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**Cotemar** · 27-02-2017, 08:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandero

Who proved it and how was it proven?
There are no proofs... only opinions.

The proof in Catamarans seaworthiness is in the FACT that 1000's of multi-hulls have crossed oceans to be delivered on their own bottoms and then go on the Circumnavigate the WORLD.
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GTom · 27-02-2017, 08:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason Flare

Are you saying the the Marina of Saint Nicholas on Crete is 100% monohulls?

Right, is there any around, that doesn't charge more on a multi?

Croatia: Frapa/Rogoznica: +50-80%

ACI-marinas: 25-80%

Gibraltar: +50%

Turkey, Setur marinas: surface-based pricing (+100%?)

Póvoa, Portugal: +50% - Actually Portugal, Douro is the only place I found a limited free-multi option.

**boatman61** · 27-02-2017, 08:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason Flare;

2335031

I'm not seeing anything about beam in the price list, but I don't do well when the the magazines tells me to pick out six things different in two nearly identical photos.

I'll keep looking.

I just looked at the Price List and could see nothing about multi's either..
Did however notice I pay less/annum for my boat in Portugal than there..

Mariano · 27-02-2017, 08:24

I'm a mono guy (bavaria 46) but grew Up Racing hobie cats and hoping one day to buy a cruising cat. I think most people see all cats like Americas's Cup or Extreme Sailing boats, that on first mistake capsize, or like beach cats. Most modern designs now are way more stable and safe. My personal choice when time comes to sell out and go full time cruising is the Privilege
Serie 5 . What cat would you choose for offshore, liveaboard, fulll time cruising if budget was no concern?

alctel · 27-02-2017, 08:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by valhalla360

First you are in the backwaters of the U.S. cruising world, so most designs are later coming to the area. The S.E., particularly Florida sees new designs first. This is particularly true with the Charter operations in the Caribbean feeding used boats to the Florida market.

It's really a matter of time. We started in the Great Lakes and 10-15yrs ago a cat was a real oddity to see. They are still a small percentage but lately, it's become common to see them about.

I think part of the reason is cats are more popular with full time cruisers who need and want a comfortable platform to live on, so they are the first to make the shift. That's why you see a lot of them going up and down the east coast.

So we don't have many cats because we are the backwaters and haven't been enlightened yet?

valhalla360 · 27-02-2017, 08:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by boatman61

I don't know.. they are more or less shallow V hulls and I hit 16kts+ (not surfing) sail only on my Tiki 26.. 12+ on my 21.. under sail.
No way the 5hp ob could match that on the 26.. the 21 I sailed engineless.

I've hit 10kts in flat water sailing on our Gemini (and this wasn't particularly high wind speed). In stronger conditions, I know people have hit low teens but flat out with 40hp was only around 8kts.

In the right conditions, sails will put out the equivalent of a really big engine. Also, the engine tends to dig a hole at the stern so you are pushing uphill but with sails, that doesn't happen in fact, it tends to push the bows down.

smj · 27-02-2017, 09:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandero

Who proved it and how was it proven? This sounds like rubbish. A gentleman with a fair amount of experience expressed his opinion. It sounds sensible but was not offered as a proof.

There are no proofs... only opinions.

This was written by an ex CF moderator.
https://www.ssca.org/forum/viewtopic...283be58#p33869
The info he gathered pretty much copies the conversations I've had with Lloyds Of London insurance.

Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

rallyman1122 · 27-02-2017, 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by weavis

Maybe if your feelings were based on fact it steps away from being prejudice....

I disagree with that, Weavis. Everything in this thread is about feelings and how different boats are perceived and the feelings they provide. Not saying one is better than the other, just that everyone has different feelings and comforts zone.

And for me, that zone has two hulls.

rallyman1122 · 27-02-2017, 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mariano

My personal choice when time comes to sell out and go full time cruising is the Privilege
Serie 5 . What cat would you choose for offshore, liveaboard, fulll time cruising if budget was no concern?

For me it would be a St Francis 50 Mk II. A solid cat with the ability to do more than just sail down wind.

rabbi · 27-02-2017, 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason Flare

I'm not seeing anything about beam in the price list, but I don't do well when the the magazines tells me to pick out six things different in two nearly identical photos.

I'll keep looking.

download the PDF price list which gives more details. multihulls are +100% so double the price of a mono.

I have often paid monoprice x 1.3 or 1.5, sometimes I am billed by suqare meter and sometimes I'm lucky and get the mono price. But I will never pay 100% premium unless its a real emergency.

But I only care about cheap winter storage, as we almost never visit marinas in season.

rabbi · 27-02-2017, 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandero

Who proved it and how was it proven? This sounds like rubbish. A gentleman with a fair amount of experience expressed his opinion. It sounds sensible but was not offered as a proof.

There are no proofs... only opinions.

just call your insurance agent. He has no opinion but only facts as insurers have all numbers and routinely do their math on the risks.

If a multihull represents a higher risk than a mono they are the first to know it.

Come back to report if you want.

**weavis** · 27-02-2017, 09:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by rallyman1122

I disagree with that, Weavis. Everything in this thread is about feelings and how different boats are perceived and the feelings they provide. Not saying one is better than the other, just that everyone has different feelings and comforts zone.

And for me, that zone has two hulls.

I think I will have to stand by my comment.

Prejudice comes in prejudgement. Prejudged is the infered belief that monohulls are infinitely safe and everything has to be measured against them. Given this 'feeling', then any multihull will have to be proven better than to have a chance of measuring up.

This is almost a supertitious and fearful approach which negates an honest appraisal.

Example:

Quote:

on multihulls, I always have the concern thought about capsizing-> ONLY in bad weather conditions (10bft and up and big waves)

I think about capsizing in bad weather on ANY vessel Im on, I dont differentiate.

Quote:

I had some encounters with conditions like above with monohulls.

But you havent with catamarans have you?

The bottom line is that if a mono goes over in bad weather and doesnt right itself, the keel is not designed to do that.... then heads will be bobbing in the water and the boat will sink.

If a Cat goes over, then it will probably be floating in the water and crew will find appropriate places to hold on too.

This is not an ideal situation for either vessel or personnel. TO be honest it sucks. The difference is negligible except in choice of vessel to be on when setting off. Fortunately for us sailors, Its a rare event. But in the event, there is hope for the crew either way.

The idea is to try not to be in overwhelming sea conditions in either type of vessel, and to know your boat and how to minimise a problem.

I dont mind either in a blow.... as long as its a good example of the single or double hull....

But I will not denigrate a multi due to prejudice... for that is what it is...

donradcliffe · 27-02-2017, 10:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by weavis

I think I will have to stand by my comment.

The bottom line is that if a mono goes over in bad weather and doesnt right itself, the keel is not designed to do that.... then heads will be bobbing in the water and the boat will sink.

This statement not only shows extreme prejudice, it shows extreme ignorance.