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Old 21-09-2018, 17:53   #31
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

I just wasted 90 seconds of my life trying to figure out what you are on about.
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Old 21-09-2018, 17:57   #32
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

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Originally Posted by Phil Mavis View Post
I think it's because we stopped spanking kids. Don't get me started.


I don’t spank my kids and they are turning out fine. Trick is teaching them empathy.

Problem is it’s hard to teach if you don’t have any yourself.
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Old 21-09-2018, 18:44   #33
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

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Originally Posted by boatpoker View Post
I just wasted 90 seconds of my life trying to figure out what you are on about.
Ignorance is bliss they say.
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Old 21-09-2018, 19:04   #34
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

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Ignorance is bliss they say.
I'll gladly maintain my bliss in the face of such condescending supercilious drivel. Is that redundant
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Old 21-09-2018, 21:48   #35
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

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I don’t spank my kids and they are turning out fine. Trick is teaching them empathy.

Problem is it’s hard to teach if you don’t have any yourself.
It should read "spank your kids" to be taken as a metaphor. Yeah some kids turned out just fine. The reality is we've applied the same new age child rearing approach to our society as a whole and we've got soft.

How this applies in the thread is from what I see the original poster saying (very wordy and I took more than 90 sec trying to figure out what it was lol) is that the majority of people just don't give a hoot about another boater's experience. The frequency of a disruptive anchorages is ever increasing. There used to be a code of respect amongst your neighbours. Now it's rare to find or we have to go somewhere where being respectful is actually legislated or very remote in location. Sad I think.

Got a ton of empathy. I absolutely love to let loose! I let loose much less as I get older. LOL. I usually "tone it down" or "take it inside" towards the 11 or midnight hour. I'd never expect anything less than an all night party some special holidays and such.

I don't see why this is a terrible thing to expect. I come to realize this will not change. I am what appears to be a minority. I will search for remoteness.

Again, I meant no disrespect.

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Old 21-09-2018, 21:52   #36
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Re: Responsibility of the indurty

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You got that completely wrong. I am not against having fun, drinks and sex on boats. Or for anyome to have the opportunity to be part of this awesome activity called sailing. Quite the opposite...

I was simply raising the question of cultural disrespect or general disrespect. The me me me attitude.

You can do all the above, as we did when I was 25, without being in other people's faces and leaving a trail of distruction along the way. Showing respect to what's not yours doesn't make you old-fashioned, arrogant or prude..
Common ivory tower response...we'll happily kill your economy, so we (not you) can decide to keep your culture pure (at least by our definition).

If that leaves you poor...at least your culture is pure and that makes us feel better about ourselves.

If an area chooses to chase these groups off, good for them but as outsiders, it's not our place to decide for them.

Reminds me of the old 1700's British nobility mindset where they considered the poor/working class to stupid to know what is good for them.
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Old 21-09-2018, 23:08   #37
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Re: Responsibility of the indurty

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Common ivory tower response...we'll happily kill your economy, so we (not you) can decide to keep your culture pure (at least by our definition).

If that leaves you poor...at least your culture is pure and that makes us feel better about ourselves.

If an area chooses to chase these groups off, good for them but as outsiders, it's not our place to decide for them.

Reminds me of the old 1700's British nobility mindset where they considered the poor/working class to stupid to know what is good for them.
?????

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Old 21-09-2018, 23:09   #38
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

I was over run by a Yacht Week group a bit less than two years ago, and it was awful. They came in at dusk, New Years Eve and proceeded to park about thirty boats in an anchorage that was already full, endangering everyone. In the interest of harmony, I approached the "staff" and asked that they be more considerate and met with a contemptuous rebuff. The staff, by the way, were clearly experienced boats and knew exactly where they were being unreasonable but did not care. There were about four staff, who supervised all of this, without regard for the boats already settled in. Only the fact that I am well established here (the BVI), know the laws and regulations (they were doing quite a few illegal things, including violating work permit regs) and also know the relevant enforcers, enabled me to tell them that I would call the Marine Police, the Shipping Registry , Immigration, the Labour Department, and the Tourist Board if they did not reposition more responsibly. Eventually, they saw I meant business and did so. They remained loud, inconsiderate, and obnoxious, but at least they were no longer positioned to damage boats that had been at anchor for days.



As I am in the industry, I know how much their business is appreciated, but as a boater I could certainly see the collateral damage. The Interlined Regatta, mentioned in a previous post, is also an annual regatta regarded with eagerness for their business, but horror at their behaviour. None of us go anywhere near!


These affairs are all very easily identified, at the outset, and yes, they give us all a bad name. The simple solution would be to require a "lead captain", be assigned by the charter company, for whom he or she wold work. This person, who would not drink, would have overall responsibility to ensure behaviour is safe and not too inconsiderate of others. They could have their fun and all, just not at the cost of other boaters, whose business is also valued.


I think the OP makes a very good point, but I can see that many of the comments are made without any experience of the phenomenon. If you have the misfortune to experience it, you will never forget it.


by the way, all of us are privileged who sail, no matter how humble and basic the boat.
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Old 22-09-2018, 01:56   #39
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

This thread is ridiculous. Every generation has felt that the one coming up behind them is lost and awful and pathetic - it’s fun to read quotes from the 1930s and 1890s and further back sounding just like what we (I’m Gen X, so I expect average age or maybe slightly younger than average here?) are saying about the millennials and Gen Z - the so-called snowflakes.

Inconsiderate tourists - tale as old as time. If people aren’t chartering boat’s and being ******** then they’ll be renting villas and being ********. Nothing to do with the industry or charter operators. And charter operators in particular do or should care about the local economies they operate in as those are where all their support workers and services come from, as well as the social licence to run their business.

If other boaters are being inconsiderate you’ve got several choices - move, insert ear plugs, or grab a six pack and join in. A frown is an upside down smile, lemonade not lemons, etc.
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Old 22-09-2018, 02:07   #40
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

At least someone actually read ALL of the article in detail. Refreshing.
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Old 22-09-2018, 02:49   #41
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

[QUOTE=Phil Mavis;2726431]It should read "spank your kids" to be taken as a metaphor. Yeah some kids turned out just fine. The reality is we've applied the same new age child rearing approach to our society as a whole and we've got soft.
This has to be the most stupid statement every written , you were clearly not beaten by your parents,
I was beaten black and blue and vowed never to hit my daughter, guess what with good values and an approach of teaching and empathy and a little patience they turn out just fine.
Those who willingly raise their hands especially to younger ones have lost their ability to be in control and use violence to sort out a problem , its the same problem with dog owners , lets beat them to understand
****ing morons this is why you cannot tolerate others having fun
And dont give me the ******** it never affected me crap , suicide in pale , stale middle age and older men is the highest in the world , divorce rates for said same category is the highest , the fastest mental health issues come from this category , yes there are many factors at play , but also getting beating by an authoritative figure doesn't help.
As to the OP your post is still nonsense worry about your own countries in social justices and leave other countries to sort out their own problems without your western liberal views butting in
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Old 22-09-2018, 03:03   #42
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Re: Responsibility of the industry

20 years ago when I was a newbie I hopped on as a crew in Figawi regatta. We came in 6th from the bottom out of about 300 boats but the huge afterparty is all I remember of that weekend.

I'm sure the Nantucket bluebloods did not appreciate 2000+ drunken partiers returning to their boats in the wee hours. But I believe this once a year inconvenience is far outweighed by the benefits the race gives to the local economy. Not just in terms of immediate $$ but long term benefits.
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