How do you feel about plumb bows on cruisers?

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Its a US forum.. they don't know Brit boats..

always willing to learn...for example that Bristol Channel and Bristol (which I owned) are two different things

(most of the boats mentioned here were French and German, but whatevs )

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by Clivevon

Surprised no-one has mentioned Bristol Channel pilot cutters with their plumb bows:
https://cdnx.theyachtmarket.com/boat...8915085_wm.jpg
Sailed by 2 crew to take the pilot out to incoming ships - in all winds & weather & the fastest boat got their pilot the job. Real working boats.

That's quite a thing! With that stern...

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by DMF Sailing

That's quite a thing! With that stern...

We'll Here's 3 more Brit plumb bow boats.. a smaller modern range off the Bristol Pilot by Cornish Crabbers ranging from 24ft, 26ft and 30ft..
They also do the Shrimper at 19ft.. same style..

[singlespeed]

In some big waves in the channel between Martinique and Dominica, we came off a wave and the bow banged loudly. A semi-submerged refrigerator slid past. At the next anchorage, we found a ding in the bow about four inches above the boot stripe and missing bottom paint for about four feet aft of the boot stripe. Wonder how a plumb bow would have fared?

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by singlespeed

In some big waves in the channel between Martinique and Dominica, we came off a wave and the bow banged loudly. A semi-submerged refrigerator slid past. At the next anchorage, we found a ding in the bow about four inches above the boot stripe and missing bottom paint for about four feet aft of the boot stripe. Wonder how a plumb bow would have fared?

Probably depends on how it hit. Depending on luck, you might have come down on top of it (given a shallow enough forefoot), or you might have just whacked it head on against the stem, probably pushing it out of the way with a very loud thud (but probably less damage, as it likely would have contacted a larger area of the boat, making it less likely to do more than scratch the gelcoat).

[Clivevon]

Originally Posted by DMF Sailing

always willing to learn...for example that Bristol Channel and Bristol (which I owned) are two different things

Well, I am a Bristolian, which means I am Bristol born & bred. As in the city of Bristol in the West of England, population of half a million, an ancient port & maritime trading city after which any other places (or things) in the world called Bristol are named.

The Bristol Channel is a funnel shaped body of water leading in from the Atlantic towards Bristol between South Wales & the north coasts of Cornwall, Devon & Somerset , narrowing down from 60 miles wide to 1 mile wide over its 84 mile length with a maximum 45 foot tidal range.

Several busy ports along that coastline & the upper part of the Channel is heavily silted with shifting channels between the mud banks washed down by the River Severn. What with that, the strong tidal streams & the fact that he whole place is on a lee shore in the prevailing SW winds, it is not a place to muck about either in the days of sail or now.

A visiting merchant ship would need a pilot to guide them in. The Bristol Channel Pilot cutters were built by many different boatyards but their common design characteristics evolved over centuries to cope with such conditions - of course there was strong competition between the individual pilots for the work & the one who was waiting furthest out was likely to get the job.
Why the plumb bows I dont know but it obviously worked for them.

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by Clivevon

Well, I am a Bristolian, which means I am Bristol born & bred. As in the city of Bristol in the West of England, population of half a million, an ancient port & maritime trading city after which any other places (or things) in the world called Bristol are named.

The Bristol Channel is a funnel shaped body of water leading in from the Atlantic towards Bristol between South Wales & the north coasts of Cornwall, Devon & Somerset , narrowing down from 60 miles wide to 1 mile wide over its 84 mile length with a maximum 45 foot tidal range.

Several busy ports along that coastline & the upper part of the Channel is heavily silted with shifting channels between the mud banks washed down by the River Severn. What with that, the strong tidal streams & the fact that he whole place is on a lee shore in the prevailing SW winds, it is not a place to muck about either in the days of sail or now.

A visiting merchant ship would need a pilot to guide them in. The Bristol Channel Pilot cutters were built by many different boatyards but their common design characteristics evolved over centuries to cope with such conditions - of course there was strong competition between the individual pilots for the work & the one who was waiting furthest out was likely to get the job.
Why the plumb bows I dont know but it obviously worked for them.

Appreciate the primer! Looks very conceptual....

[Clivevon]

You are welcome !

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

Also, please list your ocean racing experience since it is that obvious.

It's very obvious.

I raced in the Gulf but fished a lot in the Atlantic Ocean so with all my experience I can truthfully say a plumb bow isn't the way to go.

I know I wouldn't have wanted one running back in from the ocean thru the narrow inlets on the Eastern Shore back in the day when I was 16 years old.

We would pick a wave and come in on it with our 14' power boats....and pray the engine didn't quit.

This in around 1971.

This is the inlet we used to run thru coming in from the ocean. (Metompkin Inlet)

You can see how shallow it is from the wave action.....you had to pick the tide and the wave to get in on but we only needed a foot or so on our small boat but we did break a sheer pin or two coming thru

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ESuzVQ02D8

[Clivevon]

"after which any other places (or things) in the world called Bristol are named."

Just in case anyone is wondering, that would be Bristol cities....

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by Clivevon

"after which any other places (or things) in the world called Bristol are named."

Just in case anyone is wondering, that would be Bristol cities....

Probably these guys, too

https://sites.google.com/site/bristo...stol-history-1

(Pictured: Bristol Caravel; made in Rhode Island, inspired in Western England)

[DMF Sailing]

Ah but that clean cockpit

I'm really just a sucker for modern production cruisers

[Training Wheels]

Originally Posted by thomm225

It's very obvious.

I raced in the Gulf but fished a lot in the Atlantic Ocean so with all my experience I can truthfully say a plumb bow isn't the way to go.

I know I wouldn't have wanted one running back in from the ocean thru the narrow inlets on the Eastern Shore back in the day when I was 16 years old.

We would pick a wave and come in on it with our 14' power boats....and pray the engine didn't quit.

This in around 1971.

This is the inlet we used to run thru coming in from the ocean. (Metompkin Inlet)

You can see how shallow it is from the wave action.....you had to pick the tide and the wave to get in on but we only needed a foot or so on our small boat but we did break a sheer pin or two coming thru

Glad to hear you determined that plumb bows aren’t good on 14’ power skiffs. [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

[David B]

I could live with a plumb bow if all other factors were appealing to me, but certainly not my preference.

To me the aesthetics are compromised, the buoyancy is reduced (even with just a little rake on the bow, the deeper the bow plunges, the greater the buoyancy - also affected of course by how quickly the beam develops), and notice how the new plumb bow models now have a very significant bow-fitting to keep the anchor away from the hull (more aesthetic compromise in my view).

To be clear, I am not referring to a traditional cutter bow (beautiful as they are), but the bows that we were being offered up to around 10 years ago - not a huge rake, but there, nonetheless.

To me, a good example of a modern raked bow on a very elegant yacht would be something like an Oceanis 58 or 60.

I am no naval architect, but the bows that really puzzle me the the reverse sheer bows we are seeing come out now - especially on catamarans. Again, the aesthetic leaves me cold, but thinking about a catamaran in particular, as the bows are pushed deeper, the buoyancy decreases (the effective LWL decreases, rather than increasing). Someone tell me this isn't designers compromising seaworthiness over perceived 'trends' in aesthetics!

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Yes, those are called reverse, or wave piercing bows.

So check this out:

There's a lot going on here. You have a variant of the reverse/wave-piercing/tumblehome bow.... really interesting sheer line, though I can't tell from this angle...
also a 7'2" draft for a 30 footer...