Older balsa cored hull?

[cpt_757]

I had pretty confident about my '85 balsa hull boat, now you are talking about '87, made make me worry about my '85.

[KingBuffalo]

Originally Posted by cpt_757

I had pretty confident about my '85 balsa hull boat, now you are talking about '87, made make me worry about my '85.

Sorry

[NevisDog]

Originally Posted by cpt_757

I had pretty confident about my '85 balsa hull boat, now you are talking about '87, made make me worry about my '85.

I've read the S2 is a great boat but those comments early on (post #5) from a boat repair guy saying some are well built and some have original defects due poor workmanship (as with other cored hulls he's repaired) is telling. Any balsa cored hull must come at a 'discount' if only because of slight future risk of water absorption, as with any balsa deck of course.

[Paul J. Nolan]

Originally Posted by KingBuffalo

...this will be my first big boat and I'm not wealthy.

If you're not wealthy, you shouldn't buy a big boat. You describe yourself as a "know-nothing noob" and you are fearful enough about the purchase of this boat to seek guidance from an internet forum. You are making a mistake particularly common to first time boat buyers: buying too big. If you are alone or part of a couple, a Contessa 26 or Albin Vega is a good choice. If you have a family, then an Alberg 30 or a Pearson Vanguard would be good. All are in the $5,000 to $12,000 range. You should not be fearful when buying a boat. If you are, listen to your emotion and heed it! Buy a good, smaller boat, enjoy her, and learn the sport. When you have more experience, confidence, and money, then buy the big boat.

[cpt_757]

Originally Posted by KingBuffalo

Will the surveyor be able to detect any moisture infiltration in the hull? I guess my biggest concern is that there might be damage in the hull core that won't be found until the hull is cooked. I'm probably paranoid but this will be my first big boat and I'm not wealthy.

Yes, they can do with drilling, usually a deck not a hull, especially snowy area.
A surveyor will be able to tell a condition of hull when you do the out of water survey which is a good investment.
Do a survey before you buy which will satisfy and answer your question.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by gamayun

I have a 1988 Freedom, which is a balsa core design on the deck and is the type of boat that many people say should be avoided. What I believe is that it really depends on how the deck fittings were done. If the original was solidly constructed and the fittings well bedded, then the balsa should be dry. If the OP has made a lot of changes and has not bedded the fittings well, then this could cause water ingress. If it is the latter, this also may not be too bad, if caught soon and corrected before too much damage; so again, it just depends.

I thought the Freedoms were cored hulls also?

[cpt_757]

Also, mine has Bolton keel, i ask my boat mechanics to check them certain time period.
Sounds like you already start worrying about your future boat, even you have something close to perfect, you need to have a lot of attentions after you purchase one.

[Cheechako]

A) dont take for granted that builders do the right thing where fittings are concerned on cored hulls. How often do they do it for deck fittings? Maybe the cleats.
B) I'm guessing that most surveyors are going to find spots that dont "quite ring correctly" on a cored hull. So you may know a little more, but not enough to know if it's a big problem. It's also heavily in a surveyors favor to mention a core problem "just in case".
C) Any indication of a core problem when you decide to sell will lose you a lot of money. The last cored hull I bought.(it was 7 years old) we had agreed on $110k. After survey I should have walked but bought it for $65k as is.

[cpt_757]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

A) dont take for granted that builders do the right thing where fittings are concerned on cored hulls. How often do they do it for deck fittings? Maybe the cleats.
B) I'm guessing that most surveyors are going to find spots that dont "quite ring correctly" on a cored hull. So you may know a little more, but not enough to know if it's a big problem. It's also heavily in a surveyors favor to mention a core problem "just in case"..

Not only deck, hull. Through hull fitting.
Last time I checked mine were fine

[lifeofreilly57]

Only as good as the way it was cared for.
I sold my last cored hulled boat a few years back, it was a 1979 vintage boat, the surveyor was amazed at how dry the hull and deck was.
But, the original owner was meticulous in his care and I was too, and it showed. Deck fittings rebedded every 5 years on a rotating schedule, through hulls pulled, inspected and rebedded every 5 years. Hatches, portlights, etc, etc serviced before they leaked. Any new mounting holes in the deck drilled, core routed out and the area around the holes filled with a thickened epoxy mix then drilled for mounting. Chainplates removed, core material routed out 3/4" around the through deck slot, filled with thickened epoxy then slots recut, the chainplates in the slots were sealed with butyl rubber since it's the only thing I've found that will not harden up and crack.
Keeping water intrusion out of the core is key, once in the core it will cause delamination, especially if the boat is in a location that sees freezing winters, like mine was.
Very few people will maintain their boats to that level, which is why cored boats in general get a bad rap, it's not the boat or design usually, it's the owner.
How was this boat maintained?

[gamayun]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

I thought the Freedoms were cored hulls also?

Yes, you're right. The hull is cored except for about 12" on either side of the keel, which is solid. Seriously solid, too. I believe that covers most of the through hulls, but I need to check this on next haul out.

[gamayun]

Originally Posted by lifeofreilly57

Only as good as the way it was cared for.
I sold my last cored hulled boat a few years back, it was a 1979 vintage boat, the surveyor was amazed at how dry the hull and deck was.
But, the original owner was meticulous in his care and I was too, and it showed. Deck fittings rebedded every 5 years on a rotating schedule, through hulls pulled, inspected and rebedded every 5 years. Hatches, portlights, etc, etc serviced before they leaked. Any new mounting holes in the deck drilled, core routed out and the area around the holes filled with a thickened epoxy mix then drilled for mounting. Chainplates removed, core material routed out 3/4" around the through deck slot, filled with thickened epoxy then slots recut, the chainplates in the slots were sealed with butyl rubber since it's the only thing I've found that will not harden up and crack.
Keeping water intrusion out of the core is key, once in the core it will cause delamination, especially if the boat is in a location that sees freezing winters, like mine was.
Very few people will maintain their boats to that level, which is why cored boats in general get a bad rap, it's not the boat or design usually, it's the owner.
How was this boat maintained?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by gamayun

Yes, you're right. The hull is cored except for about 12" on either side of the keel, which is solid. Seriously solid, too. I believe that covers most of the through hulls, but I need to check this on next haul out.

Hi, the through hulls on the Freedoms don't go through the solid backbone, they go through the core, or at least they did on mine.
I drilled a number of holes through the core over the years, never found any wet balsa.
Freedom like many manufactors didn't attach deck fittings as well as they should have in my opinion, never found any core drilled out and filled then redrilled for deck fittings, all were just bedded with some sort of goo, which only seals for so long.

I always drill and fill prior to adding something BUT i still never had a problem regarding wet core on the bits that weren't done this way. This led me to believe that the end grain definately limits water intrusion unless there's some delaminating allowing water to run across the top between the core and glass? i definately could be wrong.

I met a guy that had build a big balsa cored power cat, his third build. He left a piece of duracore ( or equivalent, i dont know) in the paddock on his farm deliberately to see how it faired over the years. When he collected it some time later it had not rotted although its unsealed perimeter had been exposed for several years to weather, water had not worked its way in against the grain.
I never saw his experiment so i can definately not varify how true this is.

[gamayun]

Originally Posted by daletournier

Hi, the through hulls on the Freedoms don't go through the solid backbone, they go through the core, or at least they did on mine.
I drilled a number of holes through the core over the years, never found any wet balsa.
Freedom like many manufactors didn't attach deck fittings as well as they should have in my opinion, never found any core drilled out and filled then redrilled for deck fittings, all were just bedded with some sort of goo, which only seals for so long.

I always drill and fill prior to adding something BUT i still never had a problem regarding wet core on the bits that weren't done this way. This led me to believe that the end grain definately limits water intrusion unless there's some delaminating allowing water to run across the top between the core and glass? i definately could be wrong.

I met a guy that had build a big balsa cored power cat, his third build. He left a piece of duracore ( or equivalent, i dont know) in the paddock on his farm deliberately to see how it faired over the years. When he collected it some time later it had not rotted although its unsealed perimeter had been exposed for several years to weather, water had not worked its way in against the grain.
I never saw his experiment so i can definately not varify how true this is.

I have not redone the thru hulls but have cut a hole for the new transducer on the bow. It was solid glass. My Freedom is a 1988, if that makes a difference. I am starting to rebed all deck fittings, as you're right about them being installed with just caulk of some sort, but I also have not found any wet core, even with some hinky PO installs.