What is the optimal outboard setup?

[Ellevan]

Looking to start a discussion about outboard setups, specifically in relation to sliding or hinging motor mounts, steering or locking the outboard in place, and transom cutouts(or not). From the moment I learned that some sailboats had outboards instead of inboard engines I thought that this was a rinky setup full of difficulties. Now I find myself with a 28' boat and a 15hp hanging off the back. The hinge is difficult and tends to lock lopsided or jam, the transom cutout is large and only 2" above the cockpit floor, and steering in a marina causes unnecessary stress and fear of hitting a million dollar yacht(almost happened the day I bought my boat). I'm leaning towards closing off the transom cutout and setting up a vertical roller setup. Anyone out there have this all figured out?

[liquidice]

Not figured out, but I have evolved and learned along the way. My humble ‘81 Catalina Capri 25, wing keel is currently powered by an ‘87 6 hp longshaft 2 stroke Suzuki on a light motor mount that raises and lowers with a spring assist. Previous iterations included a 5.5 hp air cooled Aqua Bug and a 6 hp 1965 Evinrude fisherman. The powerhead on the Suzuki is bigger than the others so I can’t tilt it forward far enough to lock it in place, so I just raise it and let the prop drag.

The motor mount is nice because you can lift and tilt, and then tie the motor in place so it doesn’t swing too much. I try to leave the motor going forward and steer with the tiller, but it is often useful when docking to use the twin control inputs of boat tiller and motor tiller. I can spin 360 and move sideways. It’s never really 100% comfortable but I’m definitely in control. The old Evinrude runs sweetly and is super light, but in addition to being a short shaft, there is no cutoff. You throttle all the way down and it dies. Of course to shift, you throttle most of the way down and then shift. The Suzuki idles nicely and makes me much more confident in the harbor to cruise over to the touch and go dock instead of making multiple dinghy trips to onboard passengers and supplies.

The motor mount sways side to side more than I’d like, but there are no cracks on the transom. It feels strong most of the time, I usually just use it to go in and out of the harbor but as I have begun to rove farther, I have been getting into motor sailing. The longshaft is sufficient that the prop really doesn’t come out. Still, having the motor sticking off the back does not feel strong to begin with, and the springy mount makes it feel even weaker. Last year I tried to head out in 20 kts at night in 6-8’ waves, and I turned back around 5 minutes out. I was steering with one hand on the tiller and the other on the motor tiller. It felt like the motor wanted to tear itself off the mounting plate, or to tear the plate off the back of the boat. I envisioned my crewman and I in a boat with no motor, dangerously close to shore, or in the same boat with a gaping hole in the transom leading into the hull. Terrifying.

In the world of outboards, it seems like the well is the most robust option, with better prop placement and a sturdier mount. The sliding roller mount you speak of is pretty cool, but it seems like the kicker plate is a more mature technology, and the cost of the rollers seems too much. You could get a really nice heavy kicker plate and glass up the back for less than just the roller mount itself. Since you still end up with the motor on the back, it just seems like the roller mount is not that much better. The transom mount setup, where the motor is mounted directly on the transom definitely seems like the worst of the bunch. Still, the direct control inputs seem more reliable to me than the cable systems used as the remote controls in Pearson Tritons and other motor well based boats. I would be afraid a cable would bind or stretch and I would be stuck in full throttle or neutral or whatever at the wrong time.

[valhalla360]

Huge difference between a boat designed from the start for outboard power and a boat where the engine died and someone just bolted an outboard to the transom to get by.

[Don C L]

On my ol Columbia 24 I had a well and a notch cut out in the transom and that worked really well. The well was roomy enough to tilt up the engine and it was protected in the lazarette. My Columbia 29 has a well too but it was designed for a Seagull engine. The PO was an engineer who did a little math and made a hoist that lowers the long shaft down to the correct level and then by pulling on an old main sheet block set-up, the engine is easily lifted clear out of the water. I have to say it works well, and I am definitely not a fan of hanging an engine on the transom. I can’t post any photos right now but I think I have a shot of it in an album on my profile.

[Ellevan]

Thanks liquidice. Those are nice little motors. I'm dealing with slightly over 100lbs with my Honda 15...

valhalla360, I think my Crown 28 was originally designed with an inboard, though my boat in particular never had one. I think it may have been bought as a shell and completed 'at home', including the large transom cutout to reach the outboard. I've heard from one source that there were Crown 28's with factory cutouts for an outboard, but information is scarce.

Don C L, I'm always a fan of checking out other setups, so some pictures would be great. My cockpit runs all the way back to the transom, so there's no lazarette to house an outboard. I'm thinking of closing off the cutout if I can engineer some sort of outboard vertical slide on the transom. My fear is not being able to steer with the outboard if I'm stuck in a tight marina...

[Don C L]

Given a fin keel and spade rudder I think you will be fine for maneuverability even with the engine not steering. I see your boat has a plumb transom, that makes things easier. If you google your boat you’ll see many with the transom cut-out mount which is the best way to go for your boat if you can do it.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Ellevan

Looking to start a discussion about outboard setups, specifically in relation to sliding or hinging motor mounts, steering or locking the outboard in place, and transom cutouts(or not). From the moment I learned that some sailboats had outboards instead of inboard engines I thought that this was a rinky setup full of difficulties. Now I find myself with a 28' boat and a 15hp hanging off the back. The hinge is difficult and tends to lock lopsided or jam, the transom cutout is large and only 2" above the cockpit floor, and steering in a marina causes unnecessary stress and fear of hitting a million dollar yacht(almost happened the day I bought my boat). I'm leaning towards closing off the transom cutout and setting up a vertical roller setup. Anyone out there have this all figured out?

I will not claim to have this all figured out but I do have an 8 hp outboard on my sailboat.

Your motor is probably way too large and probably geared wrong. For any sailboat, you want a high-torque motor. They are available from several vendors in 6 HP and 9.9 hp, and in various derated versions of those, like 4 hp and 8 hp. The high-torque version has a different final drive ratio, a larger lower unit, and a larger diamter, flatter pitched prop. Together, these result in a motor that works well at sailboat speeds, 0-8 knots or so.

9.9 hp should be more than plenty for you.

I'm not aware of any high-torque setups in 15 HP so you probably have a motor intended for a much faster boat. Check your prop pitch, at the very minimum, you want the flattest prop available that will fit your motor.

I do not have a transom cutout. Their presence, absence, and depth is a tradeoff of easy access vs. water coming in the cockpit in a following sea.

With a deep transom cutout, such as yours, you should be able to get away with just using the power trim and tilt on the motor. If you also have bracket that moves up and down, you may find that you can leave it down except in storm conditions.

If you do not have power trim and tilt, that's another reason to replace your outboard.

The good news is that any and all propulsion problems have an upper bound in cost and complexity due to the fact that you can replace the outboard and its fuel system with brand new for $2500 and half an hour's work.

[Don C L]

Oops, sorry Ellevan, I should have referred back to you original post. If steering is a problem I don’t think hanging the engine outside on the transom will help, it will be hard to reach over to jockey the engine from side to side. Being able to tilt the engine up is the best option IMO, BUT I have not tried the sliding vertical hoist, it may work great with your plumb stern and a good, easy way to hoist it.

[Ellevan]

Yes Don, I think the vertical slider might work really well but I can't find ANY information about them. Ideally I'd find a DIY set of instructions and build it myself. Two things that I've thought of thus far that would have to be sorted out are: How to set the sliders off the transom far enough to allow for loosening and tightening of the outboard bracket, and the other that came to mind was the friction that would exist with the outboard's weight pulling away from the transom at the top and pushing against the transom at the bottom of the sliding attachment plate. Here is my existing setup, and another of the current state of my transom...In the middle of a core fix so I'm putting some thought into how to improve the outboard mount while I have the chance.

[Jammer]

Can't imagine why you would need a bracket for the proper motor. The transom cut is low enough you should be able to mount the (proper) motor right on the transom and just tilt it up as needed.

[thomm225]

A small outboard with an intregrated fuel tank makes things very simple. Usually the tank is large enough for entering and exiting your slip/marina area.

Mine is a 5 HP Mercury 4 Stroke with 25" extra long shaft w/40 ounce integral tank and weighs 58lbs. It can be removed and mounted on the stern rail on longer cruises. (My boat displaces 6600 lbs) The outboard has the standard prop on it.

If your outboard has an integral fuel tank you can store you external tank in a lazarette with a fuel line that's long enough to reach the engine should you need it for a longer distance motorsail

This keeps your boat clean and uncluttered.

My main large tank (3 gallon) is stored in the aft lazarette plus I have two 2 liter tanks. The fuel line reaches the engine thru one of the cowl vents

The strongest bracket you can get is best should you go that route. This one goes for $250.00

ALUMINUM AUXILIARY MOTOR BRACKET FOR 4-STROKE MOTORS - Garelick EEz-In

I have no remote controls for my outboard because it's main job is just to get me in and out of my slip.

For long distance offshore motorsails of say 20-30 miles I'll put the motor most of the way down on it's adjustable bracket, tie it in place straight, and cruise on autopilot

An outboard plus an external fuel tank on deck and remote controls can really clutter up the boat

The motor on a sailboat is called it's auxiliary for a reason. The main power source is always the sails........which is why I believe the minimum you can get by with is the best especially for coastal cruising

[Colin A]

Originally Posted by Jammer

Can't imagine why you would need a bracket for the proper motor. The transom cut is low enough you should be able to mount the (proper) motor right on the transom and just tilt it up as needed.

Yeah that would be how it looks to have been designed originally. Sailboat data has a line drawing showing the inboard but it also shows the outboard well. Simplicity would win me over vs a bracket.

[Lake-Effect]

Ellevan, from your pictures, it looks like a pretty good setup for an outboard, except I agree that the 15 hp might just be too big and heavy, which is why the existing mount might be giving problems.

If you are staying with that motor, just make sure that the transom where the bracket attaches is solid enough and hasn't softened or weakened.

I don't yet know if I'd want an outboard on a long-term cruising boat, I suspect they're usually inferior in position or staying in the water in a heavy sea... but for a daysailor/weekender they're delightfully uncomplicated.

One spring/summer I worked with a mechanic on sailboat inboard engines. After seeing what some owners were facing (eg a $15k insurance bill for catching a rope) i'd come home and just about hug our outboard, cos it's been reliable (10 years now for us with minimal maintenance), and because I could replace it for $800 or less (used).

[Don C L]

Yeah there are some advantages to outboards. Fortunately the two big disadvantages, coming out of the water in chop and poor fuel economy, have not affected me much with my set-up. I'll throw a couple shots in here, but I'd say go with the cut-out as the first option. And my lever arm DIY works really well, plenty strong and is easily hoisted with the blocks, you can kinda see them on the the mount and pushpit in the photos I think. I am able to reach over and jockey the engine around ok and I was able to raft up with a disabled buddy and move his bigger heavier 30 footer to the yard pretty easily. Couldn'ta done that if I'd had the inboard!

[john61ct]

Sweet setup there Don.

Amazed there isn't a line of those mounts available commercially.

But the other downside to outboards is no PTO / pulley alternator power, for charging when solar's not enough.

To me more sensible than carrying a little inverter genny.