Why are helms placed so far back on modern yachts?

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

I don't mind the far aft wheel position on that C&C, although I think that engine panel placement is stupid (why bother having gauges, etc. if you can't see them while actually using the engine?). It helps keep the cockpit clutter down like a tiller can while folded up.

And remember C&C's racing heritage, so while that setup may not be ideal for singlehanding, it's logical for racing. Keeps the helmsman out of everyone else's way. Singlehanding or sailing short handed, I'd probably sit on one of the side benches and hold the wheel from there to save climbing around the wheel on a regular basis.

That C&C 29 MK II is a nice looking boat and rated at around 171 PHRF whereas my boat is rated at 240 but when the going gets tough and you screw up and end up in bad weather I believe the Bristol 27 can handle it much better than the C&C 29 which is why I have to remind myself that I already raced for 15 years and going a knot or so faster on a monohull cruising just isn't worth it ....

But having a more seaworthy boat is even though it (a Bristol 27) can be a bit cramped

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by Emoyeni

None of those really address my issue. My point isnt centre cockpit versus aft cockpit. Even comparing aft cockpit boats, the newer boats seem to just put the Helms so far back without any protection apart from lifelines.

I agree. Not so much about safety and wet windy and exposed back there. It's hard to think of an advantage to doing it really. I don't think visibility is better.

I guess it's so all the guests aboard can go in and out of the cabin. But for the cruiser, I dont want it back there.
There's a trend for cats to have 2 helms way back in the aft corners too. Yeah, I really want to be back there when it's blowing 30 and the drenching rain is horizontal...

[Brendan]

I have a 1991 Taswell 49 All Season with a centre cockpit, which I like much more than modern, wide transom aft cockpit boats. I feel much more secure in big seas in the smaller, centre cockpit. This design also makes for a fantastic owner's stateroom at the back. I also love the aft deck which provides space to lounge, fish or put a dinghy.

[goboatingnow]

The primary reason is to provide space for the deck table and a “ run “ of seating , if you move the wheel forward you split the cockpit seating in two.

Really the choice is right aft , or against the cockpit coaming , like in the Amel or the Beneteau 55CC. But it’s a massive compromise too, needing an offset companionway ( and increased downflooding risk ), it also needs full protection as the farther forward you are the wetter it’s potentially

All the way aft puts you furthest from the spray , the main winches are usually near to hand. There’s excellent views of the sails and better views around the back of the head sail.

Wheel forward has as many if not more compromises then wheel aft.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Brendan

I have a 1991 Taswell 49 All Season with a centre cockpit, which I like much more than modern, wide transom aft cockpit boats. I feel much more secure in big seas in the smaller, centre cockpit. This design also makes for a fantastic owner's stateroom at the back. I also love the aft deck which provides space to lounge, fish or put a dinghy.

Actually I prefer aft cockpit , closer to the water less movement, I’m lower down getting onto the side decks too.

[redneckrob]

Everyone is looking at this from the perspective of sitting for long periods of time hand steering the boat. A good number of cruisers on modern (and not so modern) boats are on autopilot most of the time and the helm is only used when mooring and in confined waters for shorter periods of time, so that's what designers are designing for.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

Everyone is looking at this from the perspective of sitting for long periods of time hand steering the boat. A good number of cruisers on modern (and not so modern) boats are on autopilot most of the time and the helm is only used when mooring and in confined waters for shorter periods of time, so that's what designers are designing for.

The wheels have been aft well before widespread AP use

[Bowdrie]

Originally Posted by slap

To maximize the interior. If you push the cockpit aft a bit, that space can be added to the interior of the boat. Interiors sell boats.

Beat me to it.
Yes, the "modern" way is figure out a way to cram 10lbs in a 5lb bag.
It's part of the design parameters;
"And while we're shoving the steering as far aft as possible, we'll cut the side decks down to narrow/sloped catwalks."

[MJH]

Originally Posted by Emoyeni

I’ve been doing a bunch of “research” on YouTube and it’s amazing how so many modern boats have their helmes way in the aft corners of their hulls. I’ve seen videos of people sailing these boats all over the world but I can’t help but think that having the helms in the stern corners of the boats is a little dangerous. all the videos show ideal conditions, but what if you have to helm the boat in stormy weather? Wouldn’t something like an Amel be better? Am I missing something?

Edit Amel, not Amex!

It's about tradeoffs. Large cockpits make for smaller interiors and vice versus. By shoving the wheels aft they can achieve the same size "party" cockpit without making the interior smaller.

Most everyone agrees that tiller steering gives more sailing "feel" than a wheel but one of the tradeoffs is that tillers take up cockpit space underway. Of course the other tradeoff is that people are more familiar with wheeled steering than tiller steering.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH

[MicHughV]

seems to me that the modern sailboat favors the open cockpit/walkthru' design. Using the Beneteau as an example, there is room only for a seat back there....no lazarette locker...steering the Beneteau will have you standing in that gap between seats

I was never a big proponent of this feature, but have come to love it and would not have it any other way...

[aqfishing]

Originally Posted by Emoyeni

I’ve been doing a bunch of “research” on YouTube and it’s amazing how so many modern boats have their helmes way in the aft corners of their hulls. I’ve seen videos of people sailing these boats all over the world but I can’t help but think that having the helms in the stern corners of the boats is a little dangerous. all the videos show ideal conditions, but what if you have to helm the boat in stormy weather? Wouldn’t something like an Amel be better? Am I missing something?

Edit Amel, not Amex!

Next time you are heading into bad weather, stand right at the stern awhile, then go stand just for'ard of midships. This might answer some of your question!

[MicHughV]

aqfishing, you hit the nail on the head...my first was center cockpit with the cockpit almost dead amidships....going to weather was wet...wet...wet..

[Na Mara]

I believe that with good design and semi balancing you can get tiller steering to work well all the way up to about 50ft. If I was having a boat built from scratch it would have tiller steering. Very robust, great feel, can be folded out the way, let’s you sit under the dodger with access to all the lines, easy to combine with a wind vane. What’s not to love?

[aqfishing]

Originally Posted by MicHughV

aqfishing, you hit the nail on the head...my first was center cockpit with the cockpit almost dead amidships....going to weather was wet...wet...wet..

And bumpier?

[JPA Cate]

Yes, but one doesn't sail in a vacuum: many places there will be many boats out. I agree with chrisr on this one, that aft quarter is where you want to be to see around the headsail or under it when otherwise it blocks your view of the traffic. You have to be able to see them to avoid them when they're the "stand on" vessel. I'll sit on the downhill side (because we have wheel steering) coaming and peer up at the tell tales, too.

As to one wheel vs. two, one can look at it as current fashion, or convenient redundancy. And not all such steering stations are way out on the quarter. Some are set in, and carry wide side decks all the way aft.

It is really up to the buyer to select a boat on which he or she can sail the boat best, something difficult to do for newcomers to the sport.


Ann