Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 15-12-2016, 22:59   #46
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 20
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
There's no need to be forgiven. ... yes, most marinas will want to know your overall length, including the sprit and any outboard rudder, and not just length over deck. .. Racing handicap rules are very complicated and are a very different issue. No doubt sprits are/were a common way to "game" the racing measurement rules.

So, I was correct in assuming that a bowsprit is disadvantageous in that it adds LOA without adding internal volume?
Butterman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-12-2016, 23:41   #47
Registered User
 
Uncle Bob's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Sydney Australia
Boat: Fisher pilothouse sloop 32'
Posts: 2,284
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Butterman View Post
So, I was correct in assuming that a bowsprit is disadvantageous in that it adds LOA without adding internal volume?
I would guess that the answer depends on your perspective, if the boat in question is basically a dock queen then yes the bowsprit is a disadvantage, however if the boat was designed with one, and if one is into sailing then no, it is not a disadvantage.
__________________
Rob aka Uncle Bob Sydney Australia.

Life is 10% the cards you are dealt, 90% how you play em
Uncle Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-12-2016, 23:47   #48
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 20
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Bob View Post
I would guess that the answer depends on your perspective, if the boat in question is basically a dock queen then yes the bowsprit is a disadvantage, however if the boat was designed with one, and if one is into sailing then no, it is not a disadvantage.
Right, of course. I simply meant that a sprit could be a disadvantage in the specific way that I mentioned. I do see the advantages as well, I was merely pointing out one disadvantage, as I saw it.
Butterman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-12-2016, 09:16   #49
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 18,897
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

i have yet to find disadvantages--here length is that which is documentation length, which ignores the sprit completely.
and so my new one will be mexican huanacaxtle /perota/ipe.....
as for bobstay sawing, hah ah aha-- funny how mine never sawed into my lines-- the single line when contacting bobstay, actually pushes boat away from it. i used 2 lines on my formosa to mooring tag chain, and i used different chain links for each one. no problem., yeah there is noise of ball vs hull-- and with a sprit, one is able to place a bungee cord to keep ball off boat. works great.
as for sail-- my genoa is my driving AND steering sail. is about a 150, unable to be used without sprit. it has gotten me 3 kts under sail without mizzen, which adds another knot to 1.5 kts in a nice breeze--the likes of which makes you all cower and return to marina slip.
as for pitching--merely learn how to properly load trim a boat.
donot place heavy weights abaft mizzen or before main masts--keep it centralized for smooth sailing.
i stow my secondary anchor secured to mainmast on deck when sailing, with its chain in my cockpit well or below decks stowed in a bin until use. ye donot need to sail with both primary and secondary anchors rigged for immediate use.
at anchor i place th e secondary and its chain forward of mainmast to keep my bows down in a windy anchorage--keeps dragging anchor less of a possibility
__________________
life is an adventure meant to be LIVED!!!!
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...oul+mates.html


https://sksolitarybird.org/
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 01:21   #50
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: nelson new zealand
Boat: kuiper 32
Posts: 198
Images: 3
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

I sail my boat a lot and my bowsprit is my turbocharger if I want to go a knot faster I just unfurl the sail.I have a solent rig so both headsails are the same size usually just sail with the inner sail out but if I want to pass someone out she comes.
builder dan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 01:57   #51
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 9,747
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

When you have an integral bowsprit built in steel, as well as separating the sail plan, it offers a nice neat way to pocket the Anchor underneath.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	1481965011757.jpg
Views:	180
Size:	26.2 KB
ID:	138095   Click image for larger version

Name:	1481965027857.jpg
Views:	200
Size:	50.9 KB
ID:	138096  

Click image for larger version

Name:	1481965049871.jpg
Views:	184
Size:	130.2 KB
ID:	138097  
Pelagic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 04:42   #52
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 26,414
Images: 2
pirate Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

To be honest I've been considering adding a bowsprit to my boat.. moving the forestay up and having the inner stay (removable masthead) to where the forestay currently sits and having either a furling drifter or yankee up front with a No1 jib on the inner.
She's a heavy boat at 27,000lbs (39ft steel) and needs around 20kts to get her going over 5kts so some help would be nice.. huge main in the tradition of the 70's.. would it work..??
She has a short kinda sprit for the anchors but was thinking maybe another 3ft extending past there.. but part of me thinks the inner would be to close for effective aerodynamics.
Maybe go cutter instead..??
PS; the bathing platform is actually an extension of the hull and extends the w/line
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Enjoleuse_2.jpg
Views:	179
Size:	98.0 KB
ID:	138102   Click image for larger version

Name:	Enjoleuse_1.jpg
Views:	188
Size:	127.6 KB
ID:	138103  

Click image for larger version

Name:	Apr├s.jpg
Views:	192
Size:	416.2 KB
ID:	138104  
__________________


Born To Be Wild.. Double Click on the picture.
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 07:27   #53
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 18,897
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
To be honest I've been considering adding a bowsprit to my boat.. moving the forestay up and having the inner stay (removable masthead) to where the forestay currently sits and having either a furling drifter or yankee up front with a No1 jib on the inner.
She's a heavy boat at 27,000lbs (39ft steel) and needs around 20kts to get her going over 5kts so some help would be nice.. huge main in the tradition of the 70's.. would it work..??
She has a short kinda sprit for the anchors but was thinking maybe another 3ft extending past there.. but part of me thinks the inner would be to close for effective aerodynamics.
Maybe go cutter instead..??
PS; the bathing platform is actually an extension of the hull and extends the w/line
sweetheart, your rig is one mast shy of being a real boat.ha ha ha ha ha
i find my genoa , placed on outermost end of sprit is a good driving sail. it is essentially a 150 percenter with a length away from boat enough to be a real sail h aha ha imagine that. coupled with my 14.5 ft mizzenboom on a 40.9 ft overall (plus sprit)boat, it works.
so all you need, phil, is a sprit and a good, realistically sized mizzen-- bent onto about 14.5 feet of boom, and sail a lot faster--mebbe even get up to hull speed in a decent wind~~~
__________________
life is an adventure meant to be LIVED!!!!
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...oul+mates.html


https://sksolitarybird.org/
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 10:16   #54
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Between Caribbean and Canada
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 6,898
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

We have bowsprit a on both boats.

The 33 was built with and without the sprit. Ted Brewer told me it really needs the sprit

The 44 was originally a ketch design redone by Alan Pape as a cutter for this build. My take is the long 5' sprit is needed to give this 40,000# hull the drive it needs. It also means the inner is quite big.

So that's the deal. A sprit is used when you don't have enough sail area to drive a heavy hull. I think of our boat as a 44' hull with a 50' sailplan for light winds. Using the inner she has a 42' sailplan for heavy wind.
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 10:20   #55
Registered User
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 23,617
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

I always think of a bowsprit as extra hull length a boat could have had, more carrying capacity and faster speed. .... and the sprit having more complication with fittings, cables etc.
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 10:28   #56
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 26,414
Images: 2
pirate Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
sweetheart, your rig is one mast shy of being a real boat.ha ha ha ha ha
i find my genoa , placed on outermost end of sprit is a good driving sail. it is essentially a 150 percenter with a length away from boat enough to be a real sail h aha ha imagine that. coupled with my 14.5 ft mizzenboom on a 40.9 ft overall (plus sprit)boat, it works.
so all you need, phil, is a sprit and a good, realistically sized mizzen-- bent onto about 14.5 feet of boom, and sail a lot faster--mebbe even get up to hull speed in a decent wind~~~
Zee.. I'd have to make her a yawl.. not enough room in the cockpit for a mast..
Then I'd lose my solar panels..
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Enjoleuse_3.jpg
Views:	128
Size:	187.9 KB
ID:	138114  
__________________


Born To Be Wild.. Double Click on the picture.
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-12-2016, 11:02   #57
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 371
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

My only comment re: bowsprits is they can never be too big. Size matters...
Lojanica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-12-2016, 07:51   #58
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Marina Del Rey, CA
Posts: 350
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0208.JPG
Views:	148
Size:	86.1 KB
ID:	138169
cpt_757 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-12-2016, 08:09   #59
Registered User
 
UNCIVILIZED's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 5,629
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

I can see the value of small sprits (2' or less) for anchor handling, & to tack a light air sail to. But otherwise... Sprit's are a lot of added cost. $ which could have easily financed several extra feet of hull. Quite easily so.

That hull equals more speed, more room for cargo or living space. More deck space, especially for sail & anchor handling. It's lower maintence than are sprits with all of their rigging. And hulls tend to fair better in encounters with pilings, & such.

Sprits have both side stays, & bobstays to get maimed by said real estate arguments. Or when just laying along side. Since on some boats the aft ends of side stays protrude quite a bit away from the hull.
Also, in collisions, it's common for them to become entangled in whatever was run into, thus creating lots of 2ndary damage.

Plus, if the boat gets stuck to the collided object or 2nd vessel, then you can't start to resolve the situation until after you've freed your vessel. Which, doing that is a hands on operation, & can be dicey, & dangerous.

Bobstay fittings are continually immersed, as are their fasteners, which leads to... "you know" (metal rot). And stems need special construction for bobstay attachments. So more $.

Also, given that they're commonly wooden, guess what can happen to sprits? And the grates, rigging, & pullpits attached to them with fasteners invite yet more rot. The structural type, given their penetration depth.

Plus sprits raise your moorage fees, though you can't live in that billed for space.

So most days I'd far prefer the waterline.
__________________

The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
UNCIVILIZED is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-12-2016, 08:30   #60
Registered User
 
SSgtPitt's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: The boat is on the hard in Indiantown and we’re back in Colorado Springs to make more money so we can go again.
Boat: 1982 Cape Dory 36 Hull #78
Posts: 637
Re: What's So Bad About the Bowsprit ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by clausont View Post
This is exactly the reason that I just replaced the short bowsprit with one that brings the rig up to design specs.
You can see both the old bowsprit and new one on our blog.
Checked your profile but can't find your blog. I did find your pictures but the boat in your pics doesn't look like it has a bowsprit. Can you update?
SSgtPitt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
bowsprit

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Retractable Bowsprit West Coast Cat Multihull Sailboats 25 22-11-2013 10:10
Dented Mast- How Bad Is Bad? Zednotzee Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 10 25-01-2010 17:22
Home Depot Plumbing fittings - just bad or really bad? neelie Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 34 11-11-2008 18:21
Bowsprit Frank, Southern Voyager Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 1 19-03-2008 04:22
removable bowsprit? eldiente Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 5 17-01-2008 13:27

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 19:59.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.