Ship and Equipment for Extended Survival

[SPARK]

If I wanted to be safe and out of the way when all hell, breaks loose, then I think the places you are thinking of are the places every one else is also thinking of. Some one will have a shortage and then they will start looking at you with envy and want to take what you have.
Also think where would you want to be for 2 years that is isolated?
Most people want to be in the tropics on a pristine beach. This is the place that every one with money will flee to. They won't be as prepared as you, but may have more money/power to influence others to help them take from you what they need/want.

So where does leave you? In my mind you need to go somewhere where others or very few will want to go. Antarctica. It is isolated, it is not worth anyone's effort to go after you there because the cost will out way the returns.

That brings us to what kind of vessel? I would say it needs to be metal and be able to overwinter there. It needs to carry supplies for 2 years including heating fuel. Because of the weight carrying ability and being heavy metal to withstand the pack ice, I would think a mono hull would be more suited. But I am open to arguments for or against this type of vessel.

In a survival situation you could harvest wildlife for meat and fat/fuel to keep warm.

This all presumes that we are talking of a world wide riot.

[atoll]

for gas plumb in all the heads into a bio gas generator,also put a wood burning stove with back boiler in the saloon,micro wave run off an inverter is about the only option that will run off batteries.

a large ferro cement vessel is probably more suited to your needs.

[Hydra]

If you are preparing for long term survival (seeds...), you should think about a wood or charcoal burning stove instead of LPG, sheet copper instead of antifouling paint...

Electrical cooking isn't really practical at sea: a standard gaz burner provides about 3kW. This would mean 250 Amps on 12V!

I think it is not possible to hide firearms so well that Customs officers can't find them (when looking for drugs) AND being able to access them fast enough to repel pirates.

Alain

[barnakiel]

Water heaters etc. can be run via an inverter (a pretty dupy one). But to run an electric galley you would probably need a genset.

A household sewing machine will not fix sails on a big cat, except the nylons. But it will fix your clothing, canvas, etc.. stuff. Big sails can be fixed by gluing, but if your sails are new they will likely not need any repairs in the 2-3 years horizon.

Personally, I would not go too far into the make lot / consume lot valley (huge panels, huge turbines / huge batteries ... only to run an electric galley, etc.. - it seems a much safer road to follow the need less / produce less policy.

LPG for 2 years should be no issue - read the LPG use thread and you will see how very little is necessary. What I would worry, if at all, is some spares for the galley (maybe a spare galley?). One can always gather some driftwood and set up a fire on the beach, anyway. Or eat raw /dried fish, when offshore.

b.

[atoll]

[sgunes]

Hydra: any more info regarding the sheet copper versus antifouling paint?

Hydra and Atoll: I very much like the idea of a wood/charcoal burning stove.

Atoll: any more info regarding the marine bio-gas generator heads?

Spark: I understand that everyone and their dog would want to go to some Caribbean or South Pacific Island to survive and there will be a run on supplies but the Antarctic/Arctic would be too cold and would take the fun out of the whole endeavor. I think that's when some self-defense gear will come in play.

Hydra: Is foreign customs a problem if you stay outside the 12-mile (or x-mile zone) from any country? In the US are firearms that are legally purchased and registered (I am not a convicted felon or even "misdemeaning" guy, although I had a speeding ticket in the last year.) not allow on boats? Just wondering.

Thanks for all the ideas.

[atoll]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WCv4-_-nwk

home made bio gas burner and unit

[boatman61]

Sorry mate... cant help..
I'm a budget cruiser.. floating trailer trash... ask anyone here..
If you asked for the best Marina bins I could help... but hell.. your water maker alone cost more than my boat so I'll leave it for the other 'Rich Dudes' to advise on the best way to waste your money and feel safe..
Portuguese Sunday lunch again at friends............ lotsa wine again...

[Capt Phil]

When the whole shebang goes down the drain, it will matter not where you are as long as you have your loved ones around. One of the great doomsday movies ever made was 'On The Beach' back in the sixties. The times were more civilized having had a couple of World Wars still in the memories of many. They managed to sort out things peacefully awaiting the end down under. Today, with most folks living in large cities, those values seem to have disappeared in the US, at least. People living under survival conditions presently will probably survive somehow but many of us used to the creature comforts of today won't be able to cope and will try and take from those who have. Conditions won't be much better afloat, I fear, but good luck! Capt Phil

[sgunes]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Sorry mate... cant help..
I'm a budget cruiser.. floating trailer trash... ask anyone here..
If you asked for the best Marina bins I could help... but hell.. your water maker alone cost more than my boat so I'll leave it for the other 'Rich Dudes' to advise on the best way to waste your money and feel safe..
Portuguese Sunday lunch again at friends............ lotsa wine again...

Good for you boatman 61.
As they say: In vinum veritas est.

Enjoy life, that's what it is all about.
I am just the kind of guy who is very safety conscious and always has a plan B and C. But that's just me. I may be wrong.

[LakeSuperior]

Originally Posted by Capt Phil

When the whole shebang goes down the drain, it will matter not where you are as long as you have your loved ones around. One of the great doomsday movies ever made was 'On The Beach' back in the sixties. The times were more civilized having had a couple of World Wars still in the memories of many. They managed to sort out things peacefully awaiting the end down under. Today, with most folks living in large cities, those values seem to have disappeared in the US, at least. People living under survival conditions presently will probably survive somehow but many of us used to the creature comforts of today won't be able to cope and will try and take from those who have. Conditions won't be much better afloat, I fear, but good luck! Capt Phil

Thus the more realistic doomsday account is in Cormac McCarthy's "The Road".

[Adelie]

Seeds aren't going to do you much on a boat.

Any place you land that is arable will have natives. If the world has gone to pot they will not be anymore receptive to outsiders showing up to stay than the the folks in your native country, the US I am assuming. That argues for going home, preferably to someplace the neighbors know you, at least in passing. Buy a little plot of land now out in the sticks, build a shack, put in a water catchment system, show up several times a year and make it a point to get to know the neighbors and be friendly to them.

On a boat long range weapons don't work well, the snipers that did pirates when they rescued that frieghter capt a year or so ago were on a vessel that displaced 2-10kt, were at moderate range and in good conditions.

In some places undeclared firearms will get you a prison term and will lose you the boat. I have heard it will get you a hangman's noose in Malaysia. No the US consulate will not do much for you, except maybe get the sentence commuted to life, they don't like foreigners bringing guns into the US illegally so they don't have much leverage to bitch about US citizens who get nicked for illegal possession. Americans' predelliction for firearms tends to attract officials looking for firearms.

Best bet is to stay away from areas known for pirates and skip the firearms.

If you really want to project unpleasantness you will need to improvise.

A bow fishing rig can reasonably be argued as a food source or as a way to send a messanger line to another vessel (have an arrow or 5 with a ball on the end for this function, and practice too). the ability to aAttach small cocktails while at sea does not have to be brought up to officials.

Consider building a compressed air cannon to launch cocktails of an appropriate size.

Really though, if you can't live without a weapon for a security blanket, just stay home.

[SvenG]

It seems like this thread is drifting pretty far from cruising.

Maybe we should concentrate more on the vessel itself and how to use it ?



-Sven

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by sgunes

Good for you boatman 61.
As they say: In vinum veritas est.

Enjoy life, that's what it is all about.
I am just the kind of guy who is very safety conscious and always has a plan B and C. But that's just me. I may be wrong.

Sgunes.... anyone with a bit of common has a plan B and a plan C and D... else don't go sailing if one cannot plan secondary ports...
Its just some plans are cheaper than others and if things go tits up and I've got loadsa veggies and you've a ton of gold and diamonds....
You've got no veggies...lol
Thanks for the "Enjoy Life".... its Exactly what its all about

[Hillbillylad]

Originally Posted by sgunes

Good for you boatman 61.
As they say: In vinum veritas est.

Enjoy life, that's what it is all about.
I am just the kind of guy who is very safety conscious and always has a plan B and C. But that's just me. I may be wrong.

I think there is a difference between being safety conscious and being paranoid.
I believe, in the event of an Armageddon scenario, the people that will survive will be those that can manage on very little and are resourceful. Those with a boat load of goodies will be prime targets and how many of those goodies will be serviceable come the time you need them?
I totally understand the need to get out of this rat race and the constant loss of freedoms, but I see it as a means to enjoying life in the now, stress free, rather than hiding from the desperate hordes tomorrow.
When I eventually get my own boat and reach more tropical climes, I will ensure I have booze and a hammock and the world can do what the hell it likes cos I surely wont give a stuff.