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**boatman61** · 04-02-2023, 07:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by rslifkin

Probably a good choice. Realistically, if you have the power to run an electrically driven autopilot and you're not sailing in situations where redundancy for self-steering is critical, you can get along just fine without the wind vane. Singlehanding across oceans, especially with limited electrical power, is a bit of a different situation.

For that you need a dedicated battery and a 10W solar panel solely for the TP.. running off house along with all the other things like nav lights, vhf, fridge etc will have you on 11.5 before 4am.
Its a trick I pull on my own boats..

rslifkin · 04-02-2023, 07:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by boatman61

For that you need a dedicated battery and a 10W solar panel solely for the TP.. running off house along with all the other things like nav lights, vhf, fridge etc will have you on 11.5 before 4am.
Its a trick I pull on my own boats..

All depends on what your house power supply is. In general, smaller boats are more of a challenge for powering things like an autopilot. As you make the boat smaller, you shrink your space for batteries and solar panels faster than you reduce your electrical demands in most cases (assuming an equal number of people on board).

thomm225 · 04-02-2023, 08:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by rslifkin

Probably a good choice. Realistically, if you have the power to run an electrically driven autopilot and you're not sailing in situations where redundancy for self-steering is critical, you can get along just fine without the wind vane. Singlehanding across oceans, especially with limited electrical power, is a bit of a different situation.

Right but many don't seem to understand that.

Many may plan to cross oceans and set up their boat for that but then never do it.

But when the shaft fell out of my last Raymarine autopilot I was 35 miles out and had steer the boat all the way home.

I was sailing downwind so I balanced sails as best I could and stood in my usual stop and made course corrections as necessary with my legs. (tiller was between my legs)

If I were to venture far offshore I'd have a decent sail to tiller setup already installed and tested (plus maybe one of my old Raymarine ST2000's as back up.

Btw the shaft screwed right back in I just didn't know it at the time)

My last Raymairne failed like this. See video.

I continued to use it like that for another year but when it has to work for 5-7 hours it gets hot and jams. I still have it but bought a replacement also ($500 plus)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDsIrcsfgSU

rslifkin · 04-02-2023, 08:08

You hit on a key point. Having to hand steer for 35 miles after a failure is a pain, but entirely manageable. And if there's a second person on board, it's not bad at all. But being stuck hand steering a couple hundred miles from anywhere while solo is a whole different ball game.

thomm225 · 04-02-2023, 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by rslifkin

You hit on a key point. Having to hand steer for 35 miles after a failure is a pain, but entirely manageable. And if there's a second person on board, it's not bad at all. But being stuck hand steering a couple hundred miles from anywhere while solo is a whole different ball game.

Which is why on a boat like mine you have a sheet to tiller system as backup.

Webb Chiles went thru like 5 electric tiller pilots then used sheet to tiller on that little Merit 24 (I believe it was) that he sailed across oceans.

Point is I set my boat up for the sailing I'm doing now not for something I might do in the future.

A few changes will have to be made should I decide to sail further out.

First I'd sail to maybe the Bahamas or Dry Tortugas as an offshore adventure before anything further.

Single handing and old does present challenges though.

Just sailing up the Bay until 11 pm (55 - 60 miles) will work you especially if you did a hard workout the day before and are old like I am

From the Webb Chiles article below:

The little sloop will sail with a record five tiller pilots on board. She left San Diego in 2014 with four and reached New Zealand with none working. She left New Zealand in 2016 with four and reached Durban with one working, but only because I sailed 7,000 of the 9,000 miles using sheet-to-tiller steering. I am again prepared to use sheet-to-tiller and it will be interesting to see how many tiller pilots are operational when Gannet reaches the Caribbean.
To put this in perspective, five Gannet -size tiller pilots cost less than one autopilot on most ocean crossing boats.

https://www.cruisingworld.com/webb-c...ets-off-again/

**boatman61** · 04-02-2023, 08:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by thomm225

Which is why on a boat like mine you have a sheet to tiller system as backup.

Webb Chiles went thru like 5 electric tiller pilots then used sheet to tiller on that little Merit 24 (I believe it was) that he sailed across oceans.

Point is I set my boat up for the sailing I'm doing now not for something I might do in the future.

A few changes will have to be made should I decide to sail further out.

First I'd sail to maybe the Bahamas or Dry Tortugas as an offshore adventure before anything further.

Single handing and old does present challenges though.

Just sailing up the Bay until 11 pm (55 - 60 miles) will work you especially if you did a hard workout the day before and are old like I am

From the Webb Chiles article below:

The little sloop will sail with a record five tiller pilots on board. She left San Diego in 2014 with four and reached New Zealand with none working. She left New Zealand in 2016 with four and reached Durban with one working, but only because I sailed 7,000 of the 9,000 miles using sheet-to-tiller steering. I am again prepared to use sheet-to-tiller and it will be interesting to see how many tiller pilots are operational when Gannet reaches the Caribbean.
To put this in perspective, five Gannet -size tiller pilots cost less than one autopilot on most ocean crossing boats.

https://www.cruisingworld.com/webb-c...ets-off-again/

Unless you have wheel steering and have to hand steer (NE of Bermuda-Azores-UK) for 2500+nm.. then its dawn till dusk, heave to and crash out till dawn... I was down to $40 in my account..

thomm225 · 04-02-2023, 10:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by boatman61

Unless you have wheel steering and have to hand steer (NE of Bermuda-Azores-UK) for 2500+nm.. then its dawn till dusk, heave to and crash out till dawn... I was down to $40 in my account..

Closest thing I have had to that were the five 100 mile beach cat races I did staying on the tiller for 12 hours, 14.5 hours, 20 hours, 14 hours, and 20 hours for the five but then afterward there was a nice motel room to go to after the sails were taken down and the boat pushed well up on shore

Four of them on a Nacra 6.0 and one on a Nacra 17 so part of the time you are tramped out also

But I was in my 40's for those races which were half in the Gulf and half on the inside.

We were usually inside (in Pensacola Inlet) by 1pm-4pm.

thomm225 · 04-02-2023, 11:21

Latest:

Kirsten Neuschafer South Africa
Cape George 36 - 53

Speed: 7.0 knots @ 106.66°
Owner: Minnehaha
Position at: 04 Feb 2023 16:00 UTC
Lat/Lon: 49° 12.42 S, 100° 23.76 W
DTF: 8329.6 NM
Distance (last 24hrs): 149 NM
1st in All Boats

Abhilash Tomy India
Rustler 36 - 71

Speed: 5.8 knots @ 60.64°
Owner: Bayanat
Position at: 04 Feb 2023 16:00 UTC
Lat/Lon: 47° 59.21 S, 107° 0.53 W
DTF: 8590.3 NM
Distance (last 24hrs): 120 NM
2nd in All Boats

Still a long way to go....

foufou · 05-02-2023, 09:52

Let us not forget that one design races can show us how identical boats can sail at widely different speeds. The helms person and sail trimmer can make at least as much difference as the boat.

thomm225 · 05-02-2023, 10:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by foufou

Let us not forget that one design races can show us how identical boats can sail at widely different speeds. The helms person and sail trimmer can make at least as much difference as the boat.

These boats are close enough in design that after 25,000 miles you get a pretty good idea of who the top sailors are (unless they have gear failure or an accident)

Plus as in all sailboat races, a little luck helps as well

I think it's a lot better when distance racing because you are not 20' away from the other boats and possibly watching one boat sail away from you.

This can drive you nuts then you start reviewing all your settings in you head which can break your concentration

Pre-bend setting

Amount of downhaul

Main sheeting (and jib if you have one)

Mast rake

Batten tension

mast rotation (if your mast rotates)

Traveler position

weight distribution (if on a light boat)

and on it goes......