Kirsten Neuschafer Cape George 36 @ 7.9 knots

[thomm225]

So she is like 55 miles behind 2nd place racer Tony Abhilash (Rustler 36) in the RTW Golden Globe 2022 Race and is sailing above hull speed.

The winds must be quite strong.

https://goldengloberace.com/live-tracker/

[psk125]

Waves will do that too. Our speedo got pegged at 12 knots down the faces of waves in the Marblehead-Halifax race on a boat whose waterline was less than 40'. Hull speed would have been less than 8 knots. Hope her boat (and she) can take the wear & tear.

[thomm225]

She has a rather short waterline at 31.5' on her full keel Cape George 36, and the boat displaces 23,300 lbs. before it's loaded for the RTW race so the wind must be up quite a bit.

Her boat is only 10.5' in the beam though

She's now within about 32 miles or so of Tony Abhilash on his Rustler 36 so they will soon be in the same wind and conditions which will give us more information for comparison but without knowing their sail selection etc.

Rustler 36 LWL is 26.92

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/cape-george-36

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/rustler-36

[boatman61]

She'll be lighter than at the start and every week she'll get lighter and faster.. also nearly 5ft longer Wl than the Rustler.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by boatman61

She'll be lighter than at the start and every week she'll get lighter and faster.. also nearly 5ft longer Wl than the Rustler.

Yeah more waterline than the Rustler but over 6,500 lbs. heavier which is about what my entire boat weighs.

But that might also be good in rough conditions like where they are sailing

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Yeah more waterline than the Rustler but over 6,500 lbs. heavier which is about what my entire boat weighs.

But that might also be good in rough conditions like where they are sailing

But with around 200ft more sail area to compensate.. tied to the longer wl it kinda balances out in favour of the Cape George I would say

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by boatman61

But with around 200ft more sail area to compensate.. tied to the longer wl it kinda balances out in favour of the Cape George I would say

Yeah looks like it but after the last GGR 2018 she and others were rating the Rustler 36 as the boat to have after it won and had several more that completed the race. (even though the Skipper had ton's of racing experience folks tend to still attach a lot to the boat)

In distance racing however many times it's the weather and your position on the course that determines who will end up ahead.

Just look at Simon Curwen who is like 700 miles ahead of 2nd and 3rd sailing a Biscay 36.

Kirsten Neushafer did though have to stop an assist a fellow sailor that had to abandon ship which cost her some time

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/biscay-36

I believe it wasn't until her team realized there were no Rustler 36's available she went to Newfoundland to get her Cape George 36 then did the refit on PEI Canada

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN_fGTBJui4&t=997s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyJWiIj8EJg

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Yeah more waterline than the Rustler but over 6,500 lbs. heavier which is about what my entire boat weighs.

But that might also be good in rough conditions like where they are sailing

The extra weight means the Cape George will be harder to push up to a point. But given enough wind, there's adequate power available to overcome that and the higher theoretical top speed from the longer waterline becomes an advantage. With a 7.5 kt hull speed, if she's doing 7.9, then there's definitely some good wind available to push that boat for pretty much all it can do.



Stuff like this is also why it's a bit hard to truly say what sailboat is faster than another. There are plenty of generalizations, ways to analyze it (such as PHRF), etc. But that all looks at the overall picture, not necessarily specific conditions. So you can easily have a "slower" boat beat a "faster" one when the conditions are right, as the slow boat may be really slow in some conditions, but decently fast in others, while the fast boat is faster in most conditions, but isn't necessarily all that fast in every possible condition.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

The extra weight means the Cape George will be harder to push up to a point. But given enough wind, there's adequate power available to overcome that and the higher theoretical top speed from the longer waterline becomes an advantage. With a 7.5 kt hull speed, if she's doing 7.9, then there's definitely some good wind available to push that boat for pretty much all it can do.



Stuff like this is also why it's a bit hard to truly say what sailboat is faster than another. There are plenty of generalizations, ways to analyze it (such as PHRF), etc. But that all looks at the overall picture, not necessarily specific conditions. So you can easily have a "slower" boat beat a "faster" one when the conditions are right, as the slow boat may be really slow in some conditions, but decently fast in others, while the fast boat is faster in most conditions, but isn't necessarily all that fast in every possible condition.

Yeah that's why the PHRF rating isn't real useful for a distance race because the distance race could have mainly downwind or reaching whereas those PHRF ratings are highly dependent on good upwind performance for good race results

I was able to lead the entire fleet one time for the first 10 miles with a much slower rated boat because it was a distance race with a downwind start and I nailed the start raising my spinnaker at just the right time

It was also because my spinnaker was much flatter that the larger boats and I was able to hold my line to round the mark without tacking back as they had to do. The wind was rotating ahead on the port side the entire first leg pushing the fleet to starboard of the mark

Photo from different race but you can see how flat the spinnakers on that boat

https://owners.aquarius-sail.com/php...topic.php?t=86

[thomm225]

Kirsten Neushafer and Tony Abhilash are now within about 12 miles of each other on split tacks.

They can most like communicate now which is weird after over 15,000 miles sailed

[Eidolon65]

Originally Posted by thomm225

She has a rather short waterline at 31.5' on her full keel Cape George 36, and the boat displaces 23,300 lbs. before it's loaded for the RTW race so the wind must be up quite a bit.

Her boat is only 10.5' in the beam though

She's now within about 32 miles or so of Tony Abhilash on his Rustler 36 so they will soon be in the same wind and conditions which will give us more information for comparison but without knowing their sail selection etc.

Rustler 36 LWL is 26.92

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/cape-george-36

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/rustler-36

GREAT pic of K.

[mochifanta]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Kirsten Neushafer and Tony Abhilash are now within about 12 miles of each other on split tacks.



They can most like communicate now which is weird after over 15,000 miles sailed

Now she is ahead with Tomy, taking a break to deal with some health/medical issues.

Simon has a busted Hydrovane. She is going to run him down over the next couple of weeks. Passes him before rounding the cape?

Race really seems like one of attrition, that depends as much on preparation of the boat, weather systems, and seamanship to keep the boat in one piece and deal with problems.

You need to be competitive, but you have to finish in order to win.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by mochifanta

Now she is ahead with Tomy, taking a break to deal with some health/medical issues.

Simon has a busted Hydrovane. She is going to run him down over the next couple of weeks. Passes him before rounding the cape?

Race really seems like one of attrition, that depends as much on preparation of the boat, weather systems, and seamanship to keep the boat in one piece and deal with problems.

You need to be competitive, but you have to finish in order to win.

Yes, it's kind of a mix between racing and cruising.

The winner in 2018 had to make a rather extensive repair then rejoin the race. He had enough of a lead to do that.

https://goldengloberace.com/day-130-...ntinue-racing/

Since I have been on this site, cruisers are always emphasizing the keeping the boat in one piece thing.

Whereas since I came from racing, it was all about pushing the boat as hard as was needed to win, but if you do that in a race like the Golden Globe RTW Race that could take you out of the race or at the least slow you down.

Same with cruising offshore.

My racing was usually within 15-20 miles of land so I and the other racers went as hard as we could sometimes pitchpoling, ripping sails, breaking masts, and wearing out sails and ourselves quickly

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Yes, it's kind of a mix between racing and cruising.

The winner in 2018 had to make a rather extensive repair then rejoin the race. He had enough of a lead to do that.

https://goldengloberace.com/day-130-...ntinue-racing/

Since I have been on this site, cruisers are always emphasizing the keeping the boat in one piece thing.

Whereas since I came from racing, it was all about pushing the boat as hard as was needed to win, but if you do that in a race like the Golden Globe RTW Race that could take you out of the race or at the least slow you down.

Same with cruising offshore.

My racing was usually within 15-20 miles of land so I and the other racers went as hard as we could sometimes pitchpoling, ripping sails, breaking masts, and wearing out sails and ourselves quickly

Accompanied by safety boats or much less than at least 5 days away from rescue..

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Accompanied by safety boats or much less than at least 5 days away from rescue..

Exactly!

I was out "racing" a guy in December back in maybe 2012 or so.

We setup up a 12 mile course here in the bay just inside the shipping channel.

He was sailing his Alberg 30 and I was sailing my Bristol 27.

One race we were on split tacks and he was maybe 2 miles away and I was trying to pole out my jib as the winds were super light.

I almost fell in a few times then realized/remembered the water temp which was high 40's low 50's.

I instantly realized he wouldn't be able to tell if I was on the boat or not and there was no one else around plus the boat was on autopilot

I was maybe 5 miles offshore and couldn't have made it in I don't believe in time in that cold water. Plus I had on all cotton clothes plus no PFD.

It was another lesson of the differences from my old boating and racing life to now.

Before I was mainly on my power boats in Spring, Summer, and Fall when I was young many times with friends also

Racing in Florida was usually with lots of boats,

Tennessee it was lakes which was an easy swim to shore if you were separated from your boat

The above was just one example there are tons more situations where I did stupid thing on this boat sometimes 10 miles offshore single handing with boat on autopilot.

10 miles is a long swim......

I had to learn the difference.

If I pitchpoled one of my beach cats, the boat is usually right there or close by on it's side so all I have to do it right it. It's isn't going to sail away

By 2017 I had started using my tether.....at times