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Old 15-10-2020, 09:37   #16
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

If you really like this boat, make an offer your can afford and are comfortable with. If the fellow rejects the offer, walk away. There are a lot of boats out there looking for a home. The worst scenario is buying something you should not afford.

I think it is a cute boat with potential.
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Old 15-10-2020, 09:51   #17
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

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Another boat in the area in the same price range, but much larger. https://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/b...212029953.html
I like this boat much more than the OP's boat listing.

But, it looks like a project boat - regardless of what the listing says. The picture show that it requires a lot of re-assembly. A first time boat owner may be intimidated by that. Besides the bottom job the hull needs paining, the mast probably needs painting too, and some electrical work. Why are the batteries sitting on deck? Do they need to be replaced?

IMO a first time boat buyer is better off with a sail away condition boat. They can get used to working on it one project at a time.
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Old 15-10-2020, 10:07   #18
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

As a boat to learn to sail in around shelters coastal water this looks great. From the photos it is clear to me that this is a custom boat built buy a real boat builder not something chucked together on a budget. The woodwork is really good and design shows they know sailing. That said resale would not be easy, she is to 'different' for many people. As to 'liveabord' that is something only you can work out. I have known several people who lived on tiny boats and the 'tiny house' is becoming a real movement. I have also know people to feel really cramped on boats 3x that size. This would be the boating equivalent of living in a the sort of trailer that can be towed by a standard road car and feel like camping! I agree with the positive comments about wood stoves, they are brilliant. Try running it in charcoal bricks, easier to store, less ash and burns better than wood in very small stoves. You can burn beach wood but the salt will cause maintenance problems on the stove if used often as it produced corrosive fumes.
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Old 15-10-2020, 10:18   #19
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

I owned a Kingfisher 20+ (21'6" LOA) British built with twin bilge keels and Hasler junk rig (free -standing mast, single sail) with an outboard in a cockpit well, back in the mid-70's. My wife and I travelled about 6,000miles on that boat and owned it for about 4years. It would not have been as roomy as the boat your are looking at.
It was a good boat, sailed well and easy to handle.
The price for the one you are looking at is about 1/3 of the asking price for a Nonsuch 22, though they do have an inboard diesel. Looks a nice boat.
Also, there are the American Eagle catboats, and others of similar type.
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Old 15-10-2020, 10:26   #20
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

Lovely little boat but ill suited to the needs of the post. Where do you carry the wood required for any length of time. I burn wood at home and it is a pain. I've got a diesel furnace on my boat that seems much more convenient for purpose.

It also seems that the limited space would soon become an issue. Given the number of more spacious and conventional boats available in the price range I would opt for something else.

That said I'm able to see the charms of the fine little vessel but they can't be allowed to block the questions about practicality and ease of resale.
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Old 15-10-2020, 10:32   #21
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

It appears to be a cool little boat. It's different though, add to that it's home built and often it may be unsellable. That much money for a 21 ft, hard to sell, strange boat may be an issue. But, if it's what you want, it's what you want.

You need to do a good sea trial in some wind before finalizing the deal. Home made boats can have issues like too strong weather helm etc.
My guess is you can get a well known boat, catalina 27, cape dory 25 etc for that money or less.
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Old 15-10-2020, 10:58   #22
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

It;s a cute and unusual boat, but an odd duck. I would pass on it and get any production boat instead. Take a trip to Lynden and stop at the Sailboat wreaking yard. There are several boats there that you might like. Then at least you can compare them.
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Old 15-10-2020, 12:54   #23
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

aDemilich- I would echo Jim's earlier suggestion about staying mainstream for your 1st boat...and for perspective about 5 yrs ago I sold my 1984 Catalina 27 (w/ an inboard diesel) for $5000, admittedly here on the east coast not PNW. And of course the current owner will lower the price in november because, if sold he wont have to be out the winter storage fees.
Catalina 27's are simple boats so you can work on it & learn at the same time as it sounds like your budget is tight.
Didnt live aboard the 27 & cant speak to housing 2 cats, but the head had a door on it so could at least have some privacy from them...
We lived on Bainbridge island x 1 yr, so know it can get stinkin' cold there, maybe electric heater, but then you need shore power and a slip... cause solar in the PNW is iffy..
good luck to ya.
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Old 15-10-2020, 18:52   #24
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

ok - all the points Jim made are absolutely correct about staying mainstream etc--that said i like the boat- it touches something in me- i do think that the price is too high- offer 5200 and tell them that is every nickel you have- if they say no then tell them you will borrow 400 and up the offer to 5600- if they say no then wait a couple of months and try again with the same numbers- that boat is probably not going to sell quickly - it is a niche market
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Old 15-10-2020, 22:08   #25
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

Wow, lots of great replies here. Thank you all so much. I think I do need to come to terms with the fact that this boat simply won't have enough space for two cats along with myself. Would a Catalina 27 really offer that much more space though?
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Old 16-10-2020, 06:33   #26
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

Problem with twin keels is you must be verry sure that they both ground on the same level,and density grounding area or you may end up on your side in the mud, just a thought ⚓️⛵️
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Old 16-10-2020, 09:32   #27
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

Last night I looked at craigslist for the extended area around Seattle and Portland. There are a huge number of viable boats for good prices. My questions to the aDemilich is: Are you looking for ready to move in boat or are you OK with doing some work? and, What would you say are your mechanical and electrical skill levels?
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Old 16-10-2020, 11:24   #28
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

Thanks for the reply, stormalong. I agree that there is a huge selection of boats available in the area, which is great but also overwhelming for someone like me. I feel really lucky that everyone here is being so helpful. What a great community!

To answer your questions- I would prefer to get something that needs very little work, but I'm looking to spend around $6000 or less, so I understand that this might be unrealistic without making other compromises. My thinking is that I would get more value by paying a bit more for something that's had a lot of work done somewhat recently, rather than taking on the cost and frustration of doing all of it myself right off the bat, but with that said I know maintenance is going to be a huge part of this and I'm ready for that.

In terms of skill level, I have no real mechanical skills but am eager to learn. I'm a little more confident in my electrical skills, as I have some experience with things like recapping old circuit boards and building PCs as a hobby. To be honest I do tend to get frustrated with these sorts of projects easily, but I'm hoping that my motivation to fix things will be higher if it's my house I'm working on.

If it helps to have further context, I'm 35, single, and do remote work for a tech company, but I'm just a lowly drone and not one of the super well-paid tech guys, which you can tell by my budget.
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Old 16-10-2020, 11:47   #29
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

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Originally Posted by aDemilich View Post
Wow, lots of great replies here. Thank you all so much. I think I do need to come to terms with the fact that this boat simply won't have enough space for two cats along with myself. Would a Catalina 27 really offer that much more space though?
It is always helpful to remember that boats get bigger by adding length in the middle, not the ends. The ends are always the same - pointy and harder to get to - while the middle is where the biggest spaces are. A Catalina 27 is 6' longer than the "custom catboat" that started this thread, and the 6' is all midships, where it will provide you the most space, storage, headroom, and comfort.
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Old 16-10-2020, 12:35   #30
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Re: Seeking advice about buying this custom twin keel sailboat as a new sailor

Another comment: I note that the length to beam ratio is ~2:1, and this is very much out of normal design parameters, where >3:1 is more common practice. I suspect such a design will not sail all that well, especially to windward.

The likely reason for such a departure from orthodoxy is to maximize interior volume while maintaining a short LOA and I don't know if this is a good idea. The added costs of an additional 5 feet in LOA (as in the Cat-27 ilk) are not that great.

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