Outfitting vs. Cruise Ready Dilemma

[malbert73]

Originally Posted by zeehag

for what it is worth. i have both manual and electrical windlasses on my bow. the manual one wins hands down fro ease of use and function and reliability. good luck easy to install and dont have electrical issues.

I have a manual anchorman to bring up my 3/8 chain and 35 lb anchor. It works great and no worry about draw, wiring, failure, etc.... Use long winch handle when windy and short when calm.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by zeehag

for what it is worth. i have both manual and electrical windlasses on my bow. the manual one wins hands down fro ease of use and function and reliability. good luck easy to install and dont have electrical issues.

That's an interesting point of view, Zee. Over the years I have owned two manual and two electrical windlasses. The first manual, a Simpson-Lawrence Hy-speed, failed catastrophically in Tahiti, leaving us sorta S.O.L.. Its replacement, a Maxwell two speed manual worked well for about 10 years, then the Sprague clutches inside it failed. Fortunately, that incident was in a "civilized" place (Queensland... yeah, I know that's debatable!) and I was able to source new clutches and rebuild it successfully.

The electric models have both been Maxwells, a 1200 and 1500 VCW. The former died from corrosion of the housings, age around 15 years, but was rebuildable to as new. The 1500 had a gearbox failure after about 10 years usage quite possibly from an over load situation where we were fouled on an abandoned mooring block. Again, rebuildable to as new condition Note that we live at anchor and move fairly often, so the windlasses get a hell of a lot of use.

So, in our case, the electric models have been about as reliable as the manual ones. There is simply no comparison in "ease of use"... I am astonished at your statement to the contrary, Zee! You must have either a very excellent manual model or a very bad electric one!

Anyway, I see no reason to expect poor performance from an electric windlass.

Cheers,

Jim

[Horror Hotel]

No manual windlass could be anywhere as efficient as a maxwell. Blasphemy to insist otherwise.

[DDabs]

Is Maxwell far superior than Lewmar when it comes to windlasses?

[Horror Hotel]

I guess it all depends on what you want to spend on a windlass. My maxwell was 2k and it's by far the best money I've spent on cruising gear. I've never pulled my primary up by hand in 4 years, I don't even go out to the bow.

[DDabs]

My budget for a windlass is around 2k-2500k. I am unsure about whether vertical or horizontal will be better for my application. From what I've found online, it seems like the Lewmar V3 or a Maxwell VWC 1500. I am still doing alot of homework on windlasses.

[TacomaSailor]

Defender
Maxwell 1200 VWC $2824
Cables 1/0 60 feet $ 360
terminal connectors (8) $ 32
control switch $ 70
hi amp on/off switch $ 30
tax $ 240

Installation time - about 12 hours ($750 or so)

I would not go smaller than the VWC 1200 or the 1/0 cable.

The VWC 1200 has served Mirador well for 19 years as long as there are two people aboard to operate it.

[Oregon Waterman]

Originally Posted by TacomaSailor

Defender
Maxwell 1200 VWC $2824
Cables 1/0 60 feet $ 360
terminal connectors (8) $ 32
control switch $ 70
tax $ 240

Installation time - about 12 hours ($750 or so)

I would not go smaller than the VWC 1200 or the 1/0 cable.

The VWC 1200 has served Mirador well for 19 years as long as there are two people aboard to operate it.

@277 NM's a year at that!

Wow.

[TacomaSailor]

Originally Posted by Oregon Waterman

@277 NM's a year at that!

Wow.

WHAT?

Are you still annoyed with me and want to diminish our cruising experience?

You are right - we've only done about 15,000 mile in the last 19 years BUT -

My logs show we've spent over 1,600 nights anchored - can I use that as a basis for a semi-qualified comment on the Maxwell windlass?

[robert sailor]

Rough crowd!

[chall]

Originally Posted by Oregon Waterman

@277 NM's a year at that!

Wow.

From someone who was done with this thread

Like you said, different people cruise and sail differently. Have a sail, pour a rum, relax and let it go man.

[Horror Hotel]

The C in VWC adds a bit of cost I have a VW1500, bit bigger and without the hawser hole. Mine chain goes down a stainless stand pipe that I fabbed up my self. Other than that our cost are very similar. I have cockpit controls and and no chain counter ($550 more) so I have a bit of flat webbing wove through at 4' from the anchor. When I see the webbing, I stop the chain, hit the autopilot, and go forward to lash it down. Easy to do for 1 person, but mainly done with 2.

[Oregon Waterman]

Originally Posted by chall

From someone who was done with this thread

Like you said, different people cruise and sail differently. Others buy big, expensive boats, outfit them to cruise the world and never leave the dock. Have a sail, pour a rum, relax and let it go man.

FTFY

Yeah but I have used this thread to show others how humans throw money at things, not only to feel safer, perhaps make life easier but just because its easier than thinking.
I used to restore vintage guitars, real vintage-pre 1934 only. A customer would come in with their Holy Grail guitar and get a full restoration because it was this guitar that would make them Jimmy Page or whom ever their guitar god was. This guitar would have "that" tone they were seeking. They would get the guitar, love it yet hardly play it. Within in a few months, they would walk back through the door with the next Holy Grail guitar, this one for sure!

But these kids never saw that it wasn't the guitar, it was the lack of playing, practice, talent and dedication to the instrument. They would never experience what worked and what didn't because they didn't play any guitar enough to really learn its nuances.
Yes, the 'player' had it all, everything that Jimmy had, guitars, amps, pedals, tens of thousands of dollars spent along the way to become something they would never be. You can't buy talent nor experience. I loved my patrons but I always expressed these exact thoughts to them as I counted the cash they handed me. My advice was rarely taken but I did retire at 40 so I have that going for me.

This is no different. You can't swear to what works in our harsh marine environment if its only been tested at the dock. I can't take any one seriously who dropped a half mil on a cruising boat and after *5.5k NM docks the boat.

I have played in the Ocean since I was 4. I celebrate 48 years of board surfing March 1st. I have crewed over 20k, sailed my own more than 15k solo, recently paddled a 12'6" SUP 550 miles down from Oregon to Santa Cruz just because I thought I could. I am shaking down my own boat now in hopes of getting her to Manzanillo in the Spring. I am on the dock daily talking to the salts, the sailors with the worn boats having just returned from some far away island. I listen to them, live their stories as they tell them. I heed their advice because I respect what they have done and how they did it. I can see it in their boats. Just a few days back, I watched a sailor service his winches and I am now doing my own-having never had one apart but I did watch intently and took notes.

I don't know everything about boats/the ocean/cruising. I am the last guy you would ask about the ICW (America ends at I 5 for me). You won't see me in threads about the Atlantic passages or Europe/The Med/Africa. I know nothing about those and do not need to.
But I do think for myself and I am usually capable of self rescue. In spite of my thoughts expressed ITT, I am very open minded.
I get that there are always other ways of doing things.
Anything.

Consider me the other end of the cruising spectrum from Mr. Tacoma, he can spend money on gear for cruising, investing in all of the latest and greatest gear for cruisers and their boats. He documents EVERYTHING.

Me? I will build it, fab it, find it used or plain old make do before I part with so much as a dollar. And when I do part with that dollar, you can bet the gear was lightly used after purchase, maintained very well and most likely put up for sale by a cruiser such as Mr. Tacoma.
At 1/3rd of new.
I am no math wizard but I think I am making out ok here.

I will tip my hat to Mr. Tacoma, he spoke of hauling a rode/anchor as being way too hard for any mortal to do so a powered windlass is a must.... so I spent a few days setting the bow (35 lb.)and the stern anchor (35 lb.) and then hauling them up by hand, in our silty sand bottomed bay no less. Sometimes, I didn't even use gloves! Just wasn't the difficult chore he made it out to be and I benefited greatly from the practice, learned a lot about my boat, cleaned my gear and can now drop both, set them and get them up and safely stored (200' feet/50 chain/150 rope) in thirty minutes if I don't hurry (who hurries on a boat?).

Now back to Op, he is way overthinking this boat of his, his travel plans, his very major purchases of electronics...in my opinion. I get that he is excited...I get it, I really do...but....Every one here in this thread is doing his thinking for him-my opinion. Every question he has asked could have been answered via google, the myriad of websites and information out here in the 'tubes, using his own knowledge and learning as he went. Research is fun, learning is fun.

Gear reviews? maybe CF is a better some than some but only if that gear has been tested and used. Which leads us back to the dock where Mirador has sat for a few years. I can't take any thoughts Mr. Tacoma has too seriously, not only about gear but sailing in general. I have more NM's under me than he does. Doesn't make me a "better" anything, not my point nor my mission in life. But the student listens to the teacher, as long as the teacher knows more than the student.

Now Mr. Boatguy I think, the delivery skipper in Portugal or Europe, that man is worth listening to and I have a feeling he and I could while away some hours and I would steal every thing he knows.

I feel you get more knowledge and thought from the raggedy Cheoy Lee that limps into port, the skipper finishing up yet another Hawaii/Oregon run, sails torn, sheets pilled, down to signal flags and the emergency rudder than the high value and Bristol production boat that is some how as new after 19 years.
One boat sailed obviously and one did not.
Pick your teacher.

Now, do the right thing and always make good choices.

Love, Oregon Waterman




*Number was 5k on the website, says its 15k ITT, don't care, it ain't enough for me, hell, I have twice that and I am still seeking and researching.

[Horror Hotel]

Waterman you have it all wrong, a 2k winch is not expensive. A 8k winch is expensive, your raging battle is so pointless.

[Oregon Waterman]

Originally Posted by Horror Hotel

Waterman you have it all wrong, a 2k winch is not expensive. A 8k winch is expensive, your raging battle is so pointless.

Let me guffaw here, no battle man, no rage either. Rats ass is what I give about this thread really.
And 2k for a winch is nuts, 8k is down right stupid.