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Old 20-01-2025, 10:45   #1
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Newbie Shorthand

Ok, I've been through a merry dance to the point I can now sail and nearly know what I am doing some of the time.



I was hoping the family would be keen but after chartering in the canaries, they aren't convinced it's for them. So I'm down to single handing with occasional mates and short jaunts with possible north channel crossings to Scotland.


I need a boat that can handle a lively sea state but want it as small as possible without being completely miserable. Being able to stand up at 6ft 2" would be a bonus.



I'm looking at a few options:


Rival 32
Nicholson 31
Vancouver 28


The Rival looks easier to run around the wide side decks, the Nich I have sailed and I'm impressed although darker than the Rival inside. The Vancouver in theory should be easier to single hand being smaller but the narrow side decks look sketchy and why is it so expensive? Berthing is probably my biggest fear and realise I've not done myself any favours with the long keel obsession.


Thoughts?
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Old 20-01-2025, 11:31   #2
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

I can't help with your 3 choices but in general things I'd look for 1st is berthing. No point in buying a boat if there's no place close to keep it.

Headroom. I'm 6'1" and the 1st thing I look for is standing headroom. It's misewrable being hunched over and this includes the cockpit too.
Wide easy to move around on decks is very good especially singlehanding.
Diesel motor.
Sit inside and imagine where you're going to put all of your stuff. Can you find places for it? Clothes? Foulies? Food stuffs? Tools? Spare parts? etc.

I also look for a large bulwark or good toerail. Something to let you know your're at the end of the boat.

Are you planning on a dinghy? Liferaft? Where are they going to go.


As you step onboard is it tippy or more solid? Tippy you're going to bounce around a lot which you may find fun or not.


Dark interior. No problem. Paint it white. I still have some wood inside my boat that are trim pieces. They highlight the white walls which really makes a difference.


Are all lines led aft?
Electric windlass? Can it be operate from the cockpit?
Roller furlers?


Assuming it has a VHF radio on it. Probably mounted inside. Does it have or can you add a remote microphone? Inside the companionway is barely ok if things are going well. Not ok when things are not and you can't leave the helm.


Just a few thoughts for you. Good luck


1 last one. A smaller catamaran. Maybe 35-38 feet long. Your family might have not enjoyed the heeling portion but would love a level deck. Maybe charter one of those with them in a nice sunny warm area and see how that goes. My ex couldn't handle a monohull. Got seasick at the dock. Loved catamarans tho.
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Old 20-01-2025, 13:41   #3
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Sounds like you are somewhere in EU/UK. Let us know,pls.
There are EU/UK folks on here that are ,perhaps, more familiar with vessels & conditions unique to your area. Us N. Americans can still offer good advice on many things,but some of us are limited in our knowledge of your local conditions.
No offense intended to any contributor.
Welcome & Cheers/Len East Canada
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Old 20-01-2025, 13:50   #4
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Since you ask for thoughts :-)

My preference would be for the Vancouver 28, but that's because I was "present at the birth" all those years ago :-)

Operationally there isn't much to choose between three boats. If you wife isn't keen on sailing - boats heel, donchaknow? - then, from her perspective, any one of them is as bad as the other two.

Now, if my sixth sense is not betraying me, the nearest marina to where you are, would be Dun Laoghaire. Piecacake that marina.

All three boats are tiller steered. Whatever you do, DON'T covert to wheel steering!

The first two things you have to learn to do when you get the boat is to 1) make sternway with confidence and competence. 2) Do a "pirouette" with confidence and competence. Both maneuvres are a lot easier to execute with a tiller than with a wheel.

"A pirouette" is turning the boat through 360º while remaining stationary in relation to some such thing as the end of a pier or a pontoon. The Rival might be easier to do it in, but because it has a very large propeller aperture the Vancouver does it handsomely.

Americans call this maneuvre "backing and filling", which of course it isn't. "Backing and filling" is something you do in square-riggers.

If you fear berthing, then it's high time you get a knowledgeable seafaring man to take you in hand. And Dun Laoghaire would be a very good place to do it!

All the best to you :-)!

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Old 20-01-2025, 15:45   #5
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Welcome to CruisersForum!

I would suggest updating your profile with your general location and your boat make & model or “Looking” or Looking to Crew" in the "Boat" category. This info shows up under your UserName in every post in the web view. Many questions are boat and/or location dependent and having these tidbits under your UserName saves answering those questions repeatedly. If you need help setting up your profile then click on this link: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3308797

I would happily help more if the link above is not enough.

Regarding the boat:
What's your budget?

Westerly Centaur. Headroom is 5-11. Lots made. Bilge-keel means it can live on a mooring in shallower water and you can careen it to clean the bottom.
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Old 20-01-2025, 16:16   #6
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpt Mark View Post

. . .

Just a few thoughts for you. Good luck


1 last one. A smaller catamaran. Maybe 35-38 feet long. Your family might have not enjoyed the heeling portion but would love a level deck. Maybe charter one of those with them in a nice sunny warm area and see how that goes. My ex couldn't handle a monohull. Got seasick at the dock. Loved catamarans tho.


Be sure your vessel is equipped with one of these, called a clinometer, also know as a Sailing Discomfort Gauge.

My wife loves sailing but does not like it if I go half a bubble off, literally or figuratively.

I believe she would like to get one of the canting mast sailboats where the hull remains level and the mast tilts to allow the sail to spill towards windward. No tilt boat, very innovative and exceptionally comfortable for newbies.
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Old 20-01-2025, 16:38   #7
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Yeah Marc
Biggest disappointment about my "retiree sailing life".
My wife really tried-but she was never comfortable in a leaning sailboat-always nervous-having no fun-she/we tried everything.
She encouraged me to go by myself whenever.
This became "no fun" for me.
Our children & spouses & grandchildren love & look after the boat,& I am welcome anytime.
My wife has put up with me for near 55 yrs. / L
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Old 20-01-2025, 21:26   #8
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Quote:
Originally Posted by deblen View Post
Sounds like you are somewhere in EU/UK. Let us know,pls.
...
Welcome & Cheers/Len East Canada
The UK and EU are now separated by many many more miles of sea since the bridge was burnt and a flotilla of tugboats hooked up northern Scotland and then towed Great Britain way way further out into the Atlantic. The operation was called Toexit.
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Old 21-01-2025, 02:45   #9
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpt Mark View Post
I can't help with your 3 choices but in general things I'd look for 1st is berthing. No point in buying a boat if there's no place close to keep it.

Headroom. I'm 6'1" and the 1st thing I look for is standing headroom. It's misewrable being hunched over and this includes the cockpit too.
Wide easy to move around on decks is very good especially singlehanding.
Diesel motor.
Sit inside and imagine where you're going to put all of your stuff. Can you find places for it? Clothes? Foulies? Food stuffs? Tools? Spare parts? etc.

I also look for a large bulwark or good toerail. Something to let you know your're at the end of the boat.

Are you planning on a dinghy? Liferaft? Where are they going to go.


As you step onboard is it tippy or more solid? Tippy you're going to bounce around a lot which you may find fun or not.


Dark interior. No problem. Paint it white. I still have some wood inside my boat that are trim pieces. They highlight the white walls which really makes a difference.


Are all lines led aft?
Electric windlass? Can it be operate from the cockpit?
Roller furlers?


Assuming it has a VHF radio on it. Probably mounted inside. Does it have or can you add a remote microphone? Inside the companionway is barely ok if things are going well. Not ok when things are not and you can't leave the helm.


Just a few thoughts for you. Good luck


1 last one. A smaller catamaran. Maybe 35-38 feet long. Your family might have not enjoyed the heeling portion but would love a level deck. Maybe charter one of those with them in a nice sunny warm area and see how that goes. My ex couldn't handle a monohull. Got seasick at the dock. Loved catamarans tho.


Good points Cpt Mark, thanks for the reply. Another option would be to go really small, like a 21 ft etap which doesnt need a life raft and forget about straying too far from the coast. I'm kind of lost as to where to go now since the family aren't keen.


The family wouldn't have been any different in a Cat tho, my 10YO was bored and my wife found it a bit stressfull due to her nervous nature.
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Old 21-01-2025, 02:50   #10
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Quote:
Originally Posted by deblen View Post
Sounds like you are somewhere in EU/UK. Let us know,pls.
There are EU/UK folks on here that are ,perhaps, more familiar with vessels & conditions unique to your area. Us N. Americans can still offer good advice on many things,but some of us are limited in our knowledge of your local conditions.
No offense intended to any contributor.
Welcome & Cheers/Len East Canada

Updated my profile, thanks.
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Old 21-01-2025, 02:57   #11
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelie View Post
Welcome to CruisersForum!

I would suggest updating your profile with your general location and your boat make & model or “Looking” or Looking to Crew" in the "Boat" category. This info shows up under your UserName in every post in the web view. Many questions are boat and/or location dependent and having these tidbits under your UserName saves answering those questions repeatedly. If you need help setting up your profile then click on this link: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3308797

I would happily help more if the link above is not enough.

Regarding the boat:
What's your budget?

Westerly Centaur. Headroom is 5-11. Lots made. Bilge-keel means it can live on a mooring in shallower water and you can careen it to clean the bottom.



Budget is about £15-£20K in good condition. I like the idea of Bilge keels, particularly if not straying far. I'm not experienced enough to know best practice of beaching but I do like the concept.
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Old 21-01-2025, 08:36   #12
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Re: Newbie Shorthand

Quote:
Originally Posted by grantmc View Post
The UK and EU are now separated by many many more miles of sea since the bridge was burnt and a flotilla of tugboats hooked up northern Scotland and then towed Great Britain way way further out into the Atlantic. The operation was called Toexit.

That means Canada is getting closer to UK! Great!
We are going to have a lot of export products,not needed by our close neighbour.
Probably going cheap. / L
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