs out and an oil change or two to remedy.

Would this be a proper use of WD40? PJ Blaster seems a little harsh.
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Old 26-06-2021, 17:08   #5
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Pulled the valve cover.

The valves look good. I sprayed a bunch of PB Blaster on the valves that looked a bit compressed.

I will send a picture soon.

Ricking the alternator pulley/crank shaft I can now get some more turn. 40° reverse rotation and maybe 5° forward rotation. It is for real as I marked the pulley against the case. But I have to stop, I am deforming the cheap ass bolt and wont be able to het it off soon.

Trying to take this by parts. First free the engine. Then figure out what the hell happened. It was recent because we ran the engine a month ago and I topped off the oil, just to raise the level a bit.

I feel like if I can move the shaft and am making progress then I have a fair of freeing it up. This damn nut now has me stymied. I don’t probably will need to find a 6 sided 18mm or 6 sided 3/4” socket. 3/4@ seem to fit better than 18mm.

Then Sunday in the boondocks! Grump!!!!
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Old 26-06-2021, 17:39   #6
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Definitely remain calm. There are important differences between 4JH4 models but if your injectors are NOT under the valve cover it is easier to deal with the current issue. There is a metal sealing ring and a synthetic heat shield on the injector nozzle that often remain in the cylinder head. Might be hard to get the heat shield out but the washer is usually easy. You can pour a water displacer into the injector hole but forget about using the starter to rotate the engine, just a breaker bar and socket on the crank. 10-15° movement is good , keep at it and you will probably get more and more rotation as your choice of water displacer/ lubricant gets into all the corroded crevices.
Good advice re checking the valves but use caution if you have the 16 valve engine version.
If it was my engine I would remove the head and take a good hard look at whats going on in the cylinders, check piston heights, clean up the valves. Take off the oil filter can to avoid storing water there if the sump filled up too. From memory there is a banjo bolt on the sump for the dipstick, take that out and flush the engine with diesel fuel and catch it in a container.
Hoping for a win for you !!!!!
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Old 26-06-2021, 18:34   #7
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

First a picture of the valve train.

Went out to diner, I wasn’t much company but the change of scene cleared my mind. Or I have gone full on delusional.

Very briefly …
I installed a small “last drop” bilge pump that I Tee’ed into the drain from the engine anti-siphon. Being thoughtful installed a ball valve on the anti-siohon side just to be sure no water went the wrong way.

HOWEVER, what I failed to consider is that when I shut the engine off, the water drains from the sea water hoses because the anti-siphon allows air in. By placing the ball valve I prevented air from getting to the siphon, so I created a siphon.

Makes sense time wise.

My PREDICTIONS (usually wrong) are:

Tomorrow I will open the exhaust system. I expect it to be full of water.

The engine is NOT seized, it can not push the water out the very long and deep exhaust run. That is why I am gaining wee bits of turn, I am bumping tiny bits of water out.

Once the exhaust is open the engine will turn over by hand easily. (Oh pease God be so)

Oil rides on water, no water got to the rings or valves.

The boat is sitting in fresh water. The engine has not run since the water got in. There was fresh water AROUND the bearings but likely not IN the bearings. If I do it right, flush the engine properly, it will start up and run with no ill effect except on my schedule, nerves, and ego.

I am going far out in a limb with these predictions. Please hope I am correct for once.

I am exhausted.

SKIPPERPETE:
It IS the 16 valve version.

RE: Dip stick bango joint.

This engine can have the dip stick on either side, on this model the port side fitting had a plug in the hole. I put a oil drain valve in their, I remove the lock, open the valve, and let the oil flow out. Use it for oil changes. Made draining all the old oil/water out relatively easy.
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Old 26-06-2021, 18:45   #8
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

you have disconnected but not removed the injectors! they will hold compression and with water in the combustion chamber you can't turn the engine over. pull out those injectors, then find a way to suck out the water thru the injector holes, before turning over.
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Old 26-06-2021, 19:02   #9
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

do you have the service manual? I found a copy here:
https://www.sv-zanshin.com/r/manuals...e_4jh4-hte.pdf


see pages around 5-41 for details. In short: remove fuel return pipe from the top of the injectors, remove the injector hold down "forks" behind the injectors, pull injectors.
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Old 26-06-2021, 19:12   #10
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Reading the manual on remove/replace i jectors.

They say to always use new gaskets.

How critical is that really? I don't have spares.
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Old 26-06-2021, 19:13   #11
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Quote:
Originally Posted by LeaseOnLife View Post
you have disconnected but not removed the injectors! they will hold compression and with water in the combustion chamber you can't turn the engine over. pull out those injectors, then find a way to suck out the water thru the injector holes, before turning over.
Yes, I see this now, miss identified injectors.

Thanks.
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Old 26-06-2021, 19:24   #12
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

I have reused those protective sleeves/crush washers in my 4JH2-TE. I did have one leaking and I could smell the exhaust gas, also hear it. I cranked that injector down a bit more (while hot) and it was fine until I could get parts.


I think it is more important to get the water out of the cylinder(s) than worrying about the crush washers.
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Old 26-06-2021, 23:42   #13
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Quote:
Originally Posted by hpeer View Post
Reading the manual on remove/replace i jectors.

They say to always use new gaskets.

How critical is that really? I don't have spares.


Trust me, they mean it. Most folks damage the soft injector pipe to rocker cover seals upon removal and they leak engine oil. The return line copper washers are REALLY important because if they leak the engine oil gets diluted... not good. They can be annealed and reused but usually are too deformed so I don’t take the risk.... in fact I pressure test the leakoff rail just to be sure.
On this engine, make sure you keep the valve bridges in the order as removed... no biggy if you mix em up but you would have to re adjust them....all.... same with the pushrods.
I know its a bit late to offer this advice BUT,
when you start cold cranking , shut off the lake water intake.
That top end looks pretty good , I’m really hoping for a happy outcome.
Pete.
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Old 27-06-2021, 00:35   #14
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

You are getting good advice upthread and I can't add much more but let me make the following observations.

IMO, you won't have caused any permanent damage after two weeks of freshwater inside the engine, especially relatively uncirculated freshwater; assuming no hydrolock has occurred!

While water in the cylinders are most likely causing the difficulty in rotating the engine, I should mention another reason an engine can't be turned over - a seized gear driven raw water pump. Your 4JH4 has a gear driven raw water pump and should (for whatever reason), the raw water pump be seized, the engine will not rotate - don't ask me why I know this. For a year my raw water pump was OK and then after sitting for a fortnight, it was seized - admittedly this was in salt water.

Wishing you a quick and painless (relatively) fix!
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Old 27-06-2021, 04:58   #15
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Re: 4JH4 siezed

Got injectors out.

Engine turns freely with breaker bar. Woooo Hoooo!

Vomited out a mix of oil and water.

12 years ago the injectors were pulled and replaced and I am 99% sure the washers were NOT replaced at that time.

I will have to find some place to get them Monday.

Any other parts you would recommend at this time???
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