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Old 30-10-2020, 09:06   #1
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Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Seriously considering these 2 boats to take Myself, wife and 2 small kids and possibly 1 teenager around the world for a few years 2-5 or more.

Leopard is around 1-1.2m to outfit probably. Privilege 510 is 1.4-1.6m

Price NOT being a consideration although it is to me what boat would you feel would be best.

Sailing Operation or Ease of sailing with 2 people ?
Bad Weather Sailing LOADED ?
Warranty Work or Warranty Network Worldwide ?
Fit and Finish and Overall Construction Materials ?
What boat will fair better over time ?

Thankyou for all your help
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Old 30-10-2020, 16:28   #2
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

You may want to go watch SV Happy Together on youtube. They bought and outfitted a Leopard 50 and made numerous videos about the options, etc.

Both looks like great boats. What a problem to have
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Old 30-10-2020, 17:43   #3
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Whats your timing?

Weve ordered a new FP51 but wont see it till 2023.

Since the two you listed are either a sport helm or a bulkhead helm the new 51 will be in the same family. Not a lot of info to go on yet but there is some.

https://www.catamarans-fountaine-paj...amaran-new-51/
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Old 31-10-2020, 01:37   #4
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Between the Leopard and the P510 I would take the 510. It's more of a custom boat (they will change just about anything for you) and the build and finish are very very good. It's a heavy cat but a real long distance cruiser.
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Old 31-10-2020, 09:28   #5
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

I am a Leopard 45 owner and Robertson and Caine offered me warranty services anywhere I've been and I've been sailing from Cape Town to the Black Sea during the warranty period. The Leopard 50 is even lighter than the Leopard 45 because it is using the foam core technology so, it is also very fast. As previously mentioned, watch Happy Together where they sail with full main and Genoa in 42kts of wind in Cape Town. Awesome boat!
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Old 31-10-2020, 11:39   #6
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike427 View Post
Seriously considering these 2 boats to take Myself, wife and 2 small kids and possibly 1 teenager around the world for a few years 2-5 or more.

Leopard is around 1-1.2m to outfit probably. Privilege 510 is 1.4-1.6m

Price NOT being a consideration although it is to me what boat would you feel would be best.

Sailing Operation or Ease of sailing with 2 people ?
Bad Weather Sailing LOADED ?
Warranty Work or Warranty Network Worldwide ?
Fit and Finish and Overall Construction Materials ?
What boat will fair better over time ?

Thankyou for all your help
Are these both new boats? The Privileges tend to be made to order while the Leopards are more production oriented although probably the best of that ilk.

If it's a new build, why these two versus an Outremer, St Francis or Knysna? The Knysna 50SE comes in at about a million dollars well equipped and customizable to your tastes. The boats I've mentioned are considered to be very capable open ocean sailors built exclusively by their own yards
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Old 31-10-2020, 12:58   #7
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

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Originally Posted by joelhemington View Post
Are these both new boats? The Privileges tend to be made to order while the Leopards are more production oriented although probably the best of that ilk.

If it's a new build, why these two versus an Outremer, St Francis or Knysna? The Knysna 50SE comes in at about a million dollars well equipped and customizable to your tastes. The boats I've mentioned are considered to be very capable open ocean sailors built exclusively by their own yards
I will take a look at the 50SE. I really dont need a fast boat sail wise. I need space and comfort with a bit of speed.

Thankyou so much for a few options
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Old 31-10-2020, 13:18   #8
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

The only new thing in Privilege 510 is the name. It is not a new boat and pretty much the same (or evolved) boat as the Series 5 and 515. That's a good thing since it is well tested and probably improved with experience. My impression is that it is very well built with a lot of attention to details, customization, and systems.
The Leopard 50 is a huge(!) boat but the possibility to fully fit it to full cruising configuration during the production is limited and requires dealing with aftermarket installers after the boat was delivered. This requires additional time, costs, and knowledge. The aftermarket items are not warranted by Leopard. The L50 is heavier than the Privilege but has more volume. I am not sure about the performance of the L50 vs the P510 since I only sailed the L50 but I would cautiously bet on the P510 performance.
The St. Francis and Knysna are smaller cruisers where the SF has better performance and marine design. The Knysna is probably more Aesthetic.
Quality-wise the P510 is certainly in a superior league from the Leopard 50 and Knysna 500.
As for support, in my experience, I saw a brand new L50 which managed to lose its keels and had osmosis after 3 months. This was very sad quality-wise but the factory agreed with relatively small delays to build a brand new L50 and replace the problematic boat. I also heard from other leopard owners, that they manage to get support almost anywhere. None of the smaller South African manufacturers can or will replace your boat and in most cases, you will be left on your own to deal with your new boat problems as well with the OEMs. So good or bad support, I don't believe that any new boat owner would like to go into such miseries.
If money is not an issue I would certainly choose the Privilege over the L50.
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Old 31-10-2020, 13:27   #9
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

I am a big Leopard fan, owned a 44 and just got a new 40, and the 50 would be my dream cruise boat. However, have a look at the Balance catamarans. Really nice, I have been to the St Francis factory, and they build great boats. Epoxy, light, fast, customizable!
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Old 31-10-2020, 14:09   #10
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Have you looked at the Xquisite X5 50? From the reviews I have read it seems to be an incredible boat with exceptional technical & warranty support. It is also built in South Africa. Seawind is also bringing out a new Cat' but I think it is 45'. Check out YouTube sailing channel "Cruising Off Duty" he has some good reviews on the Xquisite X5. He also sailed an X5 from Cape Town to the Carribean with a full report. Good luck in your search.
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Old 31-10-2020, 14:56   #11
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

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Originally Posted by Mike427 View Post
I will take a look at the 50SE. I really don’t need a fast boat sail wise. I need space and comfort with a bit of speed.

Thankyou so much for a few options
If you're building a boat, I'd take a hard look at incorporating Titanium chain plates. For the short term, the stainless will be just fine but since this boat will probably last 50 years or more, subsequent owners would really appreciate the Titanium. It's fairly painless to add them upfront but a bear to do later.

Speed is a crucial part of the safety factor for Cats. The idea is to outrun the weather rather than being caught in it. A good 50' Cat will do 10 knots without too much sweat. Given that you typically have a three day weather window, you can be well clear of any storm as long as you're paying attention and don't load you boat up with hot tubs

Be careful about being swayed by the European boats just because they cost more. Most of the additional cost is due to the cost of labor and not by any superior building techniques.
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Old 31-10-2020, 16:50   #12
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Higher labor plus you are paying in Euros rather than dollars (a 12% increase right there)
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Old 31-10-2020, 19:16   #13
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

As the OP doubless knows - these boats are more similar than they are different. Both about 25 ton loaded for cruising. Neither has daggerboards. I don't know much about the Privilege other than it has a fine reputation. I know the Leopard a good bit better.

The Leopard has a happy and passionate owner base who regularly buy a 2nd and 3rd Leopard. Happy Together is the owners' 2nd Leapord. This says a lot about quality and after sale support. It's unusual to see someone buy twice from the same builder.

The Leopard low price is partly due to the limited range of options (lower labor rates in South Africa are a bigger reason). But private customers (e.g. non-charter) all customize their boats post delivery. In the US, Just Cats is right next door to the Leapord offices. They do very fine work. If you want to re-arrange the interior, just ask. By the time an owner finishes with Just Cats I suspect the gap between the Leopard price and and Privilege price has narrowed considerably.

When you start lifting hatches on the Leopard you find a very tough and sound boat. An example is that the steering system is overbuilt -- and it is a traditional chain and wire instead of the hydraulic steering you find in most cruising cats (not sure what the Privilege has). There is no slop in the Leopard steering. Feels like a racing boat.

And as mentioned, Leopard has a very strong worldwide warranty program. There are so many Leopards built that you can find people who know how to fix them just about everywhere - including every Moorings base (Leapord, Moorings, and Sunsail are all owned by the same parent).

While the OP didn't ask, I feel the need to raise a few concerns:

a) While both of these boats can circumnavigate safely you should pick your season and weather. While many Leopards are still delivered on their own bottoms they (and the Privilege) spend much more time hopping around the Caribbean not crossing the North Atlantic in winter.

b) I had a good friend who bought a 55ft cat with the intention of taking his family sailing for a few years. The whole plan fell apart when his 6 year old daughter had a serious seasickness problem. The whole plan fell apart.

c) What size boat does the OP have now? It is becoming very hard to get insurance for a big cat unless you can point to years of experience owning a similar size boat. They frequently will require a captain aboard.
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Old 31-10-2020, 21:40   #14
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

Quote:
Originally Posted by joelhemington View Post
If you're building a boat, I'd take a hard look at incorporating Titanium chain plates. For the short term, the stainless will be just fine but since this boat will probably last 50 years or more, subsequent owners would really appreciate the Titanium. It's fairly painless to add them upfront but a bear to do later.

Speed is a crucial part of the safety factor for Cats. The idea is to outrun the weather rather than being caught in it. A good 50' Cat will do 10 knots without too much sweat. Given that you typically have a three day weather window, you can be well clear of any storm as long as you're paying attention and don't load you boat up with hot tubs

Be careful about being swayed by the European boats just because they cost more. Most of the additional cost is due to the cost of labor and not by any superior building techniques.

Excellent points!!!
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Old 01-11-2020, 00:49   #15
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Re: Leopard 50 OR Privilege 510

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Originally Posted by joelhemington View Post
If you're building a boat, I'd take a hard look at incorporating Titanium chain plates. For the short term, the stainless will be just fine but since this boat will probably last 50 years or more, subsequent owners would really appreciate the Titanium. It's fairly painless to add them upfront but a bear to do later.

Composite chain plates are the way to go they are part of the structure and spread the loads much better.


I believe Kelsall pioneered these in self builds.
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