Opinion needed - Owner or Charter Version

[AST]

Greetings,
Typically (or at least I think) most cruiser would rather have an owner version. But if all things equal, which cat would you prefer
1- Two identical hulls (queen berth aft, full bath forward)
2- One hull for owner (queen berth aft, full bath forward). Second hull has smaller 2 berth aft and forward with a small head in between.
This is a layout for a 38-40 feet cat.
Option 1 make the 2 hulls pretty much identical. Option 2 is what you typically see in owner version.

Honestly I have been on cats with option 2 and if you want to entertain a guest family, I always thought I wished I had option 1. So they don't have to feel they are being squeezed. Now sure option 2 will let you have 3 different berthing, but how realistic to have 3 couples sharing a 38 foot boat and be comfortable.

Would love to hear you views on this.
Thanks,

[fxykty]

I assume you meant for option 1 to be two identical hulls with berth cabins aft and forward and shared head in between? At 40’ you can see double heads on both sides, so no head sharing at all.

The larger head in the owner hull is much preferred for live aboard and why would you want someone else sharing your hull? 2 cabins sharing a head and shower in the other hull is fine for friends or family - they’re on the boat for a vacation, not for life like you (perhaps, not sure of your situation). If they didn’t feel at least a little bit squeezed they might decide to stay too long!

In a charter situation you could fit 8 people in a 38/40 foot 4-cabin boat. But it would get tight after a couple of weeks. 6 in a 3-cabin boat would also get tight after a few weeks - salon and cockpit spaces aren’t that big on a boat that size. Even for friends or family anymore than 4 gets tight on a boat that size - think storage space for clothing, gear and food.

It’s said that resale value is higher for owner hull versions, especially if most layouts in the model are 4-cabin. Would that be a consideration?

[dougweibel]

I've never seen a "charter" version with one cabin on each side. Generally it is two+ cabins per side. If you are frequently going to have 8 people sleeping aboard, as often happens on charter, then a charter version makes sense. For non-charter ownership an owners version is a much nicer setup. Most owners would be either a couple or a family. In both cases the adults get the "owner's hull" with a larger cabin and head. Kids or guests sleep in the opposite hull with less room.

We live on a 44' cat and the idea of having a charter layout versus an owner's layout sounds like lunacy. Why would we cramp ourselves 100% of the time so guests have more room the low percentage of time they are aboard. As far as making sure everyone has a "bed" we have only once had more than 6 sleep aboard and in that case one slept on the cockpit settee.

[Statistical]

Neither of those are charter version. The charter version is each hull has two berths and shared head (or even worse two heads). It is the dumbest most cramped option but the one that lets the charter company sell it as an 8 berth model which will always be more than a 6 or 4 berth model.

Personally of the two options you proposed I would take 1. People always overestimate how many guests they will have and 80% to 99% of the time the extra berth just end up as poorly designed storage spaces.

[leecea]

Since we'll never own such a vessel it's a bit academic, but as grandparents we'd need the version with an owners hull then two cabins in the other hull.

[Tin Tin]

Originally Posted by AST

Greetings,
Typically (or at least I think) most cruiser would rather have an owner version. But if all things equal, which cat would you prefer
1- Two identical hulls (queen berth aft, full bath forward)
2- One hull for owner (queen berth aft, full bath forward). Second hull has smaller 2 berth aft and forward with a small head in between.
This is a layout for a 38-40 feet cat.
Option 1 make the 2 hulls pretty much identical. Option 2 is what you typically see in owner version.

Honestly I have been on cats with option 2 and if you want to entertain a guest family, I always thought I wished I had option 1. So they don't have to feel they are being squeezed. Now sure option 2 will let you have 3 different berthing, but how realistic to have 3 couples sharing a 38 foot boat and be comfortable.

Would love to hear you views on this.
Thanks,

I don't know too many cats that have 2 rear berths and two baths forward.

ie 2 cabin boat, there is the Mahe 36 Maestro Duo that has this layout and thats about it.


Realistically it depends on logistics and location.


If you have a boat on your own dock or marina and have an extended family (with maybe kids) that loves sailing that live close by and cruise local coastal waters then the more beds the better.


If you plan to sail to remote places that don't have an airport nearby, the chances anyone will show up can be slim, and they won't stay long if they do (in our experience anyway) and its usually only one couple, trying to get two couples to come at the same time is nigh impossible. Then the DUO layout would fine.


Then again age does play a role we have seen a Leopard 38 with 4 doubles and 2 singles with 10 young people aboard enjoying their 7 day charter at a very reasonable price per head. We once buddy boated with a Belize 43 that had 11 aboard.

[rabbi]

The Lagoon 39 was available with identical hulls, each with one berth aft and large head front

[AST]

To answer some of the questions:
I am considering building my own cat. Option 1 (two owner identical hulls) would be better for me since it will be easier to build and will suit my need better. However, if I decided to sell the boat in the future, would that be a plus or a minus?



Thanks,

[jim King]

For resale the owners version would be better. If you plan to put it into secondary charter the four cabin version would be best for charter income.

[rabbi]

For a DIY homebuilt I would not spend a minute about resale or charter value. I'd just build according to my needs.

At least in Europe resale value may well be around cost base for construction materials and gear. Or even less.

[AST]

Fair enough, but let's talk about chartering.

I organize chartering trips among family and friends and chartered many times (monos and cats). With cats, we are typically few couples. For a 38-40 feet cat, I have always found the cabins not to be equal. And also thought having more than 2 couples will get such a sized boat crowded pretty quick. I have always thought for 2 couples, the perfect chartering cat would be a twin owner hulls. But was never able to find such a charter.

I think there might be a market in the chartering business for twin owner hulls but doubt any chartering company will be brave enough to try it out. Thoughts?

At any rate, I think I will agree with Rabii and just build it according to my needs.

[Statistical]

Originally Posted by AST

Fair enough, but let's talk about chartering.

I organize chartering trips among family and friends and chartered many times (monos and cats). With cats, we are typically few couples. For a 38-40 feet cat, I have always found the cabins not to be equal. And also thought having more than 2 couples will get such a sized boat crowded pretty quick. I have always thought for 2 couples, the perfect chartering cat would be a twin owner hulls. But was never able to find such a charter.

I think there might be a market in the chartering business for twin owner hulls but doubt any chartering company will be brave enough to try it out. Thoughts?

At any rate, I think I will agree with Rabii and just build it according to my needs.

For charters all that matters is number of berths. People aren't staying long and looking for a low price. Putting 4 double berths allows you to charge more than putting in 2 or 3. It is that simple. It is why charter version is generally disliked by cruisers. The boat isn't any larger it is just chopped into tinier rooms. For monohulls that often means also reducing common areas, lazarette sizes, worse engine access, etc. All around it is a worse boat but it holds more people and that is the sole thing that matters for chartering.

No matter how long term design crippled it is a boat berths for 8 people will be able to charge more per week than one with 4 or 6.

I agree with the prior poster to build what you want. Custom built boat tends to have poor resale value anyways. Your boat is also unlikely to be able to compete with "charter version" low quality high berth count cats being pumped out like candy by the major manufacturers.

[Tupaia]

If the cat is for you to live on then concentrate on common areas not the number of berths. Berths are cheap so manufacturers charter companies and marketing love them. IMO even the owners version are not as practical as they could be if they were designed for a couple.

There are lots of ways to skin a cat if you are building for yourself. 44ft cat, 2 double berths. One hull comprises; double berth (aft), office workshop, head shower, laundry. The other hull comprises; guest double with on suite head (forward), galley, dinette (aft). This provides for a massive lounge living area on the bridge-deck. The guest berth is used occasionally and then for short periods usually 2 weeks max the dinette is used on a daily basis and provides a second separate living space.

[CaptainRivet]

Luxury the first that comes to my mind is Dean catamarans, their 440 or bigger ones should fit your bill.
Privilege and the newer catana 50ft should also fit well
Stay away from sunreef...tons of issues.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by AST

Fair enough, but let's talk about chartering.

I organize chartering trips among family and friends and chartered many times (monos and cats). With cats, we are typically few couples. For a 38-40 feet cat, I have always found the cabins not to be equal. And also thought having more than 2 couples will get such a sized boat crowded pretty quick. I have always thought for 2 couples, the perfect chartering cat would be a twin owner hulls. But was never able to find such a charter.

I think there might be a market in the chartering business for twin owner hulls but doubt any chartering company will be brave enough to try it out. Thoughts?

At any rate, I think I will agree with Rabii and just build it according to my needs.

The FP Mahe duo is only 35ft but exactly that, 2 owner hulls and works great for 2 couples.
BUT living on it i would prefer exactly the charter versions.
Why?
1) how much time do you really spend in these big bow heads per day ...2x10min is long...
2) did you use this bow heads on a long passage?
3) the opposite you have your stern cabin, the heads in the middle (much better for under way), if 2 heads one is seperate shower.
4) the extra bow cabin you can convert to a walk in hanging closet with a wash maschine. Close the door and mess is hidden. 2 couples do the same in the other hull with an additional fridge/freezer instead washing machine.
5) if not 2 couples the other guest hull stern cabin + 1 middle head, the 2nd middle head is your hanging wet lockera and also for all the cleaning stuff. The front bow cabin you convert to working room that also can contain extra freezer/fridge.
Much cleaner boat in the end, cheaper to purchase as an owner version.
I have a 40ft owners version and wished the 4 cabin one...this big bow head is so much wasted space you use for 20min daily...yes wifes like them unless they see a converted bow cabin to a hanging locker. often wifes/admiral has limited imagination in such things and needs to see that at least in fotos...ohh yes thats what you mean i like that more....just had that with friends who are also looking for a cat in 40-44ft.