Sailing newbie, insane fears and storage concerns

[Eggbah]

Originally Posted by varkpilot

Hello, Eggbah. I'd like to play the devil's advocate, in a manner of speaking. I've boated all my long life, both power and sail. The physical requirements of sailboats, now at least in my case, limit me to power boats. The only boat I've ever partially sunk was a catamaran when its port hull opened to the sea. The starboard hull remained afloat and I got her pulled into shore and eventually repaired. My wife and children were with me, and no one came even close to harm. Your statement that power boats didn't have deck space was a little confusing to me. What power boats are you familiar with? My 47 foot Chris Craft Commander has more floor space than a 2-bedroom condominium, and any of its 3 staterooms (plus the salon/living room and galley/kitchen) could be converted to any use you choose. I use my middle stateroom/bedroom as an office. It contains a desk and a washer/dryer, plus a lot of my books and junk. It's not crowded, either. I have the safety advantage of 2 8-cylinder diesel engines and enough speed to never get bored with 6 to 8 knot (less than 10 miles per hour) passages. The boat cost me 45,000 and came equipped with full electronics, including radar, and a power generator for times I want to anchor offshore and still enjoy all the amenities, such as 3 air conditioners for Texas summers, a full size refrigerator and large screen television or my desktop computer. Capsizing that boat would require seas that you would never allow yourself to enter. I did love sailing and owned sailboats up to a 65 foot schooner, but that was many years ago. All I'm saying here is don't pin yourself to a single type of vessel. When you're looking at boats, include some power vessels just for tickles and grins. You might be pleasantly surprised.

Thanks for being on the other side. I really need to see it from all angles. It's a big purchase!

I know what you mean about the 47 Commander. The boat I have operated was a 48 Constellation, very similar in design, except there were only 2 staterooms on the Cons, forward master and aft bunks. The Cons was mahogany vs the lovely fiberglass hull of the Commander. Can you tell which one I wish they bought? lol

By deck space, I mean useable exterior space, sorry for the confusion. My parents' CC Cons was very limited with exterior space. We had 2 lounge chairs in the front and that was it for the outside. The entire boat was enclosed. They rarely left the dock. Beautiful boat - but a blankity blank to maintain. Inside, you couldn't beat the space! The previous owners lived full time on the boat.

I definitely appreciate the advice!

[varkpilot]

I know what you mean about the 47 Commander. The boat I have operated was a 48 Constellation, very similar in design, except there were only 2 staterooms on the Cons, forward master and aft bunks. The Cons was mahogany vs the lovely fiberglass hull of the Commander. Can you tell which one I wish they bought? lol

By deck space, I mean useable exterior space, sorry for the confusion. My parents' CC Cons was very limited with exterior space. We had 2 lounge chairs in the front and that was it for the outside. The entire boat was enclosed.

The Connies were (are) beautiful boats, but the Philippine Mahogany was definitely problematic. Hooray for fiberglass!!! I'm not much of a photo guy, but here are a few pics that led me to buy the boat. The forward deck is not all that large, but the bridge deck is pretty big. You also have the flying bridge with its deck space.

[varkpilot]

P.S. That's a full wet bar you see on the port/forward side of the bridge deck. For inclement weather, the boat has an enclosure of Isinglass/canvas, but I seldom put it up.

[Eggbah]

That's very nice!! Much nicer (in my opinion) than the CC Cons, even though it was fully restored. Much more open than what I've been in.

[varkpilot]

Originally Posted by Eggbah

That's very nice!! Much nicer (in my opinion) than the CC Cons, even though it was fully restored. Much more open than what I've been in.

Thank you. I enjoy Dreamer a great deal. Neither do I find her to be "a hole in the water into which one pours money". Believe it or not, my grandchildren have even water-skied behind her. Not a speedy ski-boat, mind you, but fast enough to get up on the skis with little trouble.

[jeepbluetj]

Yaknow, "I'm terrified of sailing" and "what boat should I buy" are not statements that go together. It's like saying "I want to play (American) football, but I hate physical contact."

If you don't like to sail, don't look at any kind of sailboat. You'll hate it forever. I've had guests out that decide they hate sailing within a few hours. Imagine how that would have been if they just bought a boat.

#1 - Learn to sail. You'll find out what you like. I'll NOT recommend dinghy sailing for the non-adventurous to start on. Same with a beach cat. Dinghies and beach cats are fun as all get out, but they're both pretty wet and wild and not all that stable. If you worry about flipping over, a laser or lido is the last thing in the world you should look at.

#2 - If you don't really like to sail, don't sail. It's not for everybody.

#3 - If you like power, go power. Heck, some of the distance cruising boats now are power (like Dashew's FPBs)

[Eggbah]

Originally Posted by jeepbluetj

Yaknow, "I'm terrified of sailing" and "what boat should I buy" are not statements that go together. It's like saying "I want to play (American) football, but I hate physical contact."

If you don't like to sail, don't look at any kind of sailboat. You'll hate it forever. I've had guests out that decide they hate sailing within a few hours. Imagine how that would have been if they just bought a boat.

#1 - Learn to sail. You'll find out what you like. I'll NOT recommend dinghy sailing for the non-adventurous to start on. Same with a beach cat. Dinghies and beach cats are fun as all get out, but they're both pretty wet and wild and not all that stable. If you worry about flipping over, a laser or lido is the last thing in the world you should look at.

#2 - If you don't really like to sail, don't sail. It's not for everybody.

#3 - If you like power, go power. Heck, some of the distance cruising boats now are power (like Dashew's FPBs)

It's just what I have seen on tv and online. To me, the mono dipping into the sea is similar to some guy practically laying down a bike while going around a curve. Will I do that? Heck no! Will I ride motorcycles? Absolutely, I have and I will again. Can't let what someone else does completely define my path in life.

I have never been in a mono on land or at sea, so that's all I have to go on. I don't have much choice in regards to the dinghy, that's what I'd have to learn on at first if I go with the school close to me.

I won't know until I try

[Stumble]

I would really suggest getting in touch with the guys at LLSC (Lake Lanier Sailing Club) in Flowery Branch. I have a couple of friends there, and it is a real hotbed of small catamarans, and really sailing in general. The trick is to get out on the water with a couple of new friends and have a fun day.

Small cat or small monohull doesn't matter much, it's just time on the water, and learning the ropes (all puns intended). Once you get some time on boats of any type the rest of your questions will either get answered organically or get clarified. A normal cruisers life is so far from the type of pictures that make the news, or really even the magazines it's hard to explain how divergent they are.

[Eggbah]

Originally Posted by Stumble

I would really suggest getting in touch with the guys at LLSC (Lake Lanier Sailing Club) in Flowery Branch. I have a couple of friends there, and it is a real hotbed of small catamarans, and really sailing in general. The trick is to get out on the water with a couple of new friends and have a fun day.

Small cat or small monohull doesn't matter much, it's just time on the water, and learning the ropes (all puns intended). Once you get some time on boats of any type the rest of your questions will either get answered organically or get clarified. A normal cruisers life is so far from the type of pictures that make the news, or really even the magazines it's hard to explain how divergent they are.

Thank you. I will have to check them out. I've been on cats before, both sail and power. The power one doesn't really count though. It was a beast and it was a ferry in Mexico. Didn't pay much attention to how the sail cat operated, I was busy enjoying a few "boat drinks."

[UNCIVILIZED]

You can also learn to sail, & whether you like sailing, by starting out on "small"/mid-sized boats. Like the Catalina 30 that a mate's had for his sailing school since 1990. Since on a 25'-30'ish boat with a fin keel, they're still fairly responsive. Enough so that you'll still get some immediate feedback from your actions. Though the experience will in no way rival that of something small. Which has pro's & con's. You won't ever capsize such a boat, but neither are they as thrilling (usually).

One other thing about boats that size though, is that you can get some ideas about what living aboard might be like. Since with some sailing schools you can rent such boats as part of taking classes from them. Including chartering it for a few days, so that you can sleep onboard at night while tied to the dock. As well as dining onboard, etc. And then as you get qualified to operate such boats, you can charter (rent) them in the more traditional sense. As well as (again) chartering them as part of taking more advanced classes, if you so desire.

Also, when it comes to power boats, like sailboats, there are a number of different styles. Many of them having loads of deck space. And in general, power boats have a lot more room inside than do sailboats of the same length. With the one exception being catamarans. Since both power, & sailing catamarans have a plethora of real estate.

There are also trawlers, sport fishers, recreational tugboats, & other categories. Quite a number of which are quite roomy. It all depends upon what the boat's optimized for. With any number of styles being quite capable of making longer voyages. Though usually voyages of a coastal nature, due to fuel capacities, & ultimate seaworthyness.


Have you spent any time looking at different types, & sizes of boats? As if you haven't, such would definitely be helpful in expanding your knowledge of boats, & what's available. And you can look at boats:
- in books, & magazines
- online, at websites which sell them. Such as yachtworld.com for example.
- attend boat shows. Both in the water, & on land. Which, given inexpensive air fares, going window shopping for boats makes for a nice vacation. Whether you fly somewhere warmer to attend a show as part of a vacation. Or even go to one overseas to attend a show/vacation/travel.

If memory serves, there's one coming up in Miami. San Diego. London. And lots of others. Most all of them in nice locales, where boating is part of the local lifestyle. But that have heaps of other things to do as well. Check on a few online, including what boats/boat manufactures will be there. So that you can get an idea of what's available... for viewing, as well as for sale. Plus there are quite a number of boat shows which have plenty of used boats for sale in addition to new ones. And at shows there are always plenty of boaters around that are more than happy to help you to broaden your horizons.

Honestly, most boaters, including those who currently own a boat, or boats, do as much (or more) browsing as those new to things nautical. Since it's a bit of a grown-up's toy store. So that coupled with a bit of travel it turns into quite a fun little adventure. And kids LUV them too, along with providing a different (exciting) perspective. My brother & I had some grand times when going to such when we were growing up (& plenty since then too).

PS: A few other resouces are things like (free, or dirt cheap) classes on boats, & or, sailing, from organizations like the US Power Squadron, USCG, US Sailing, local colleges, various boating schools. Such as the Port Townsend (WA) Wooden Boat School, & various educational entities associated with same. Quite honestly, there are too many to list. And once you start (playing with boats), it's a bit of an Alice in Wonderland adventure. With the end of the rabbit hole being nowhere in sight.

[Cap Erict3]

There are a lot of nice houseboats out there that might better suit your dreams. You can always rent a Hobie for the adrenaline rush.

[Juho]

1. Maybe a heavy "condomaran" with large hulls.
2. One extra cabin would be nice, but you could use the dining table too, as you do now.
3. There's plenty of storage space under the beds, but it may not be as easy to use as cupboards.
4. Yes and yes.
5. Lake Lanier was already mentioned. I'm sure you can find everything you need there.
6. You should try monohulls too. A boat with a heavy keel will not fall over. You might get used to them leaning on one side but not falling over. You can probably ride a bicycle. They are in principle unstable, unlike heavy keel monohull boats that will bounce back as soon as the wind stops or you lower the sails. Multihulls stay more upright, which can be a nice feature, but you might be afraid of flipping over in gusts (a fear that you should not have in monohulls (and not too much in heavy multihulls either)).

In a large monohull you might get privacy by walking to the other end. Boats with centre cockpit often have a spacious rather isolated bedroom in the aft.

If you start start learning now, maybe take your son with you whenever you can.

[Bleemus]

[smj]

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Bleemus

Attachment 138621

A one-off custom designed and built cat that was racing in bad conditions with a crew of disabled people.

Hardly a cruising cat in typical use.

Got any pictures of the 597 other boats that didn't finish the same race?