Lifting a 30ft-er on Cradle onto a Flatbed (without a crane)

[xxxxx]

Originally Posted by ebisucapt

I see 2 problems with your plan. Not sure PL is a good choice as if the glue don't get air it can take days, weeks even for it to set up. and second will 12' be long enough for cribbing and still get the trailer under it? I did similar with my boat at 7000lbs. but it as on a trailer and needed to get the trailer out from under it. I pulled the trailer up on boards used 2- 4x12s on the front 14'long the trailer barely made it out between the cribbing. For the back made a heavy duty saw horse.


Greg

Hey Greg,


The trailer was 104" OAW. So, with the cribbing in place, I ended up using 12'6" steel beams. That gave me lots of clearance.


Also, if memory serves me, PL is moisture-cured rather than air-cured. I may be mistaken.


Either way, the wood beam would have been nearly twice the height of steel, which would have created more undesirable forces...so I elected to use steel I-beams in place. Worked out well

[xxxxx]

Originally Posted by skipper53

Would think your laminated beams will be sufficient. Or, maybe you can find large timbers 10x10 or 12x12 ......

Hey Skipper, thanks for taking the time to reply buddy!



So, I think you're right that the 12" beams I had in mind would have been sufficient. I bet they're even stronger than the I-beams I used.


I decided to use the steel I-beams because they were half the height of the wooden ones I planned on building--and the same cost (used). I figured they'd be more stable this way.



I wouldn't discourage the next guy from using wood, though.

[xxxxx]

Originally Posted by LouK

If you’re near a boatyard, why not see if you can rent some of their jack stands? Raise and block, drive trailer under and place on more jack stands. Use steel channels with u-bolts to secure the stands to each other. Deliver & reverse process. You’ll have to coordinate the spacing of the stands with the width of the trailer, but hey it might work out.

I think this is what I'll do next time... I plan on building a new cradle/trailer system, and in order to transfer it over I think I'll need to rent jack stands!


I am also considering a u-bolt configuration for the next time I have to do this (hopefully never!)



Thanks LouK!

[xxxxx]

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Plenty of ways of doing it, chances of anyone getting killed are about as good as having a tree fall on you or the Trumpster making good his idle threat...

With a little forethought, load and unload together should take less than 10 hours.

What's a 'high-lift jack'?

Thanks pal! I think you're right. Slow and steady is the name of the game with this type of thing.


Loading was from ~630pm-midnight, and then unloading was from around 7am-noon. A little longer than your estimate, but the unloading was unfortunately a solo operation.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Are your bottle jacks standard 'pump up to raise, turn a valve to lower'?

Yessir!

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

I've done this a bunch of times, though the biggest was 27' and 4 tons. They were also all powerboats, and none had cradles.

I think it's the same concept either way. The only difference might be the clearance needed because of the keel. But even then, all things being equal, it's just more "reps" of jacking and cribbing.


Lift an inch, crib an inch.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

A quick question. How will you orient your beam for the lift?

I ended up orienting them perpendicular to the trailer, aka port to starboard.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Given the your equipment situation, if I understand your intent, the biggest problem will not be lifting but lowering. To simultaneously lower two separate bottle jacks will be virtually impossible, which will necessitate your proposed one inch increments...

Very astute... it was more difficult to lower due to the jack "bottoming out" (and also it was solo as mentioned). The method was to move in a clockwise motion, 1.5" at a time.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

For a 9' cradle probably the most you could hope for is about 2" per shift, though trial and error could get a little more.

That's about all I got. Most of the time, the thickness of a 2x4 (1.5") and some times a bit more.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

The trailer itself can often also be used to aid in lifting/lowering operations, by appropriately raising or lowering the tongue and/or blocking/jacking the rear or deflating and inflating tires.

I attempted to remove the fenders. This would have allowed me about 6" more clearance. Unfortunately, I was unable to.


Instead, we removed gravel from under the path of the wheels. We gained about 4-5" there.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

If you wind up using bottle jacks, some sort of shoe will be probably be necessary to distribute the load across each end of the beam.

You're right and that's something we considered ahead of time. We did a test run to see how the steel would react. Thankfully, whoever made this cradle used .250 steel, which did not deflect whatsoever. We were able to get away with not using a shoe.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Don't know what 'PL' is, but if the beams are properly oriented for the lift and have the correct number of through bolts, I might be more inclined to use coarse sand as the 'adhesive'.

PL is a high strength (particularly in shear as used in a laminated beam) urethane adhesive made by LePage. It's a construction adhesive.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Regarding reinforcing the cradle, you'll have to determine that the existing reinforcements are sound and add what you think are necessary. Even with 'reinforcements', a failure at any single point will likely result in catastrophic failure, so perhaps some additional bracing supporting the hull itself, if it can be securely arranged, might be more in order.

After this suggestion, I went back and measured the through-bolts, and examined the welds. I also researched careening during low tides. Ultimately, did not feel reinforcements were necessary...and they weren't.

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

At any rate, for traveling such short distances, I'd just stay off interstates (is that what they call them in Canada?) and keep it below 50 mph.

My max speed was ~50kph/30mph.... real slow


Thank you jimbunyard. I am only replying now, but I did read your reply several days ago and seriously considered your suggestions.

[xxxxx]

Originally Posted by pcmm

Don't forget you're likely going to need to get permits to do the haul as you're over 8'6" in width are you going to be under 12ft in total hieght? it's much easier to just pay for the haul. They'll have insurance too. Maybe try to work a cash deal!

The height limit here is 4.15m (~13'7"). The max height was way, way lower than that. The route was pre-planned to avoid any low-overhead passages.


A cash deal is a great idea for the future. Thanks pcmm!



You're right, it's much easier to just pay for it to be done. I lost sleep during the weeks leading up to this. If I hadn't been strapped for time (and cash...) I'd have just paid someone.


The reasonable quote fell through after all, so $750 was no longer an option. It was either $1612 or $4108 (taxes in)...that was quoted through uShip.


Thanks for the constructive input man!

[xxxxx]

Originally Posted by StoneCrab

I did this with an equipment trailer pulled by a dump truck. The yard lifted the vessel with the travel lift. A fork truck was able to get the cradle onto the trailer. The travel lift placed the vessel into the cradle. It was easy enough to secure it to the trailer.

Height above the road is a concern. It is worth measuring your maximum height and driving the route with obstructions in mind. If you measure anything over 13'-6" be extra careful. That is the normal max height before your load is considered oversize requiring an escort and special routing (if you do the move officially). Power lines, bridges, lights are supposed to be above this height.

Excellent advice.


Thanks StoneCrab!

[Rod B]

Well done XXXXX, if you listen to a lot of advice offered you would never get out of bed. Enthusiasm, energy and imagination rules.
Good job. Enjoy your sailing!

[mf70]

What a story! Plan, go slow, and watch for surprises.


Thanks for letting us in on the process.

[BobMc]

The Bristol (RI) Yacht Club does this every year for its members. Never actually saw it in action when I lived there for three years, but a friend had a sailboat (less than 30 feet) which he moved to his yard every fall and back into the water in the spring, all using a flat bed truck, jacks and wood beams. Perhaps you can find someone who has some actual experience using this method to give you advice.

[Mr B]

Just seen this thread, other wise I would have chimed in earlier,
I got a house mover with his hydraulic truck to move my boat,
34 foot long and 14 feet wide, Catamaran,
He slid his trailer under my boat, put beams across it and then just lifted it,
No jacks, cranes or any thing else,
All done with his hydraulic truck,
Unloading was the same,
Came with pilot and every thing else that was needed,
But it did cost me a Grand, AUD,
Mine wasnt a DIY as it was too wide, I needed permits to move it,
Start to finish, About 3 hours and moved about 5 miles,

Same boat, Same type of truck, moved 700 miles, Was 8 Grand AUD,

[Boatwright]

Originally Posted by Rod B

If you're concerned about using wooden beams, I would have some concerns, use steel. "I" beam and "c" channel, they offer the addition advantage that they can be bolted to the cradle. Wood is great for blocking. Use substantial U bolts to secure beams to cradle box section. This is how I did mine, 8500lbs. Bit at a time, block, block, block as you go. Looks like you have the rest sorted.Attachment 209993

Look around for some used steel I beams. You are going to end up paying a about $200 for the 10 2 x 12's.

HOWEVER, IMO the cradle looks a bit light for travel. OK for storage with the weight on the keel. Our local yard, which uses cradles for storage, moves boats on a hydraulic trailer with stout bracing legs made out of 6" square steel tube to take the side loads of moving boats 1/4 mile from storage to the launching slip. The cradle stays in the yard.

Also IMO, I'd pay the pros to move it. By the time you get done fooling around doing it yourself you could have earned the money doing a part-time job.

[robwilk37]

fun day right? still remember the moment when the last corner touched-down?
the next time youll have that feeling is the moment the keel touches water. enjoy...

[dreadecf]

Most cradles are not designed for lateral loads. I had to pay extra for my Alberg 30 cradle that has been designed for flatbed transport. Also I have a transport Canada shipping slip Alberg 30 12000 lbs. 9000 must be a minimum weight.

[dreadecf]

cid:CCDE45D2-A0CF-42BB-8E9D-DD1C7182E9A7

[rla]

Hi, I am concerned that you are not aware of the loads on your boat via the cradle.
By propping cribbing under the corners a high percentage of the boat load is going through the steady pads. Are there bulkheads putting that force into the boat structure ? With that type of cradle 90% of the boat load should be through the keel, with the pads resisting rotation ONLY. To lift it you must put the supports under the keel area and not the corners.