What EXACTLY is a "blue water boat"?

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

On Water boats">blue water boats the cabin soles are fixed in place. How’s that?

On my Bav36 all the soles are screwed in place and shrouds have rigid rods connecting their bases to big GRP ribs glassed to the hull.

Must be blue water so

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

On blue water boats the cabin soles are fixed in place. How’s that?

huh?
Do you mean in case they are inverted, the boards don't fly around the cabin? Most of the ones I have seen still have easily removed screws and are intended to be (have to be) removeable.
In my case, with extra chain stored in the keel under the sole, I confess I have not screwed them down... I should... and if I had big travel plans I would ensure that chain (and batteries!) would not come loose to smash the cabin ceiling. My little boat is only light blue.

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

On my Bav36 all the soles are screwed in place and shrouds have rigid rods connecting their bases to big GRP ribs glassed to the hull.

Must be blue water so

My beautiful floorboards pulls up. The hatches aren’t framed. I’m not afraid to say the boat isn’t blue water.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

My beautiful floorboards pulls up. The hatches aren’t framed. I’m not afraid to say the boat isn’t blue water.

I do hope your “floors” don’t pull up , the sole boards might

[sailingabe41ds]

to me a bluewater boat is a boat that floats and sails like a rock instead of a cork.
abe

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by sailingabe41ds

to me a bluewater boat is a boat that floats and sails like a rock instead of a cork.
abe

With the exception of some airy volcanic "rocks", all the rocks I know sink, well, like a stone when dropped into the water. Desiring a boat that "floats and sails like a rock" seems ill advised to me...

Perhaps a better simile could be found?

Jim

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

With the exception of some airy volcanic "rocks", all the rocks I know sink, well, like a stone when dropped into the water. Desiring a boat that "floats and sails like a rock" seems ill advised to me...

Perhaps a better simile could be found?

Jim

Maybe he meant ferrocement...

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by mibo

Interesting. So it's all about the range? May I ask if you have ever crossed an ocean?

Half ways, North Atlantic, East from Azore twice and from mainland Europe to Iceland.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by mibo

Ok. So the quality of the boat does not matter at all. May I ask also you if you have ever crossed an ocean an on what boats/models?

The quality does matter but nobody will never agree about the quality. The tankage and storage instead are measurable and can tell what the designer has thought the boat to be used for..

[Na Mara]

Originally Posted by chrisr

just throwing this out there

nowhere in this resurrected debate about 'what is a blue water boat' has the catamaran been raised

and please don't anyone try to say something like cats are not bluewater boats. just look in any cruising anchorage first...

i've owned both and cats have definite merits v monos as bluewater boats, as they have certain disadvantages

more and more people are weighing up these pros & cons, and coming out in favour of the catamaran as a 'blue water boat'

cheers,

The bluewater criteria for cats and tris are a bit different from monos: e.g. flotation zones at the ends of the hulls, daggerboards rathe than keels, light displacement, weight centralization, high beam to length ratio, skinny hulls, high bridge deck clearance, as low windage as possible, excellent batten car system on main, etc.

Outremer are a good example of true blue water catamarans. Lagoons aren’t

[mibo]

Originally Posted by Phyrcooler

Rubbish. Please share where you get your numbers for ANY of the “facts” you noted above.

"Rudders
According to various search and rescue authorities and figures compiled by the ARC and other offshore rallies, more cruising boats have been abandoned in the last 30 years because of rudder failure than for any other reason."

Article in the Yachting World by Helen Fretter w/ Jimmy Cornell:
https://www.yachtingworld.com/cruisi...g-yacht-113123

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by mibo

"Rudders

According to various search and rescue authorities and figures compiled by the ARC and other offshore rallies, more cruising boats have been abandoned in the last 30 years because of rudder failure than for any other reason."



Article in the Yachting World by Helen Fretter w/ Jimmy Cornell:

https://www.yachtingworld.com/cruisi...g-yacht-113123

A , this isn’t about keels falling off and b the numbers are still small

Also it’s entirely possible to fabricate and store an emergency rudder. Just that few bother

[goboatingnow]

The fact is “ quality “ boats are more likely in the eye of the beholder. There are also purchasers with money who buy “ brands “ BMW, Porsche and Mercedes rely on it as do Sub zero and what not.

Yes the leather is lovely and the overall fit and finish is nice , you get customised solutions to boot. Of course this is all done by largely expensive European labour and the profit margins have to cover high overheads and low production volumes

But it your Porsche fundamentally better at getting you from A to B reliably , I would argue it isn’t.

It’s not any different with boats

A stick built boat ( a term that’s largely meaningless these days ) is only an advantage of you punch a hole in the hull etc. Out there sailing along its makes zero difference.

Your engine will be the same brand , plumbing fittings , electronics , rig , deck gear and so forth. This is because large production builders can buy this gear much cheaper then HR etc.

Yes the beautiful interior is wonderful the quality of the seat coverings a joy to behold. But fundamentally it’s a GRP boat.

( I’ve toured HR , Malo, Moody & Bavaria and Benny factories over the years )

[mibo]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

A , this isn’t about keels falling off and b the numbers are still small

Also it’s entirely possible to fabricate and store an emergency rudder. Just that few bother

Nobody said the numbers are high. They just say rudder failure is the #1 reason for rescue operations.

As for the keel point, I am sure you know the Cheeki Rafiki case and what the investigators concluded. If not:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheeki_Rafiki

Further reading here:

Keel failure: the shocking facts - Yachting World
https://www.yachtingworld.com/news/k...ng-facts-60006

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by Na Mara

The bluewater criteria for cats and tris are a bit different from monos: e.g. flotation zones at the ends of the hulls, daggerboards rathe than keels, light displacement, weight centralization, high beam to length ratio, skinny hulls, high bridge deck clearance, as low windage as possible, excellent batten car system on main, etc.

Outremer are a good example of true blue water catamarans. Lagoons aren’t

i can see there is just as much to argue about on a bluewater cat as on a bluewater mono

for instance i would dispute that daggerboards have anything at all to do with 'bluewater' ability...

cheers,