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Old 01-01-2018, 10:30   #1051
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by myocean View Post
...The motor you mentioned comes without any transmission and works with more than 4000 rpm. Could a simple solution be a strong belt drive - I don't know.
...
Next is the inverter which needs to come with a decent vector control electronics - because only with this you will be able to really operate the motor with a good efficiency at different working points. By the way the encoder needed for this might suffer from a non-marine grade packaging and cause trouble very soon.
In no way I was trying to recommend that particular motor. Once more - it was just one example, of course, motor should fit particular application.
And yes, properly programmed controller is required in order to have correctly working EP.
Once again - weather-proof or waterproof housing (for anything, including electronics) with adequate cooling can be created separately, if comparable "marine-grade" device priced as premium class car.
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Old 01-01-2018, 10:45   #1052
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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The problem with this set up is the massive throttle response difference in close quarter maneuvering. It will take a lot of time and experience getting used to this system to operate it safely in close quarters because of this. Doable of course, but a serious learning curve.
Well, if it's doable by human, it's EXTREMELY EASILY doable by programmable controller.
Yes, good controller and smart programmer will be required. But at the end you can have two programs, one - EP the way it is, second - EP exactly mimics diesel behavior, lags, throttle response etc. Just like tuners are editing maps in ECU. So when moving both throttle levers you will get same response from both sides.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:41   #1053
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by ranchero76 View Post
... if comparable "marine-grade" device priced as premium class car.
For prices you may have heard about for whatever component by Torqeedo please note that this company is openly publishing prices including VAT (19% in Europe) and a including margin which the boat yard, which is installing the system, may charge (or not).
Whoever is interested in a high-power system by Torqeedo should contact the company and discuss the project in detail.
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Old 01-01-2018, 12:23   #1054
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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By preference I would rather two electric drives and two DC generators.
My preference would be 2 electric motors as well but only one generator.

As much as I love the idea of electric drives I do not think it would work for me on my boat. I am with 44 here and understand/share his experience of needing full power for too long a time ...

I do believe however that such a system would work on a boat built for that from scratch. And though the conversion does not seem to work on my boat I really believe it would work on many boats, especially occasional day sailors how have a berth in a marina.

The progress in batteries, electric motors, solar panels etc is fascinating and I have the feeling I will have an electric (hybrid) boat before I die.
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Old 01-01-2018, 14:25   #1055
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

Not taking sides in this argument, but something I have noticed: When talking about the ability to use full power in an emergency, all the proponents seem to assume that the emergency power needs happen when the battery bank is at full charge. Seems that this might not always be the case!

Jim
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Old 01-01-2018, 15:24   #1056
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Not taking sides in this argument, but something I have noticed: When talking about the ability to use full power in an emergency, all the proponents seem to assume that the emergency power needs happen when the battery bank is at full charge. Seems that this might not always be the case!

Jim
Do you cruise with empty diesel tanks?
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Old 01-01-2018, 15:47   #1057
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by rom View Post
My preference would be 2 electric motors as well but only one generator.

As much as I love the idea of electric drives I do not think it would work for me on my boat. I am with 44 here and understand/share his experience of needing full power for too long a time ...

I do believe however that such a system would work on a boat built for that from scratch. And though the conversion does not seem to work on my boat I really believe it would work on many boats, especially occasional day sailors how have a berth in a marina.

The progress in batteries, electric motors, solar panels etc is fascinating and I have the feeling I will have an electric (hybrid) boat before I die.
Rom,

To be clear I was only talking about if I had to have electric propulsion. At this point I would not choose an electric boat for anything but a day sailor. Battery power just isn't up to the task and I can't see any advantage in being dependent on a generator instead of a motor for a cruising boat.
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Old 01-01-2018, 15:48   #1058
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
Do you cruise with empty diesel tanks?
I can store more than an hour of diesel fuel onboard though, and if a storm is rolling in it takes me about 20 minutes at the fuel dock to fill up.
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Old 01-01-2018, 16:00   #1059
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
Do you cruise with empty diesel tanks?
Can carry 460L, but I've been known to allow my tanks to get down to 200L......that's about 50 hours running both of my 20kw diesels.

Will full batteries even last 1 hour?
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Old 01-01-2018, 16:12   #1060
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by DotDun View Post
Can carry 460L, but I've been known to allow my tanks to get down to 200L......that's about 50 hours running both of my 20kw diesels.

Will full batteries even last 1 hour?
Well, there you go then. You choose to not sit around with empty tanks waiting for a big storm to arrive.

Why should it be any different for EP? Battery charging is important, and anyone seriously investigating EP would realise that, hence the DC genset.

And yes, an "hour of power" or thereabouts is an accepted principle of planning an EP cruiser.
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Old 01-01-2018, 16:57   #1061
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
Well, there you go then. You choose to not sit around with empty tanks waiting for a big storm to arrive.

Why should it be any different for EP? Battery charging is important, and anyone seriously investigating EP would realise that, hence the DC genset.

And yes, an "hour of power" or thereabouts is an accepted principle of planning an EP cruiser.
OK, sorry, I misunderstood. I thought your DC genset was only ~1/3 the size of your propulsion.
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Old 01-01-2018, 17:41   #1062
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by DotDun View Post
OK, sorry, I misunderstood. I thought your DC genset was only ~1/3 the size of your propulsion.
Our DC genset is half of our full power output from both motors, for continuous motoring at 6.5 knots when becalmed, and for battery charging when solar is ineffective.

However with the Servoprop now available, we'll be able to fully charge our entire bank (from empty) after a 2 to 3 hour sail at 8 to 10 knots.

For EP, battery charging redundancy is nice to have.
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Old 01-01-2018, 18:22   #1063
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
Our DC genset is half of our full power output from both motors, for continuous motoring at 6.5 knots when becalmed, and for battery charging when solar is ineffective.

However with the Servoprop now available, we'll be able to fully charge our entire bank (from empty) after a 2 to 3 hour sail at 8 to 10 knots.

For EP, battery charging redundancy is nice to have.
Are you also using Lifpo batteries? Because FLA won't charge that fast no matter how much current you can toss at them. And if not LifePo have you done the downrating to see how you batteries look in light of Peukert's Law?
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Old 01-01-2018, 18:23   #1064
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
Our DC genset is half of our full power output from both motors, for continuous motoring at 6.5 knots when becalmed, and for battery charging when solar is ineffective.

However with the Servoprop now available, we'll be able to fully charge our entire bank (from empty) after a 2 to 3 hour sail at 8 to 10 knots.

For EP, battery charging redundancy is nice to have.
OK, so you will not be able to motor into 40kts once the batteries are down. Half power is not enough to climb steep waves. You will be safer to stay at anchor.
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Old 01-01-2018, 18:36   #1065
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Re: Oceanvolt Hybrid Motor

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Originally Posted by Stumble View Post
Are you also using Lifpo batteries? Because FLA won't charge that fast no matter how much current you can toss at them. And if not LifePo have you done the downrating to see how you batteries look in light of peukert's Law?

Yep, Valence batts.
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