Small Liveaboard Cat Search

[djeeke]

Thanks Talbot !!!

Will keep you all updated on what is going on...

[djeeke]

Originally Posted by djeeke

Will keep you all updated on what is going on...

As said above...
Seawolf has been so kind to go and look at a Prout Event for me...
It was priced low but this is due to the fact that there is a lot of work associated to the boat so it would end up above my budget anyway...

So the search goes on...

I am thinking of planning a boatseeing trip into France soon where I did see some boats within budget... (might go to the UK as well)

So I think of going to see the following boats, any comments are welcome
Sea Cat 34
Hobart 900 & one Hobart 900 needing some TLC
Cité d'Aleth II which might turn up being too small in accomodation but seems to be an excellent sailor...

Maybe add a visit to a Comanche too but I am not sure about the size of the berths, reason for which we dropped the Iroquois of our list...
This Comanche is located south of Spain, a bit far away, eventual visit should be planned separately...
This Comanche and this one are over my budget, this one is closer to budget and all in France so maybe worth the detour...

So I am very busy inquiring about several boats, as always all hints and ideas are appreciated

[MartinC]

The hulls of a Comanche are substantially more voluminous than those of an Iroquois.

By the way, I wouldn't entirely write off the Iroquois - I've got one, and it's OK for one or two people if you travel light. The issue with small multis is related to displacement. My Mk 2A Iroquois displaces around two and a half tons, which is something like a 27ft monohull, hence it will carry a similar amount of gear. But in fact it has much more usable space than a 27-footer, and there are many other advantages - for me (having lived for 10+ years in two monos, a Golden Hind and a Rival 34) it's just great to be able to see out, and to creek-crawl, avoiding marinas. The Iroquois has fine hulls and the amount and distribution of payload needs to be watched, but it sails well and that's good too. Richard Woods' remarks about its capsize record are true, but remember it's 30 years old, many were built and lots were raced hard. You won't get standing headroom in the saloon of a small cat anyway - and hey, the Iroquois looks a hell of a lot nicer than a 'sensible' boat like the Catalac.

Actually, if I had the money I'd buy or build a Woods Romany...

[feelsgood]

Originally Posted by djeeke

Hello,

After a post on the FP Louisiane I am redirecting my search with a more general thread which seems a lot smarter (I guess I learn fast ?) !

We own a 27 ft monohull but consider switching to a Cat for liveaboard and extended cruising...

My budget for the boat... good one... in the range of 100 to 120k Euro...
Would look at buying in the 50-80k range so there would be plenty of room left for some improvements... (there always are improvements and unforeseen expenses to a second hand boat)

We intend, once we have the boat, to move on and start sailing, we would not want it as a day or weekend sailer, I have my Jaguar 27 monohull that does this job perfectly, it easily allows us to go on extended weekends or even longer vacations...
Once liveaboard we will be dependent on our investments income and I want this to be on the safe side...
So every Euro spent is a Euro away from our liveaboard plan, if we are able to get a good cat ready to go for 100k(Euro's) that's where we will go, to the sooner the better. (but will not compromise on safety, maintenance, equipment etc... the boat should be in great shape when we leave)

We would plan on doing some coastal sailing as a start, region and schedule undefined, could be here in Europe, Africa, US, name it... Does not really matter, sailing is great !!! Last year we talked with an English skipper who had been sailing for 7 years, initially left the UK and now sailing Turkey, but hell he enjoyed every minute of it... So a timing on planning to start ocean crossings we can not give. But if the cat we buy would be circumnavigation capable it would avoid us having to trade boats when we decide to go for it.

How well do they it sail? Anybody has a polar or can tell us how she does windward? What speeds can be obtained while cruising? How easy they sail (singlehanded?)... (after all we will be looking at older Cat's)

If it has a dual diesel inboard setup, we are Ok with this... If we find one with outboard engine setup, I initially was not thrilled about this but after thinking a bit it doesn't look too bad... We would probably replace the outboards with a dual electrical outboard setup. We see outboard engines as inside space savers. Electrical setup means instant access to silent power, no need to bother about thinking of emergence engine start in case something happens, just move the throttle and motor off... Does this sound crazy?
Would put one on the dingy as well so no gasoline required in the boat! A diesel gen unit could be used if we really drain the batteries down. (otherwise battery charge through wind/solar system or shore power) And since a diesel gen would bring Mr Diesel on board, Mr webasto will nicely heat up our entire boat as he does on our monohull !...

It looks like the Benetteau II might be a better candidate than the FP louisiane... Any other candidates ? Oh yes, required headroom... We are 5' 8" and 5' 9" (The Mrs and me that is ;-)

Ending this initial post on this one, hope to get interesting feedback and comments...

You might like the look of a Prout 33 cat they have a good record and are capabale of ocean sailing with good accomodation. Regards Pete and Sal (Feels Good)

[windhorze]

Djeeke-

If anything I "undersold" my boat out of concern of misrepresentation. The boat's new owners and personal surveyor state that they were surprised I let the boat go for what I did, and found it quite solid considering. They plan to sail it to Peru and flip it (I mean sell it) for profit.

As I believe I told you, I found it flexed too much for my comfort but I'm no surveyor, I just got spooked.

As far as that flying seat goes...it was a hoot, and a great position to steer from.

Good luck in your boat search-

Originally Posted by djeeke

The boat I mentioned previously is now listed click here on ebay
Starting bid 15.000

The owner likes a good salestalk, he mentions someone from Europe is interested in buying his boat !
(hmm I wonder who that would be )...

Funny thing is he is not getting back to me with replies to my questions...

Go figure !

Anyway I have been pointed out by several people this boat would not be a good ocean traveler. Excellent coastal cruiser though... (or maybe it could be OK if one strengthened the hulls as he mentions)

With the correct replies to me and some feedback from a reputable surveyor on ocean capability I would not even made a lower offer than the 20k he was asking previously...

But since he's not interested in selling to me, and especially with all the feedback I got, I'm not pursuing on this boat...

A 37 ft listed for months at 20k and not sold... This also tells a story...

As some already know, I'm off again looking at smaller but proven ocean capable boats !!!

[djeeke]

I did see it being sold !

I think too it was a great deal but probably not the right choice for us, we want to do real extended sailing trips, even the polycon designers told me this boat would not be suitable for our purpose and who am I to contradict the people behind the drawing board...

[Atlantic42]

I know this comes from left field, but have you considered buying a boat in Florida? We have a PDQ 39 for sale that is ready to go (i.e. needs nothing to cross an ocean). We just sailed her 800nm + in the last week and many thousands of miles in the last six months cruising in the NW Caribbean. All of her systems were upgraded in 2008/2009. The boat is in your price range. See more at: www.PDQ36.blogspot.com We own two boats thus must sell one to keep the cruising kitty in the black.

[beau]

Why don't you have a boat built like I did.
It wasn't that expensive and you can have it fitted out as you want. Liveaboard accomodation is quite different from weekend sailing.

I personally prefer the trimaran concept because it is cheaper to build and has more of a monohull feel inside.

The 40 ft trimaran is built in flat panels of Aluminium. The fabrication was done by professionals and I fitted it out. Look up "beau' boat" on this forum. The design also fits into a 40 ft shipping container.
I find the shallow draft of 1 ft fantastic as we can anchor in quieter spots with no neighbours etc

[djeeke]

Originally Posted by Atlantic42

I know this comes from left field, but have you considered buying a boat in Florida?

Yup we consider this !

Originally Posted by Atlantic42

The boat is in your price range. See more at: www.PDQ36.blogspot.com

Unfortunately this seems not the case anymore, by reading the whole thread, you will notice we have been hit badly and our budget has been cut dramatically, enough for me to not even be able to think of PDQ...
I must admit, Pacifica would have been a great deal for us last year and we would not have suffered the hit on our investment instead we would have owned a great boat ...

So we now look for bottom budget sound boats and need to keep some $$ aside for refitting...

[djeeke]

Originally Posted by beau

Why don't you have a boat built like I did.
It wasn't that expensive and you can have it fitted out as you want.

How long did it take to get the boat finished?
I've had people asking me why not consider building one but we do not consider this a good option...
Lots of years spent building instead of sailing...

Originally Posted by beau

I personally prefer the trimaran concept because it is cheaper to build and has more of a monohull feel inside.

We might go for a tri too, but for the time being we still focus on a Cat.

[beau]

I got a naval architect to email the plans to the aluminium company. All the aluminium arrived all laser cut ready to tack together.
The basic frame was up in a week and the completed boat ready to paint in 6 weeks. I helped out at the aluminium fabricating boat builders but I would NOT recommend this as a DIY project.
I fitted the boat out myself.
I got a professionly built boat.
If I was to do it again, I would have the boat sent to Langkawi in Malaysia after the aluminium frame was built, for fitting out. (much cheaper and better quality workmanship)

The main cost with building boats is "Marketing costs" and "Fitting out".
With a Trimaran you have ONE hull to fit out not two plus a bridge deck. Plus I don't have any use for four double beds. (normal cat accomodation)You only need one engine, not two
One final advantage, is for your money you can have a much longer boat. a 50 ft tri versus a 40 ft cat. A 50 ft boat has better rough weather ability and a higher displacement speed.

My design is 40 ft and will fit into a 40ft shipping container

[djeeke]

Hi all !

Been pretty busy these days, unfortunately no boat seeing
Anybody seen this spanish Cat for sale?
Wooden construction if the ad is right, pictures are small so not easy to see what boat I am looking at...
Thx !!!

[djeeke]

Lack of sidedeck will drop this of our list anyway, more interior space but no easy way forward...

While we're at it, trying to identify this "Toulbao" Catamaran too...

Any idea's somebody ???

[Sea Wolf]

The Spanish cat looks interesting and well maintained, but a 30 year old wooden boat can have myriad problems. Doesn't look like it has much of a cockpit or any way to go forward.

The Martinique boat also looks like wood and appears to be rough on the exterior, but the interior seems to be kept decently.

It's always the same problem... you never know until you take a look at the boat.

Loree
Aboard SeaWolf
CruisersLife.com

[djeeke]

Got some feedback on the Toulbao Catamaran.
Amateur built, architect Fleury.
The ad is all but clear and the pictures are not recent... It is in worse condition than described and needs a lot of tlc. Only one engine is fitted, the other one is removed and needs to be refitted, all mast, rigging and outside parts have been removed and need to be refitted. He mentions a new sail in the ad, from the mail I understand this might not be the case.
Only one interior pic in the ad, probably prior to the dismanteling. As now the interior has been completely dismantled and only partially rebuilt, electrics, electronics, etc, all needs to be reinstalled.
Looks like they bought the boat to rebuild it a few years ago and now quit this project as they might have underestimated the workload and associated costs...
The very same reason why I don't want to get involved in a total refurbishing or building of a boat myself.
Maybe something for amateur boat builders to finish what they started, not for me...