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Old 11-07-2021, 21:34   #1
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Lagoon cats now on discount...

So, Parlay went full [...].

I can't imagine lagoon 45s catching a bid within 65% of the pre covid level.

Question is: now that we know where to look and what to look for and know the hell that has to be endured to fix the design flaw, would any of us accept a 35% discount?

I guess we will find out when yachtworld, et. al. start listing fresh inventory again in another 8 months.
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Old 11-07-2021, 22:24   #2
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

No doubt the 450 reputation will be impacted and Lagoon should be addressing it to stop the community speculating, causing more damage. Not sure it will do anything to the rest of the market outside the 450, but will be a negotiating point for owners looking for 450’s.
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Old 11-07-2021, 23:16   #3
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

I'm genuinely curious how many 45s have had their rigs excessively tightened as the bulkheads slowly buckled in non-stress marina dock situations.
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Old 12-07-2021, 07:46   #4
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

I watched it. Gotta say I think he’s right. Beneteau needs to fix this. These boats cost seventeen arms and legs and are expected to be of a certain base quality, for safety if nothing else, but also because it’s a million friggin bucks! Sorry guys, but you’re gonna have to eat it, hard. Or suffer the consequence of being known as a **** quality company that doesn’t stand behind their **** product. If I were them I’d be racing to contact every owner, both original and later owners, and pledge to take care of them at least mostly. Then again, these boats do have an expected life span, so how long is the expected life of a new cruising cat?
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Old 12-07-2021, 08:01   #5
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

Myself, this is a deal breaker of the worst sort. I mean come on, this is structural, not cosmetic or function and if the boats super structure fails...



My question then is, what other models have the same design flaw?
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Old 12-07-2021, 08:30   #6
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

I’m in the market and the 450 has been completely crossed off my list. It also makes me wary of Lagoons in general after seeing how everything is glued together. I’m likely not alone.
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Old 12-07-2021, 08:37   #7
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

Quote:
Originally Posted by keelsidedown View Post
I'm genuinely curious how many 45s have had their rigs excessively tightened as the bulkheads slowly buckled in non-stress marina dock situations.
Classic chicken egg

Were rigs excessively tightened resulting in cracked bulkheads? Or

Were bulkheads cracking thus requiring additional tightening?

I think we know the answer is b, but apparently Ben is pursuing a

Of course they will eventually lose because there aren't any published waranty specs mandating certain tensions

But it might give execs a chance to get out. Of course I think investors and creditors will go after officers and directors anyway, so there's probably no way out

If you want to see real time market effect, just search YW sailboats by brand. Ben, Jen and Goon dwarf all others far in excess of market share

Since the brokers obviously know the score, they will stop wasting their time on stale inventory. So the add on impact will be magnified

Honestly, Ben will probably have to go BK with the assets sold off - sans these monstrous liabilities.
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Old 12-07-2021, 08:42   #8
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Sbpoint & Snerf.
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Old 12-07-2021, 08:43   #9
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

I meant to say jeanneau not beneteau
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Old 12-07-2021, 08:46   #10
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

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I meant to say jeanneau not beneteau


Itís all Groupe Beneteau anyway
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Old 12-07-2021, 09:03   #11
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

Are Lagoon 450's CE category A classification.
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Old 12-07-2021, 09:13   #12
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

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Itís all Groupe Beneteau anyway
Ah okay thx.

So, how much WOULD this cost parent company if they decided to buck-up and pay the bulk of upgrade $ for all examples affected? Of course thatís what they are looking at, cost of upgrade vs damages to brand name if nothing done.
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Old 12-07-2021, 10:00   #13
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

The L450 was on our short list before we purchased our FP. I must admit that I am somewhat relieved that we didn't buy one now.

No doubt this will effect resale of L450's. I suspect that Lagoon wants to avoid anything that could possibly be interpreted as assuming responsibility for these failures. The L450 has been out of production for a while now, and I suspect that as far as Lagoon is concerned their financial responsibility has ended, and they certainly could not care less about diminished resale value that existing owners will have to deal with.

As I have learned from dealing with at least one French boat manufacturer, and their dealers is that they are mostly only worried about the next sale. After sales service has been the weakest part of their business model.
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Old 12-07-2021, 10:12   #14
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV WELDER View Post
Ah okay thx.

So, how much WOULD this cost parent company if they decided to buck-up and pay the bulk of upgrade $ for all examples affected? Of course thatís what they are looking at, cost of upgrade vs damages to brand name if nothing done.
Well if they made 1000 of these 450's and just half have this issue, you're talking between $25-30 million to fix (assuming it can be fixed for just $50k per boat)
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Old 12-07-2021, 10:27   #15
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Re: Lagoon cats now on discount...

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Well if they made 1000 of these 450's and just half have this issue, you're talking between $25-30 million to fix (assuming it can be fixed for just $50k per boat)
And why Lagoon to repair and pay this when lagoon pay the dealer 194 million € (to this 1000 lagoon 450) to maintain,repair,pay all warranty claim. also in contract say dealer must keep this amount in reserve for warranty by local law needs. We charter receive 15-20% discount for No warranty this is almost 150000 € per 1 Lagoon 450
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