Perfect ? Ideal ? Visionary ? all rounder - catamaran

[Adam T]

Very Good Morning,

Making long story short (and honest):

Here in Libertist Yachts we would like to create another nice boat - good (perfect ? Ideal?) cruising / blue water / etc catamarans.

1. 8-9 meters pocket cruiser
2. Retired couple / family all rounder let’s say 12 meters one

With all due respect to big 3 we rather aim to seaworthy fast beauty boat, most of us can afford...

Rather sailing boat not a condo or wedding cake like.

If you do not mind - how in your opinion such “dream” boat should looks like / what consist of / what not ?

[boatman61]

9 Metre Cat..
Stand up galley in port hull with ample and sensible storage space for food and spares with possibly a small workbench across the fore section, 150L water tank below the floor.. possibly chart table aft.

Owners cabin to stbd with double berth aft, cupboards/drawers midships and toilet/shower forward.. again 150L water tank and with holding tank in toilet area below the floor.

Salon with bench seating and table as in Heavenly twins doubling as a guest double with table lowered.. pop top for in harbour/anchored to raise headroom from around 5ft 6" to 6ft 6".

good bridge deck clearance to minimise slamming.

[Adam T]

Thank you.
What payload should we expect ?

[valhalla360]

Really, in those size ranges, your options become pretty limiting. There simply are not a lot of options without going bigger.

If you look at the existing models, they give you a pretty good idea of what works.

A fast seaworthy boat in that size range will have to be a wharram type with minimal accommodations (maybe better hull design and sail plan).

Fast, cheap and good accommodations...as the old design saying goes...you can have any two.

[LeeV]

Personal Preferences:

Engines: Yanmars
Version: 3 cabin
2 heads
Interior: Light colored interior
Galley up
Rig: Sprit with furler
Layout: Large cockpit that blends to the salon on one level
Forward seating/step seating
Raised bridge; no fly bridge
All controls at helm
Elec winch for main

Good luck!

[CatNewBee]

For the size (LOA, BEAM, DRAFT) and salon, look at a Lagoon 400 owners version, interior: 2 aft cabins only, owners side with head and shower forward, guest side head & shower midships, front guest cabin as storage, sport bridge, hardtop bimini and lots of storage for toys.

All cruising options selectable like watermaker, A/C, electronics, generator, inverter, LFP batteries, Solar arc, appliances and residential fridge/freezer option, diving gear, bbq ...in mast furling main, oversize anchor and rode, bowsprit for code0, all lines to the helm.

Enclosures and mosquito-nets option

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Adam T

Thank you.
What payload should we expect ?

Around 1000kg and 1250kg ideally..
Iits a two person mainly.. sometimes four person boat so that should be plenty for comfortable cruising for the non condo sailor.
Should be achievable considering a Tiki 30 is 1000kg.

[Sand crab]

I think outboards would be the way to go considering the weight issues. Standing headroom everywhere would be a must, around 6' or 1.8 m should do. For inspiration look at the Seawind 1000, Maine Cat 30, Tom Cat 9.7 and the Geminis.

[Cpt Mark]

There is such a huge difference between a sea worthy boat (blue water) and a pocket coastal cruiser etc. I have an Island Packet Cat 35. Not fast by current catamaran standards but goes fine for a 35' cat. Has a Delta Pod which others are now recreating that minimizes hull slam , provides buoyancy and storage. Is unsinkable due to built in flotation below the water line. Has near standing headroom in both engine rooms and I'm 6'1". Has standing headroom everywhere inside. Cruising boat needs to have storage for cruising stuff not just toys. Spare parts, tools, places for cold and warm weather gear, food stores. Top deck needs to be flat, not rounded off like the SA cats which look great but provide a huge area to slip off of in bad weather. SS Rails all round, no lifelines. The ability to carry a dinghy on davits, on deck and have solar with all those weight considerations built into the design. Windows. Do not put in the sexy compound curved windows that always break eventually at a huge cost to replace. Flat panels. You want sexy curves? Do that with the fiberglass. mold and gelcoat. Side deck needs to wide enough to easily pass by and all equipment needs to be located in easily serviceable areas. My starting points.

[tiopirata]

For an economical, fast and seaworthy multihull today I recommend free standing rigs. Cheaper, quicker and near zero maintenance. No headsails, no stays, lighter boat, easier to handle, fast and no disadvantages
Cost is similar, maybe a little less, if boat is designed with this in mind.

[roland stockham]

You don't give any indication of either where you will be or what sort of sailing. There is no such thing as an ideal allrounder. What would be ideal for day hopping among the Caribbean island would be a disaster area in the pacific N/W or Europe (excluding Med). If you are looking to cross the pacific or go to New Zealand again another set of priorities. 'Expedition sailing' ie out of easy reach for marinas, chandlers and boat yards or possibly any sort of shops brings you another set of priorities. So think about what you want to do, what you will need and safety, that should tell you most of the priorities for your boat.

[nwdiver]

Chris White Mastfoil 41......or have him draw it up as a 36..... He has done small cats and tris.....

[valhalla360]

As you can see by some of the comments, you need to narrow down your design intent.

To make it a fast boat that is still seaworthy, you really need to be marketing towards minimalists (aka: a wharram style with minimal accommodation to keep it light).

If you start loading it up to actually make it comfortable, you wind up with your proverbial condo-cat...which will often still out run a similar size mono.

So what exactly is your intent and who are you trying to sell to? A design that fits your intent perfectly but has no buyers will flop.

[riki]

I think that in the range of 9/10 mt there is a lack of options, specially if we are talking about new boats. I can think only about the Ladyhawke33. I recently saw the FP Maldives, a 9,90 cat, and i think that it could be a very good size for who does not pretend to cross the world and want to own a boat enjoing it without going broke. Obviously it's a compromises size but still fun and not necessairly missing anything. Of course we all like the superluxurious new gen cats, but sometimes i feel like builders are progressively loosing their focus point in favor of weekenders and charterers.
10mt, fast, smart layout and right price i think can be the formula for success for a newcomer.

[boatman61]

Personally I've quite liked the Maldives, nice compact, rugged boat.. one I'd be happy to circumnavigate in.
Interior would need to be revamped however, not go for maximum berths and more for live aboard comforts for a max of four people.
At the right price point I think you might well find a good market.. not everyone has a minimum of half a million to toss at a floating Winnebago.