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Old 23-10-2017, 01:23   #16
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Sure Cav - if you can get the tool in there great. Otherwise it may be sheer cussedness and rude words to get it done.

The few tips I would give are

- presaturate the glass - In tricky areas I often presaturate the cloth on a flat table and then offer it up to the joint. It may not work here but if things get hard, consider it.
- use fine cloth - whenever you are trying to get a nice seal use fine cloth - a good quality sheathing cloth or a very light double bias is best - 400gm is too heavy.
- cut the cloth at 45 degrees to get it to wrap around corners. I make fake double bias by cutting sheathing cloth at 45 degrees. This wraps really well but concertinas like anything. Be careful but it does do corners well.
- Put a bit of glue mix in the epoxy mix you apply to the case. This will fill up the rough bits in the case and make the cloth stick to the case more easily.

cheers

Phil
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Old 23-10-2017, 10:02   #17
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

I agree about the thin cloth but I'm going to suggest Dynel as it is more abrasion resistant than glass and works better in contours, curves, corners and other complex areas than anything else. It also has some give so won't crack if there is some flexing. In the States it is pretty easy to find and affordable.Southern Industrial Dynel Laminate It works well, you don't need to do the 45 degree cut on this stuff.
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Old 23-10-2017, 13:31   #18
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Dynel? I really don't like the stuff - terrible to laminate over, very hard to feather edges on, soaks up heaps of resin and no structural help either. I gave away half a roll I had.

Great for abrasion resistance but I would never use it somewhere that needed mechanical reinforcement. If the repair needs beefing up then the OP will have the devil of a job cleaning up the Dynel in the case.
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Old 23-10-2017, 13:40   #19
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Not my experience at all. However in Oz you might have cloth from a different mill. I've used it on really complex shapes and nothing else comes close.. For a seal in a wear point dynel will out last glass.
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Old 23-10-2017, 21:45   #20
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Thanks for the glassing options guys. I will stick with 6 oz cloth. Today I found a "mini 1/2 inch belt Sander that is 5 inches long. It's small enough that I can sand up into the case. I still plan on using 40 grit glued to a stick though just work it a little more and feel better about it. The next thing is Epoxy. I've used west systems a lot.. I suffered no rash or itching. Well, My wallet got blistered! West is great but I'm looking at an epoxy with 2 to 1 mixture. the 2 are: Raka and Aeromarine. I know theres more choices.. almost too many.. Sooo.. any opinions on Raka -vs- Aeromarine? I will decide on one.
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Old 24-10-2017, 10:10   #21
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Well the 6 oz glass won't do sharp corners as well. I also meant to ask Phil about his laminating comment as there isn't a problem, if you think about it another layer will be bonding to the cured epoxy. This is why you can laminate different materials over each other, it is a mechanical bond, not a chemical one when using epoxy. If it didn't stick you could never put the dynel on over the glass in the first place. Proper surface prep is the answer.

Epoxy? First, no matter what you use protection is essential. With everything there will be no rash at first but at some point of exposure a threshold is reached and after that you always will break out. By respecting this fact I still don't have problems but don't do production work either.

Second, I use WEST so can't help you pick. You can get decent deals shopping online and buying in bulk. I respect the science the Gougeons brought to the glue table. My thoughts are the marine environment isn't a place to try economizing on materials, especially below the waterline. I'm sure lots of things work as well but after having something work great for years I'm not ready to reinvent the wheel. Being familiar with how the different catalysts work with the temps and humidities in my area is a time saver. To get a new system up to speed means some experimenting.
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Old 25-10-2017, 00:00   #22
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

At the risk of hijacking Kelldog's thread Cav, I have not been able to feather the edges of Dynel as well as glass. It also gets really thick. I used to use it on the dinghy bottom but even stopped that as it just ripped off in big chunks. I have my biases and I am happy not to use Dynel but I am happy for you to love it.

Gotta be nice to our trimaran friends.

Kelldog - I use the cheapest epoxy I can find for most glass work. Sometimes epoxy can be a pain and bead if it gets cheap but if I am glassing then a 105 clone is fine. I stay away from thin epoxies as I got sick after using one on a tri build. Too much vapour - I don't really want to smell it.

When I go to the resin store, (never buy at the chandlery!), I go in my boatbuilding clothes and ask for a trade price. I put on my tradesman voice, have a bit of banter and they give me trade. I need to know what I am after and not stuff them around. Same with paints. Get online, know what you want and act like a pro. If I turn up after teaching school it gets harder as I am in business clothes and I am not part of the club.

105 is a very good resin so I would use that. Don't get the pumps, just weigh it on a cheap electronic balance.

cheers

Phil
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Old 25-10-2017, 08:37   #23
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Say Phil, Did you ever think about the cheap epoxy as the fabric was tearing off in chunks?! I've never seen this with WEST.

In all fairness about fabrics I use quite a few different ones depending on the purpose. Glass in all its permutations, Vectra is what I use on the inside of trunks , polypropylene, dynel, kevlar, carbon fiber uni and woven etc....

Aheavy weave polypropylene does soak in resin and have the feather issues you describe, a grinder actually leaves less fuzz than a sander.

But- I digress . Kelldog won't have any problems using 6oz glass cloth as long as there is enough filler in the corners to give a bit of radius.

Back to dynel, the light cloth with a tight weave.... I use it on hard to cover complex shapes, for meat and potatoes - fiberglass. For special situations see above.
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Old 25-10-2017, 17:15   #24
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelldog View Post
Thanks for the glassing options guys. I will stick with 6 oz cloth. Today I found a "mini 1/2 inch belt Sander that is 5 inches long. It's small enough that I can sand up into the case. I still plan on using 40 grit glued to a stick though just work it a little more and feel better about it. The next thing is Epoxy. I've used west systems a lot.. I suffered no rash or itching. Well, My wallet got blistered! West is great but I'm looking at an epoxy with 2 to 1 mixture. the 2 are: Raka and Aeromarine. I know theres more choices.. almost too many.. Sooo.. any opinions on Raka -vs- Aeromarine? I will decide on one.
I like Raka. It seems to work as well as anything else, although I can't say I've tried them all. That's for sure.
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Old 25-10-2017, 20:17   #25
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

I ordered Raka... Had I been near a West Marine I probably would have went ahead and bought west systems. I am comfy with WS but I'm looking forward to giving Raka a try. A plus was being able to order supplies at the same time.
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Old 13-05-2018, 12:31   #26
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Re: Brine Shrimp Catamaran

Well, no more red hull! My little Cat project is coming along. My next work is sanding the deck and cabins, then painting a primer coat and applying KiwiGrip for the non-skid. I still have the itch to 1) add a pod to the deck to allow sitting room (This means increasing mast length to at least 30 feet. and 2) adding 3 feet to the overall length. I was thinking that since I have it on land and a perfect work space, that I should just do it! I have the hobie mast to use which is roughly 27 feet but the itch is pretty pronounced!
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Old 13-05-2018, 12:40   #27
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