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Old 03-07-2020, 12:00   #31
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Re: Island Packet advice?

An IP is sort of a Modern take on a full keel. The hull to start with isn’t the traditional wine glass, marrow beam of the older designs. Then as noted it has quite a bit cut away from the front, but the biggest break to me is that it has a Spade rudder, so far as I know it’s the only full or long keel that does.
Newer IP’s are advertised to have an airfoil shape to the keel. You decide if that’s significant or not.

Yes, I’m saying that I’m a grounding that would certainly damage most fin keels, I wont pull and inspect my boat, the reason is that unless the grounding is so severe that it has busted the hull, or done extensive damage to the keel itself like the picture of the Westsail, there isn’t anything to inspect.
I have stupidly had a hard grounding, hard enough that it was a sudden stop from 7 kts that knocked everyone down and we backed off, we didn’t go aground. It was in the Port St Lucie inlet and I had all of I believe one day experience with the boat, maybe it was two days.
I bet the keel damage on that Westsail for example was cosmetic, meaning that the repair was fairing back in the shape and that was it, no grid that the Plexus broke loose from.

IP does have a partial grid, the front head and the Galley area is a grid, but neither is particularly structural, and I suspect they are there more cause that’s the two areas of the sole that are fiberglass.
I have since then inspected all of the tabbing in all of the bulkheads as I think they would be the first thing to break loose and found none.

So far as the original question, from what little I know of the West coast and the fact that there are no IP’s there for sale, I don’t think it’s worth transporting an IP 3,000 miles from Florida, although I’d suspect that an IP is among the easiest designs to truck.
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Old 03-07-2020, 12:10   #32
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Re: Island Packet advice?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Horizons View Post
First of all, IP does not have a full keel.
Second, a major reason for the configuration they have is exactly the one you expressed above, so it does not fall off when you hit something. (Not if, but when.)
The fall off thing is just ridiculous, can it happen? Yes but statistically it's actually irrelevant, a large, large percentage of boats out here are finned keel, that's just reality and very few have problems. Tell your self what you wish.

I know of two encapsulated keeled boats that rusted from the inside and split the hull BUT that does have me saying 'I wont have a encapsulated keel because they can rust from the inside and split the hull", of course these two were cast iron ballast not lead.

Btw, sailing with a old boat right now, 250nm passage, we will spend one night less at sea than them, that's important to me.
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Old 03-07-2020, 14:28   #33
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Re: Island Packet advice?

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
I wish I had a quarter for every thread about how bad is this damage from a fin keel boat being run aground, Or should I buy this boat with these rusted keel bolts etc, are these rust stains at the keel / hull interface bad, how do you replace keel bolts and every time something happens to a fin keel, people rally around and blame the owner because it must have been run aground and they didn’t immediately have the boat hauled and keel dropped and boat inspected by a pro. Didn’t we just have another one last week?
There seem to be more keel threads on buying used than wet decks or rigging.
Who wants a boat that has to be pulled and the keel dropped and possibly very expensive repairs done for running aground?
I understand if your sailing grounds are deep, but where I spend a lot of time you get used to sailing with two feet under the keel, and five feet is deep water, and you do occasionally go aground
The newer IP’s are I believe slower than the older ones as a guess, as we travelled with a 420 last year and they had to motorsail to keep up with us. And I would have expected the opposite.
But your right, IP’s are not a performance boat, for many performance takes a back seat.
I feel most must be that way, cause they all seem to drive SUV’s which except for rare exceptions, are true pigs.

But then it’s apparently not just fin keel mono’s, we were in Salt Pond Bahamas during the lockdown with a Leopard that had bumped ground and was leaking from I guess they have a false keel or something and they were looking for some underwater epoxy to temp fix the leak.

But to reiterate, an IP with good Sail's and decently sailed, is not a slow boat. They aren’t nimble and are not the boat to sail in the bay, rails in the water in 12 kts of wind, and they certainly are not the boat to race on weekends, or race at all probably. But they are good Cruising boats, designed in my opinion for mostly coastal cruising, and in shallow waters.
Mine anyway is not a good light wind boat, but where I sail if it’s light wind, wait until tomorrow, cause light winds are rare. I can’t keep a good Anin storm ensign for six months, the winds wear it out.

But in a beer can race against a Beneteau, an IP is way out of its league, it would be like a Chevy Suburban against my Mazdaspeed in Autocross. But to proclaim the Miata as the better car because it’s faster around the cones isn’t correct either, because it sucks on the highway on a long trip.

An IP knocking around the Caribbean is hard to beat, and not just because the keel, it’s because they have more storage, nice interior, quality furniture and better ventilation than most boats, and on passage is much more comfortable than most, with little heeling. 15 degrees is max on mine, sure you can push her over, but you gain no speed. They don’t slam unless in real bad weather, burying the bow, water over the whole front of the boat bad, and they don’t hobby horse, ever. And they carry weight much better than most boats.
I hang a 10’6” dinghy in davits with a 20 HP motor and a kilowatt of Solar panels, all behind the stern, and 65 kg of anchors and 300’ of chain in the locker, along with 1,000’ of rope rode, and left over room in the locker for my drogue and sea anchor and big Yanmar parts box. Most boats first can’t do that and if you did it would hobby horse severely.

When sailing around at anchor (which all boats do) the bow sprit keeps the chain from chewing up the bow, and there is so much reserve buoyancy on the stern and it so high I’ve yet to meet someone who has been pooped in an IP. Of course it can happen, but I think it’s quite rare.
However in my opinion an IP is very capable of world cruising, but they are sort of optimized for coastal cruising, so if world cruising is for sure what you want, there are maybe better boats for that.
My past dentist sailed his IP 45 around the world twice.
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Old 03-07-2020, 14:38   #34
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Re: Island Packet advice?

Looked at about a two dozen IP’s up and down the East coast..even went to the IP factory. Bought a Cabo Rico...
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Old 03-07-2020, 15:55   #35
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Re: Island Packet advice?

If you ground on a liner built boat you should have it inspected, many of these boats are not built to take groundings and some bad things have happened when they were not properly looked at. Most get away with it but a few don't so avoid being in that group.
A fin keel attached to a fiberglass stick built boat attached via a fg stub with adequate studs is a very strong setup and the likely hood of any real damage on a grounding is small.

Full keel boats are also exposed to some real damage on groundings, many full keel boats use iron punchings, some capped off with concrete and if you break through the fiberglass on a grounding and water enters the keel your going to be writing some good sized cheques.

Personally I don't buy into the concept that everybody is going to ground and therefore you should consider this when buying a boat for cruising. We have sailed all over the world for many years and have never grounded, lucky maybe but we are also damn careful.
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Old 03-07-2020, 16:00   #36
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Re: Island Packet advice?

Hi,
If the OP is concerned enough about speed to be worried about the effect of a bow-thruster I don't think he should be considering Island Packets.

Rgds
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Old 04-07-2020, 18:17   #37
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Re: Island Packet advice?

the single biggest distraction about IP to my mind, is that funky hull color. I've often wondered how much more popular those boats would be, if just plain white..???
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Old 10-07-2020, 06:51   #38
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Re: Island Packet advice?

You might want to check Caliber 35's and 40's. Great boats and they sail to windward unlike IP's. Very comfortable too.
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Old 10-07-2020, 07:52   #39
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Re: Island Packet advice?

Strongly suggest that you charter an Island Packet for a week to get a sense of how it sails (sluggish), steers under power (struggles), as well as comfort (excellent). We chartered an IP 38 from ca. 2009. It was in excellent condition. Companion loved it for spacious interior and cockpit. But she was not a sailor. I found it nice to have a boat with lots of comfort, but clearly thought it severely lacking as a sailing vessel. Steers poorly under power unless you turn on autopilot. Visibility from the cockpit is blocked by the instrument pod. Great at anchor. Tight to handle in reverse without a bow thruster. If you enjoy sailing, look at other boats before you emotionally commit yourself to an IP.
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Old 10-07-2020, 07:57   #40
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Re: Island Packet advice?

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Originally Posted by Pfeiffer View Post
I am currently looking for a cruising boat in the 35-38 foot range. full keel or keel/skeg rudder. It seems like the IP boats are by far the roomiest and what I have read, a very high-quality boat. I looked at a Pacific Seacraft 37 Crealock, that I fell in love with, but it was too small inside. I really like the second full cabin and not just a quarter berth.
I am in California and there is only one IP for sale on the West Coast. a 350 in pretty rough condition. I found at least a dozen IPs on the East Coast for sale and am planning on a trip to look at some of them. I understand they are manufactured on the East Coast: 35, 350, 37, 370,380. all of them 1997-2004.

It seems several of them have Heat/AC, which I have never seen on a California boat. Some have bow thrusters. Bow thrusters don't mean much to me, maybe nice, but do they affect speed?

Are there any other boats that I should consider? Up to a max of $150,000. No Catalinas, Hunters, etc.
Any comments about shipping boat to California? thanks.
I just sold an IP350 (2001), and moved to a trawler.
Great boat for a couple to cruise! The aft berth is plenty Roomy if you don’t need an island berth. Plenty of storage, reasonable tankage, and useable living spaces. Good cockpit.
Try to get a 2000 or later. They switched to higher quality chainplatesin 1997, and no known failures after that. They are about 10k to replace. In 2000, they upgraded again to 316 stainless.
A bow thruster would be nice, but not a necessity.
I highly recommend all roller furling sails, completely operated from the cockpit. Much safer! She sails great with a reef in the main, and the staysail, in 25 knots.
A very solid boat! I’d only go larger if you need a island berth, 2 heads, or a separate shower stall.
You can get a nice 350 from after 2000 for around 125k.
Good luck!
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Old 10-07-2020, 08:03   #41
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Re: Island Packet advice?

Hello. I’ve got an IP38, which I’m relatively pleased with, and I’ve sailed it solo from FL to Australia. That said, a friend just sold his Caliber, which I’m many ways seemed to be an improved version of the IP, with refinements such as dual water & fuel tanks with a significantly increased capacity.
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Old 10-07-2020, 08:10   #42
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Re: Island Packet advice?

I don't know why I am responding to you, but I do have a great cruising boat for sail here in the great lakes. A wonderful Corbin 39, details available. $138,000
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Old 10-07-2020, 08:18   #43
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Re: Island Packet advice?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pfeiffer View Post
I am currently looking for a cruising boat in the 35-38 foot range. full keel or keel/skeg rudder. It seems like the IP boats are by far the roomiest and what I have read, a very high-quality boat. I looked at a Pacific Seacraft 37 Crealock, that I fell in love with, but it was too small inside. I really like the second full cabin and not just a quarter berth.
I am in California and there is only one IP for sale on the West Coast. a 350 in pretty rough condition. I found at least a dozen IPs on the East Coast for sale and am planning on a trip to look at some of them. I understand they are manufactured on the East Coast: 35, 350, 37, 370,380. all of them 1997-2004.

It seems several of them have Heat/AC, which I have never seen on a California boat. Some have bow thrusters. Bow thrusters don't mean much to me, maybe nice, but do they affect speed?

Are there any other boats that I should consider? Up to a max of $150,000. No Catalinas, Hunters, etc.
Any comments about shipping boat to California? thanks.
Look on Yachtworld. There are several IP380’s available. There is one in the East Bay of SF and another one near Santa Barbara. You might find one in San Diego if it hasn’t even sold.
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Old 10-07-2020, 09:06   #44
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Re: Island Packet advice?

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Originally Posted by GreenWave View Post
Why not a post 2000 era Catalina? They are much more agile sailing than an IP and plenty in Cali.
Agreed- I live in a 2000 Mk2 42’ and got her for an all in budget of $150k. Great sailing boat- A rated Ocean going vessel & easy in Marina and to solo sail (that’s all I do)- don’t need to reef until 20k. Solid, basic & easy to work on too. I do have a bow thruster, and in crowded east coast marinas, it’s a very nice thing to have!
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Old 10-07-2020, 11:13   #45
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Re: Island Packet advice?

I don't know why A64Pilot has trouble with his IP and complains that it is designed as a coastal cruiser because of it's draft. No matter where you cruise you will eventually want less draft in some situations. I have an IP40 and have done several long trips single handed. The last was Mexico, Hawaii, Alaska and home to Seattle. About 10,000 miles and it was an easy boat to handle short handed. Comfortable inside and out. Strongly built. Running down the NW Coast off CA I had several days of 35 to 45 knot winds, large following seas 16ft according to the Coast Guard with a short 6 to 7 second period. (steep)
I left the helm for hours at a time and the pilot held it just fine.
I have no problem steering in tight areas and surprised how well she does turn with just a little way on. Reversing is easy if you use the prop effect to your advantage. You get used to its characteristics with experience. It does not reverse as well as a keel boat but I have had both and have no problem.
They have gone around the world many times. A French buyer took a 350 from the builder and basically took it with little prep around the world via Cape Horn.
Under sail it is very easy to handle. Her longitudinal stability is good with the long keel. I did install a boom furler which makes sailing offshore a really easy especially when reefing. I would not call the boat sluggish under sail. It accelerates slower than a fin keel, light weight boat but then all heavier boats are. They take more time to get the mass moving. I did manage several consecutive days of 170 plus miles a day for a 24 hr avg of over 7 knots.
The chain plate problem was finally resolved when I discovered they were bedding them with 5200. It does not seal well to stainless after a period of time. I had to rebed everything and the first thing when I got the boat was dig out the 5200 in the chainplates and bed with silicone sealer.
Best thing to do if you want to find one on the West Coast is call an IP dealer. He will find you one for sure.
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