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26-05-2021, 16:00
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#406
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Brisbane Australia
Boat: Schionning Waterline 1480
Posts: 1,987
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsenelupiga
you are forgetting about bridgedeck clearance loss. If as you say loads 3 T then we see 30-40 cm drop in clearance. That is outright dangerous. I had opportunity seeing lighter cats loaded in these 3-4 m beam seas and i can assure you it iwas not pretty. Confirmed by crews. As i am polite will not repeat their werds.
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Not sure about the math. I'm fairly skinny (haha, not myself... I mean my boat :-) ) around 15:1 hull ratio and 1m wide at its widest, about 0.4m wide at the stern, and 0.0 at the bow. We are 7.25t for a couple of nights away (2.25t above bare weight and 0.25t over suggested target weight) and draw 0.42m. So 7.25t draws 42cm and don't forget the first cm might only create 5kg of displacement increasing with depth to the last cm which maybe 230kg of buoyancy. From its current waterline it will only increase buoyancy further with depth.
I can't think what I'd put on to add up to 5.25t payload but I would expect to move the waterline no more than about 12cm from where it is now with an additional 3t. What do people take to add up to 5t or more ?
I would guesstimate my weight if I were to do a crossing at 7.5 to 7.75t or about 2cm from where I am now.
__________________
Regards
Dave
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26-05-2021, 16:45
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#407
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Annapolis MD
Boat: Building a Max Cruise 44 hybrid electric cat
Posts: 3,287
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Straight from Bob Oram on Feb 17 2020:
44C B/L ratio = 11.5 @ 5200kgs disp @ 13.5mts LOA. Payload = 1800 - 2200kgs
So now you don't need to guess anymore on these numbers.
Matt
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26-05-2021, 16:57
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#408
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,398
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Johnson
Straight from Bob Oram on Feb 17 2020:
44C B/L ratio = 11.5 @ 5200kgs disp @ 13.5mts LOA. Payload = 1800 - 2200kgs
So now you don't need to guess anymore on these numbers.
Matt
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Thanks, saved me digging out the plans.
So were looking at an immersion rate of around 220 kg/cm.
So for every tonne, an L400 will sink about 40mm, and we'll sink about 45. The difference is devastating!
__________________
"You CANNOT be serious!"
John McEnroe
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26-05-2021, 17:04
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#409
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,398
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate
Going bankrupt as a boat builder is not specifically related to poor construction. More often is is quite the opposite, ie, putting too much time and money into the construction and failing to make a profit in the market place. Other times it is due to poor management, labor difficulties or government intervention (ie luxury tax on yachts).
So, I'll add my voice: what builders have worse construction records than Lagoon... you say you've seen plenty, so name them and point out their shortcomings.
Jim
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People often seem to equate success with quality. Obviously they think MacDonalds is the best quality food on earth, and Coca cola the best drink!
__________________
"You CANNOT be serious!"
John McEnroe
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27-05-2021, 02:45
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#410
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: forest city
Boat: no boat any more
Posts: 2,514
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_S
Not sure about the math. I'm fairly skinny (haha, not myself... I mean my boat :-) ) around 15:1 hull ratio and 1m wide at its widest, about 0.4m wide at the stern, and 0.0 at the bow. We are 7.25t for a couple of nights away (2.25t above bare weight and 0.25t over suggested target weight) and draw 0.42m. So 7.25t draws 42cm and don't forget the first cm might only create 5kg of displacement increasing with depth to the last cm which maybe 230kg of buoyancy. From its current waterline it will only increase buoyancy further with depth.
I can't think what I'd put on to add up to 5.25t payload but I would expect to move the waterline no more than about 12cm from where it is now with an additional 3t. What do people take to add up to 5t or more ?
I would guesstimate my weight if I were to do a crossing at 7.5 to 7.75t or about 2cm from where I am now.
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...absolutely gorgeous, your boat!!!
__________________
...not all who wander are lost!
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27-05-2021, 17:02
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#411
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Port Aransas, Texas
Boat: 2019 Seawind 1160 Lite
Posts: 2,126
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by double u
...absolutely gorgeous, your boat!!!
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I agree. Absolutely stunning. And I bet she sails really well.
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27-05-2021, 18:08
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#412
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Sydney Australia
Boat: Fisher pilothouse sloop 32'
Posts: 3,480
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by double u
...absolutely gorgeous, your boat!!!
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Dave, I concur, oozes style.
__________________
Rob aka Uncle Bob Sydney Australia.
Life is 10% the cards you are dealt, 90% how you play em
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27-05-2021, 18:43
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#413
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: KH 49x, Custom
Posts: 1,765
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Beautiful. Love the shoal draft too!
Cheers.
Paul.
__________________
If you can dream it; with grit, you can do it.
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27-05-2021, 18:44
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#414
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Boat: Seawind 1000xl
Posts: 7,461
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Yes, I’m jealous!
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27-05-2021, 18:47
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#415
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Port Aransas, Texas
Boat: 2019 Seawind 1160 Lite
Posts: 2,126
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by smj
Yes, I’m jealous!
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Which is funny because I think your boat would probably have similar PHRF rating. But he's got a bigger hard top.
(Note that I tried to tell Tony ......)
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28-05-2021, 00:18
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#416
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: forest city
Boat: no boat any more
Posts: 2,514
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
incomprehensible why somebody would buy a boat with the "looks" of a Lagoon...
__________________
...not all who wander are lost!
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28-05-2021, 04:30
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#417
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: KH 49x, Custom
Posts: 1,765
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Horses for courses. My wife and I like the looks of the "single story" lagoons. The newer ones... not so much.
Cheers.
Paul.
__________________
If you can dream it; with grit, you can do it.
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28-05-2021, 05:30
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#418
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Boat: Seawind 1000xl
Posts: 7,461
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Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailjumanji
Which is funny because I think your boat would probably have similar PHRF rating. But he's got a bigger hard top.
(Note that I tried to tell Tony ......)
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I’m guessing Tony was trying to save weight?
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28-05-2021, 06:21
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#419
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Port Aransas, Texas
Boat: 2019 Seawind 1160 Lite
Posts: 2,126
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by smj
I’m guessing Tony was trying to save weight?
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Yep, my guess too.
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28-05-2021, 08:00
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#420
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: forest city
Boat: no boat any more
Posts: 2,514
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Re: Cruising cat - sub 90 degrees tack upwind
Quote:
Originally Posted by GRIT
Horses for courses. My wife and I like the looks of the "single story" lagoons. The newer ones... not so much.
Cheers.
Paul.
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the early generations, before they started the "vertical-windows-craze" looked ok (& an early 55 actually looked sleek!), but those vertical windows are simply unacceptably ugly to me
__________________
...not all who wander are lost!
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