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Old 01-11-2016, 09:13   #46
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

Don't look like 15' seas to me.
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Old 01-11-2016, 12:37   #47
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

Interesting video ,We have a PDQ36 and a 45 foot Outremer and have sailed cats all my life. I have come to the conclusion that one of the few things that a monohull does better than a catamaran of equal length is motor directly into rough seas .They just don't seem to pitch as much .Please no world war over this
We have all used the engines to get to port ,and I wont make judgement on an unknown situation in a video. As to the wave height, several times the entire structure disappeared below the wave tops ,10+ feet easy
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Old 01-11-2016, 12:52   #48
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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Originally Posted by admiralslater View Post
Interesting video ,We have a PDQ36 and a 45 foot Outremer and have sailed cats all my life. I have come to the conclusion that one of the few things that a monohull does better than a catamaran of equal length is motor directly into rough seas .They just don't seem to pitch as much .Please no world war over this
We have all used the engines to get to port ,and I wont make judgement on an unknown situation in a video. As to the wave height, several times the entire structure disappeared below the wave tops ,10+ feet easy
Yeah, well it depends on the boat. My Hans Christian 38 would have been every bit as bad as the cat in that video in those conditions. Motored and hobby horsed terribly. just lunge and stop.
Another time in my 47 foot mono around Hatteras, heavy wind against the gulf stream, a Cat motoring fast passed me readily in that steep chop.
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Old 01-11-2016, 15:38   #49
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

do you think that the very round shape made it hobby horse? I Just looked a couple of pics,it does seem to move a lot of water .Maybe it is a little bluff forward? pretty though
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Old 01-11-2016, 16:07   #50
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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do you think that the very round shape made it hobby horse? I Just looked a couple of pics,it does seem to move a lot of water .Maybe it is a little bluff forward? pretty though
Yeah, they have some fullness forward compared to some boats. A heavy boat with bowsprit etc hanging in front too. Heck even the tubing on the pulpits etc is bigger and thicker than most boats.
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Old 01-11-2016, 21:23   #51
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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Originally Posted by admiralslater View Post
do you think that the very round shape made it hobby horse? I Just looked a couple of pics,it does seem to move a lot of water .Maybe it is a little bluff forward? pretty though
Certainly "a little bluff" compared to your Outremer 45, but not compared to a lot of cruising cats :-)

The telephoto lens has made it look at lot more rounded that it is in actuality.
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Old 02-11-2016, 08:22   #52
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

Now try to imagine that in a monohull
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Old 02-11-2016, 10:35   #53
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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Certainly "a little bluff" compared to your Outremer 45, but not compared to a lot of cruising cats :-)

The telephoto lens has made it look at lot more rounded that it is in actuality.
I thought he was talking about the Hans Christian.
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Old 02-11-2016, 11:47   #54
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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I thought he was talking about the Hans Christian.
I was referring to the HC . I have not sailed on any other large (40+) production cat but I can say that the Outremer does not bounce much . This is helped by the fact that the water, fuel, Batteries, anchour chain and the majority of the wiring are within 3 feet of the center of rotation
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Old 02-11-2016, 12:09   #55
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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Originally Posted by UpOnStands View Post
here is similar condition but boat is in deeper water so wave period is slightly longer -- 5 hours of vigorous action.
This video doesn't even remotely match Beaufort Force 10:
"Very high waves (29-41 ft) with overhanging crests, sea white with densely blown foam, heavy rolling, lowered visibility."
Must be in an alternate universe.
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Old 02-11-2016, 12:12   #56
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

Being "bluff forward" and aft as well is a good thing for pitch resistance. Increasing volume towards the end of the hulls increases the prismatic coefiicient. This reduces hobby horsing after a wave has passed by. It dampens the boat's initial response to the wave. Cat designers learnt in the early eighties that fine ends did not dampen pitching well and although these designs were okay on flat water they did not work well in waves - hence the increase in volume in the ends. Same for monos and multis.

Racing sailors also know that it is vital to keep weight out of the ends of the boat. Anchor aft, sails on the cabin floor if possible, crew together. If you do this the boat sails nicely to windward. Put just one crew member on the bow of a 40footer and the boat can turn into a bit of a pig. Some racers were known to mouse strong halyards with twine to reduce weight aloft and pitching on long windward races.

So the Outremer (and my cat as well) use well known principles of reducing the height of the centre of gravity, keeping as many heavy objects close to this CG and removing all using a hull shape which is full enough to dampen pitching once you go over the wave. Many modern cruising cats aren't designed or built this way - they have lots of weight in the ends. To handle seas better one easy way is to bring the anchor aft. You could also reduce the weight of anything on the davits and ensure that your solar panel arch, wind gen et al are the lightest ones you can find.

I once stowed a small inflatable up into the bow of my 31ft trimaran and the boat became very unhappy. I went up and grabbed it and tied it onto the net, about 65% aft and she became a sweet boat again. She was a very light tri, and was our cruising home for two seasons, but that inflatable could not have been more than 40kg. It made a big difference.

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Old 02-11-2016, 12:17   #57
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
I'm curious as to in what universe physics holds water together while forming waves that are 10-15' in height, with a 3-4sec period? Since it surely isn't on Earth, nor in this one.
And many of the rest of the 'observations' on the conditions, 'seamanship', etc. herein are also speci-FICTION as well. As in akin to science... fiction.

Outstanding!!
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Old 02-11-2016, 13:21   #58
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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I'm curious as to in what universe physics holds water together while forming waves that are 10-15' in height, with a 3-4sec period? Since it surely isn't on Earth, nor in this one.
The Mediterranean universe. The Mistral and Bora winds can produce these conditions.
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Old 02-11-2016, 13:32   #59
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

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This video doesn't even remotely match Beaufort Force 10:
"Very high waves (29-41 ft) with overhanging crests, sea white with densely blown foam, heavy rolling, lowered visibility."
Must be in an alternate universe.
It's been explained many times on this forum how the Beaufort scale can't be applied to seas such as the Mediterranean and Baltic or even the Great Lakes. We certainly get the high winds, but the corresponding sea state is different from the Beaufort scale, instead we get steep high waves with a short period between them.
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Old 02-11-2016, 13:57   #60
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Re: Cat in 10-15' seas with around 3-4 second period

^^ utter rubbish

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