Thinking about a cat

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

We lived on and cruised with a Gemini for around 9yrs. Our next boat is likely going to be a Gemini again (so take the bias as you will).



Yes, getting into slips is a big driver for keeping the beam reasonable. Very few cruisers are in a position to cruise full time and for most that means they need to get into a slip.



It was not uncommon to have to explain why we shouldn't have to pay the 50% surcharge for a slip for a catamaran (we never did pay any extra). Eventually, we took the tact of giving the boat dimensions and not telling them it's a catamaran.



As far as why there are very few narrow beam cats? Well, I believe the Gemini is one of the most common cruising catamarans out there with a 40yr production run. Most of the 36ft or under cats are in the 14-16ft range with just a few significantly wider.



Back to the OPs original post:

- The helm position works nice in bad weather as most have a helm seat under the dodger. We were often out in rain with t-shirt and shorts while cruisers with unprotected helms were in full weather gear">foul weather gear. The rear windows drop down, you can see just fine thru the windshield. In nice weather, we would sometimes sit up on the side seats.

- If you want a performance catamaran, keep them light. Of course, liveaboard conflicts with that as you have to carry your household on a 30-35ft cat. We had occasion to empty a lot of stuff out while preparing for winter storage a few times and she was 0.5-1.0 kts faster running light.

- Probably the biggest advantage to the Gemini (not the newer Legacy models) is the shallow draft. It's amazing the shallow water you can sneak into. Also, with boards, if you take the time to learn how to use them, performance can be pretty impressive.

- Aluminum needs a larger size to make sense on a cat. Once you get the hull thick enough for puncture resistance, the hulls are significantly heavier than an equivalent glass hull. At 50ft, aluminum is much more competitive vs glass.

- Galley Up vs Down: On cats where down, is 3-4ft below the bridge deck, you are highly isolated from guests at the dinette. On the Gemini, you are only about 1ft down, so unless you are really short (under 5ft), you aren't isolated. We also had a Catalac 10m and while the same general size, it was worlds different if someone was down at the galley, they were isolated.

- I don't know of anyone using wood coring below the waterline but just about everyone has it on the deck. Yes, it's a maintenance issue but the alternative is a much heavier deck.

That was not intended to be a knock against Gemini's per say, just that was one of the design decisions. If it works well for your intended/actual use then you've found your boat.

(I have actually sailed several different years of Gemini's).

[bushytales]

As an avid multihull owner, I believe experience in this discussion counts!
My first sail boat was a 40’ Boro, bilge keeler. Owned it for a few years and regularly ran aground. A few years later I bought a 40’ Simpson Liahona Trimaran.
Great sailing boat but didn’t like a heavy payload. Also, up and down, up and down, down on your hands and knees to get into the forward cabin (under the cross beam).
Eventually moved on and built a 38’ strip cedar Peter Snell catamaran. Beautiful boat...sailed well, took a reasonable payload, occasional thumping of the underwing but generally a delightful liveaboard catamaran. Was made a silly offer to buy her from me which I accepted. Then bought a new Easy 36’ from Peter Snell. Loved this boat. Light and gentle to sail, could ground her in less than 1m.
Great boat!
Sold her and built a 42’ catamaran WICKED. Fabulous boat...sailed well, took a good payload, easily grounded, again in less than 1m - installed kick up rudders during the build...loved the outboard powering on each cat. So much simpler and efficient. Engines pull up out of the water, so no drag. I also raised the bridge deck to 900mm clearance and solved ALL the slamming issues associated with previous catamarans. Lastly,I raised the cockpit floor by a further 600mm to enable 360degree vision from the helm. I made the helm wheel 1200 diameter (yes, you read right!) and centremounted it with the wheel passing down through an enclosed “box” into the void under the raised cockpit.
Without doubt, one of the very best steering positions EVER on a catamaran.
Faults? Big rig and big sails... very difficult to sail single handed. Went down the traditional route of galley down - should have put the galley up. Otherwise a delightful boast to live on.
Of all the boats I’ve owned, I believe the 38’ was the perfect size, weight, etc for extended cruising/live aboard.
Just my opinion! But if I had my time over again, I would have built a galley up and raised the bridge deck to 900mm. Otherwise, lots of fun, pleasurable sailing, easy to handle alone, and strip cedar construction gave her lovely lines and curves...something every female, person or boat, deserves!!!

[SV WELDER]

Originally Posted by joelhemington

Sounds like an F boat (after Ian Farrier) like a Corsair might be a good fit for you. They're collapsible trimarans so you can put one on a trailer and haul it around if you want and they're faster than snot. Probably not as suitable as a live aboard as a traditional cat but the new ones use closed cell foam in the coring (I too dislike the balsa wood coring method, but that's what you'll get in an older catamaran.) Just be aware, these boats ain't cheap - even the used ones can carry a hefty price tag.

Yeah I don’t want to limit space unless it’s for a very good reason. Like speed! Lol. But I’m also large person, 6’4” so compact spaces aren’t my favorite.
Anyone have a spec for the salon inside height on a privilege 37’? That boat looks fantastic

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by bushytales

As an avid multihull owner, I believe experience in this discussion counts!
My first sail boat was a 40’ Boro, bilge keeler. Owned it for a few years and regularly ran aground. A few years later I bought a 40’ Simpson Liahona Trimaran.
Great sailing boat but didn’t like a heavy payload. Also, up and down, up and down, down on your hands and knees to get into the forward cabin (under the cross beam).
Eventually moved on and built a 38’ strip cedar Peter Snell catamaran. Beautiful boat...sailed well, took a reasonable payload, occasional thumping of the underwing but generally a delightful liveaboard catamaran. Was made a silly offer to buy her from me which I accepted. Then bought a new Easy 36’ from Peter Snell. Loved this boat. Light and gentle to sail, could ground her in less than 1m.
Great boat!
Sold her and built a 42’ catamaran WICKED. Fabulous boat...sailed well, took a good payload, easily grounded, again in less than 1m - installed kick up rudders during the build...loved the outboard powering on each cat. So much simpler and efficient. Engines pull up out of the water, so no drag. I also raised the bridge deck to 900mm clearance and solved ALL the slamming issues associated with previous catamarans. Lastly,I raised the cockpit floor by a further 600mm to enable 360degree vision from the helm. I made the helm wheel 1200 diameter (yes, you read right!) and centremounted it with the wheel passing down through an enclosed “box” into the void under the raised cockpit.
Without doubt, one of the very best steering positions EVER on a catamaran.
Faults? Big rig and big sails... very difficult to sail single handed. Went down the traditional route of galley down - should have put the galley up. Otherwise a delightful boast to live on.
Of all the boats I’ve owned, I believe the 38’ was the perfect size, weight, etc for extended cruising/live aboard.
Just my opinion! But if I had my time over again, I would have built a galley up and raised the bridge deck to 900mm. Otherwise, lots of fun, pleasurable sailing, easy to handle alone, and strip cedar construction gave her lovely lines and curves...something every female, person or boat, deserves!!!

bushy, why are you keen on galley up ? we strongly prefer our galley down but will listen to alternatives views

cheers,

[CruiseN]

What those blokes above have shared..
Innocent eyes don't see plane lift as an envelope of air under water shields our above surface eyes. But it's a heel off; a sis tum.

Like light weight fast racing monos, very prone to weight handicap.
Big sails but when burden with stow, may as well reef early and less stress. Knot near enough same.
Simply to much force is required to lift friction from hulls consistently. Leeward hull lift although splicing waterway.

Monos get away with this by having fast cruisers which develop keelson depth sooner than a flat out racer. Allowing carry of store with leave the cloth up without excessive tension wear.
Cats be doing it easy too but unable to rotate wind spillage and they big sails.

I think there's a double berth down our way for sale. 9.5 metres.