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boatpoker · 05-12-2024, 05:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Na Mara

Structural interior hull liners are more or less unique in their inability to be properly repaired upon separation from the hull.

I've posted this one before ... I disagree

Sailboat Liner Bonding Failure

Na Mara · 05-12-2024, 06:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by boatpoker

I've posted this one before ... I disagree

Sailboat Liner Bonding Failure

I really hope that that boat was still under warranty because that is shocking. Imagine being the owner and discovering that the structure of the boat was barely attached to the hull. Stuff of nightmares.

Chris 249 · 05-12-2024, 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by moonriver

Re: What's the problems with Hanse's
We own a Hanse 458, it is solid glass from the waterline to the keel, it sails at approx 38degrees to windward at 8 to 9 knots in 10 to 12 knots of breeze. We are based in NZ and have sailed bin some really awful weather and although not fun the boat handled it well. We have spent 20 years sailing offshore and would not take this one away as it is a little light, in our opinion. But for gulf cruising it is perfect. The class and quality of finish is superior to some of the boats compared to here. Sharp corners, yes in some places, mainly doors, but really well curved edges on all other areas. We had our boat built at the same time as a friend had a Barvarian built. Both had the same wood finish inside (supposedly). He was surprised to discover his was in fact a printed paper finish made to look like wood. Ours may be veneer, but it is wood.

Ummm, if the 458 is getting that sort of speed then it's about as quick as a TP52 upwind - they also do about 8.3-9 knots at approx 38 degrees in about 12 knots, but they have a headsail sheeting angle of about 3.2 degrees, light carbon hull and full crew. It's hard to see a Hansa 458 hanging in with TP52s.

If it can, given that the 458 is rated almost 30% slower than the TP52s on ORC and with about the same upwind speed as a Beneteau 36.7 or J/35, the 458 must win just about every single ORC race it ever enters by a year or two.

ozolli · 05-12-2024, 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris 249

Ummm, if the 458 is getting that sort of speed then it's about as quick as a TP52 upwind - they also do about 8.3-9 knots at approx 38 degrees in about 12 knots, but they have a headsail sheeting angle of about 3.2 degrees, light carbon hull and full crew. It's hard to see a Hansa 458 hanging in with TP52s.

If it can, given that the 458 is rated almost 30% slower than the TP52s on ORC and with about the same upwind speed as a Beneteau 36.7 or J/35, the 458 must win just about every single ORC race it ever enters by a year or two.

I suppose the TP52 is true wind and the Hanse is apparent wind.
9 kt boat speed at 38 AWA in 12 Kt TWS means 65 TWA. Most likely for this kind of boat.

caradow · 05-12-2024, 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozolli

I suppose the TP52 is true wind and the Hanse is apparent wind.
9 kt boat speed at 38 AWA in 12 Kt TWS means 65 TWA. Most likely for this kind of boat.

Ah not sure of what you are saying.
I have never used TWA as a gauge of how a boat goes up wind, always AWA. It is however important down wind when you use it for jibe angles.
But maybe I have been doing it wrong and willing to learn.

ozolli · 06-12-2024, 00:08

TWA and TWS are used in polar charts so you can compare your actual speed with your historical data. Useful when racing.
Polars are also used as marketing data and to compare boats.

AWS is useful for your sails life as this is the wind they see and probably what your sail maker use to tell you how far you can go with each of them.

But the AWS and AWA build and change with the boat speed.
Fast boats like the Ultims bring the AWA so much forward that they even don't have downwind sails as they are nearly all the time upwind "apparently".

So the AWA is hardly used as a comparison between boats.

clamshack · 26-01-2025, 14:22

I've been in France for the last couple of weeks. We have been moving east to west from Nice to Marseille. There are zero "bluewater" yachts here. People want to have fun, across the spectrum, day sail to cruise.

Hanse is Hanse, Beneteau, Dufure, all the same. If you want to buy new - I think Catalina is probably your best bet. I don't know how they do it.