Irma and the local boat market

[SDChristian]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Where does one find these auctions? The local yards?

Agreed. Where can said auctions be found?

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Touch wood there brother. A statement like that just tempts fate!

Most people buy boats to use them at least once in a while. A boat is a hole in the water into which you throw vast quantities of time, money, and effort. You must enjoy that more than sailing I guess. 24/7/365 in a slip?

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by SDChristian

Agreed. Where can said auctions be found?

➥ Used Yacht and Boat Auction Inventory | National Liquidators

➥ https://www.salvageboatsauction.com/quick_pick/Boat

[littleships]

Originally Posted by SDChristian

I would like to tiptoe into this thread as this storm is a true destroyer of dreams and I feel horrible for those dealing with it (my sister lives in PR). But once all is said and done, what impact will this storm have on the boat market in its area? I can't even comprehend, given so many variables, be they real life scarcity and the following insurance issues.

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[Falbala60]

On the effect of Irma on the boat market, this is my recent experience.
We are looking for a catamaran in the 38-42 range, and we are seriously shopping. The hurricane will not discourage us, because I think the people with their own sloop or catamaran not chartering should take care to the place and how their loved craft is stored.

Following Irma, I called the largest insurance broker in my town. They are nearly spepcialilzed in boat insurance. I wanted to have a budget price for a Lagoon 42 sailing in Carribean during Dec to May and dry-storage from June to Nov in "deep south Caribbean" ... St-Vincent to Guyana or Venezuela... as an exemple.

They told me that NO INSURANCE COMPANY will make any new quote in this area until next January until THIS HORRIBLE SEASON will be "closed". Not only on the cost but also on the allowed region, period of navigation and storage conditions.

So, if you want to buy NOW you will have no idea of the insurance conditions when going afloat, or if you need some financing NO BANK will follow you if you can't insure her.

So I think this Irma will freeze many "sailboat dream" for a moment, only those with big cash and able to take this risk will act.

If sellers raise their price due of temporary shortage of used sailboat... chances they will stay with her for a moment.

[TheNomadTrip]

Glad someone tastefully started this thread. I've been wondering myself.

My position is different than most I suspect - in that I have a liveaboard Lagoon 380 in the Caribe - San Blas, Panama to be exact. She's fine and we enjoy all the benefits of the Caribe without all the drawbacks here - no bars full of American Expats, no hurricanes - but clear, warm bluewater, plentiful lobster and conch for lunch, with plenty of coral and some interesting indigenous culture.

But this hurricane has me eyeing the market again - thinking I could trade up. Now that I know the people and places and things I need to for major refits, I can put a boat back together just the way I want it (and probably end up adding 5-10 foot of waterline over my Lagoon 380).

And I also agree that owning big is only for charter businesses and live-aboards. Rent big, buy small. But I live aboard and we sometimes host a charter onboard to replenish the cruising kitty.

I'm of the opinion that if one were serious about the salvage market, they would get into these disaster zones quite quickly. I think you need to be there to see what you're getting into and take advantage of 'on-the-spot' deals. Of course, that presents myriad problems in itself.

[Fence Man]

Originally Posted by rickdamico

My boat sits comfy in it's slip, 24/7/365 days a year, no worries.

Kinda defeats the purpose of a sailboat, eh?

[cliffdykes]

Originally Posted by TheNomadTrip

Glad someone tastefully started this thread.
.

They didn't. There is no tasteful way to start this thread whilst people are still dying because of IRMA (and wait until she hits Florida).

What would be great IMHO is if all these "how can I take advantage of other people's misery" threads ceased at least until the storm has run its course.

Cliff

[TheNomadTrip]

Originally Posted by cliffdykes

They didn't. There is no tasteful way to start this thread whilst people are still dying because of IRMA (and wait until she hits Florida).

What would be great IMHO is if all these "how can I take advantage of other people's misery" threads ceased at least until the storm has run its course.

Cliff

Point taken, but just because the timing offends you - doesn't mean what's being discussed isn't valid.

Nobody prayed these storms into existence for the opportunity to purchase a boat below-cost. In boats, it is often the case that the only way you get a deal is through the end of someone else's dream. Though I admit it's not pretty, it's nearly a fact.

Guess I'll just put my thoughts on hold. Surely that'll make a difference in the damage.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by TheNomadTrip

Glad someone tastefully started this thread. I've been wondering myself.

My position is different than most I suspect - in that I have a liveaboard Lagoon 380 in the Caribe - San Blas, Panama to be exact. She's fine and we enjoy all the benefits of the Caribe without all the drawbacks here - no bars full of American Expats, no hurricanes - but clear, warm bluewater, plentiful lobster and conch for lunch, with plenty of coral and some interesting indigenous culture.

But this hurricane has me eyeing the market again - thinking I could trade up. Now that I know the people and places and things I need to for major refits, I can put a boat back together just the way I want it (and probably end up adding 5-10 foot of waterline over my Lagoon 380).

And I also agree that owning big is only for charter businesses and live-aboards. Rent big, buy small. But I live aboard and we sometimes host a charter onboard to replenish the cruising kitty.

I'm of the opinion that if one were serious about the salvage market, they would get into these disaster zones quite quickly. I think you need to be there to see what you're getting into and take advantage of 'on-the-spot' deals. Of course, that presents myriad problems in itself.

I think it will actually be quite complicated, and whatever salvage anyone buys will likely have to be relocated for refit. Most boats won't be sea ready, and there will be no services to do the work or supply the parts for quite some time. Unless you can relocate the yacht yourself, it likely isn't going to happen any time soon either as shipping and freight suppliers will be extremely busy with other efforts. That might change the equation for any water damage repairs or salvage that need to be done in a fairly timely fashion.

Just thinking out loud.

**I don't think this is a "take advantage of anyone's misery" thread... but more of a life goes on, what next thread. It doesn't detract from the sympathy and sorrow we feel for those affected. These are just boats, not humans. Humans are suffering regardless of what boats we discuss, and that's a whole other topic unto itself. Personally, I am waiting for the relief efforts to start, and will contribute as I can to help how I can. Separate issues. Both valid. The humanitarian requirements and clean up efforts are going to be massive.

[breweraz]

A lot of dreams may be changing as a hard dose of reality hits.

A lot of weekends warriors will look for other ways to entertain themselves especially considering availability of dock space, higher cost for everything due to demands outstripping supplies and just basic fear.

On the other side I expect there will be a lot of demand for NON project boats as replacements, once the insurance world gets settled.

Buyer beware as I expect a lot of patched up structurally damaged boats will rule the day as opposed to "minor repairs" as ad will say.

If ones takes on a project I do not expect it will be CATS or non trailerable boats as there will be limited places to get the work done even if DIY.

So if you have a boat where to go will be a big issue as well. There are islands that have been spared but still limited. A quick day trip from FL to a devastated location with limited if any resources seems less likely for some time.

There are great charters in other markets but a lot of factors of language, distance and logistics complicate those as well.

I have no idea how all this balance things out but the biggest issue to me is how many dreams being lived, being planned for and just in dream stage are lost or are they going to fight through.

Sailing has not changed. This is has been and will always a part of the reality of life on the on the ocean. The lure of the sea has survived through time, through many disasters and I am sure it will survive this one as well.

God bless to all impacted...tomorrow will come....it will be different...its up to you if it will be better or worst.

TBAZ

[Falbala60]

This a SAILORS FORUM !!!

[belizesailor]

There is an upside to everything. For example, if you own a boat that happens to survive then selling it, maybe even at a premium, will be much easier.

Case in point, years ago a very unexpected Tropical Storm hit the Bradenton FL area, bringing 64 knot winds into otherwise very protected areas....wreaking mass carnage in a local marina. My previous boat just happened to be in an excellent location....and was up for sale. Suddenly there were lots of new boat buyers in the market with insurance payout cash. Sold my boat very quickly and at small premium.

[TheNomadTrip]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

There is an upside to everything. For example, if you own a boat that happens to survive then selling it, maybe even at a premium, will be much easier.

Case in point, years ago a very unexpected Tropical Storm hit the Bradenton FL area, bringing 64 knot winds into otherwise very protected areas....wreaking mass carnage in a local marina. My previous boat just happened to be in an excellent location....and was up for sale. Suddenly there were lots of new boat buyers in the market with insurance payout cash. Sold my boat very quickly and at small premium.

This is very much what I expect to happen. Boats in good working order, well maintained, will command a premium as the inventory is dramatically reduced.

That said, I have noticed a trend - even just in this thread - that those in positions to sell boats are predicting a slight increase in the value of their sale and those looking to buy are on the other side of the fence. Guess we'll see

[bobnlesley]

Originally Posted by ranchero76

From my point of view, boat market will be down big time ...- Charter companies will try to repair what's repairable (not total loss), they will have unlimited parts supply from total loss boats. Replacements for total loss boats most likely will be purchased after insurance settlements - not in near future...

We were discussing the subject in the bar just a few nights ago and the conclusion on this point at least was the exact opposite: The Charter Companies need boats out on the water to stay in business and the Caribbean, particularly BVIs fleets are a major part of the world-wide business. We agreed with your point that the from a fleet of say 50 similar, but smashed-up catamarans, you can perhaps assemble 20-30 from the total relatively quickly, the big/international operators like Moorings could also get a bunch extra sailed/shipped across from their Mediterranean fleets to fill the gap short-term, perhaps even sailing them back again next spring as it'll take the major manufacturers a good while to catch-up ont the increased demand (I suspect their share values have jumped?). But not so the smaller, perhaps single-base operators; they'll need replacement boats and will amost certainly be further down on the manufacturers list of 'important' customers than Moorings and the like, so as a result I would suspect that they're already looking around for relatively new/well maintained replacements on the secondhand market; that ought to push prices up, or at least offset the price-falls that you're predicting, though admittedly, only for a small proportion of owners.