Galley Design/Layout

[Matt Johnson]

I still think people make way too much over the handholds and other "seaworthy" traits you MUST have. I've seen very few boats where there is truly nothing to hold going forward. If the boats large enough to have a dance floor saloon, either don't go to the forepeak or walk/crawl along the leeward/low side. We'll crawl on deck if necessary, but for some reason below deck it's all pose and balance.

Also, two fore and aft padeyes strongly attached to the overhead and a jackline ran between them, would make a nice run where you attach your 3' tether coming down the c-way (loads would be high).

Linear galleys are used on a ton of offshore/expedition type boats. From Garcia's Explorer, Boreal 47/52, Ovni and many others. I really tried to lay one out on our boat think it would be efficient for our space, but unfortunately we would have had to compromise in other areas to make it work. We now have a rear facing "u" with the centerboard trunk as one side.

Matt

[TeddyDiver]

It's not about the geometry, it's about the abilty to use the galley safely and easy manner in most sea states. Keep the landlubbers (sales&marketing) away from drawing boards ;-)

[JPA Cate]

Ex Maggie Drum,

Apologies that I don't have any open plan data to offer; all my sailing has been in more traditional layouts. All in L shaped galleys, with butt belts and guard rails to keep you off the stove, except this boat, which has a forward facing U shaped galley. In our case, the counter is a hinged box that swings aft to give access to the engine, the box resting on the bottom step of the companionway ladder. The galley is very safe, I always feel secure there (although I felt secure with the butt belts, too.

Honestly, you guys have had a lot of sea miles, and when you consider the security when conditions are lumpy, wouldn't you rather be secure in a U than have to retrofit safety straps?

Incidentally, noelex and Seaworthy Lass are having a Bestevaer 49 built. They are experienced cruisers, and might share with you their galley plans, and the reasoning behind the choices.

Good luck with your choice.

Ann

[roverhi]

Since most modern boats are dockominiums, not surprising they don't have a galley or interior that is suitable for passage making. Found the U shaped athwartship galley with a safety rail in front of the stove and a seat belt for cooking on the other tack, the only layout that works on a smaller boat. Larger boats can use a fore and aft 'U' layout with one side or the other galley acting as a support. A one sided fore and aft galley just doesn't work on both tacks. Guess you could flop over on the appropriate tack for cooking and then flop back once the food is prepared.

[Brob2]

Originally Posted by roverhi

A one sided fore and aft galley just doesn't work on both tacks.

They must. Jimmy Cornell's boat and all Garcia Explorations are built w/ longitudinal galleys and are indeed expressly built for offshore voyaging. You can design both U shaped galleys or fore and aft galleys that will fail offshore, or that can work well offshore. As teddy says, it's the sales and marketing guys who design the former, and they know their market well. Boats designed for voyaging are a niche market these days.

[Island Time O25]

Originally Posted by Sandero

The long counter design is not a seaworthy one... PERIOD FULL STOP. Galley should be U shaped with sinks close to CL of boat and gimbaled stove against the hull. Smaller boats do it with an L.

The galley should be close the companionway as well.

Shiva has a galley that is sea worthy and efficient for cooking at anchor or in a sea way

Your pic is very similar to what I have and in addition I can brace myself against the companionway steps. Almost like having an "O" instead of "U" shaped space.

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Another downside to the galley against one side of the hull is draining the sink when you are on one tack. A well designed sea galley tries to get the sink as close as possible to the center line of the boat.

On most modern boats if you are heeling that much that your outboard sink doesn't drain anymore you have to much sail on. So you reduce sail. Anyway, who will cook an elaborate 4 course dinner when close hauled? Just like most of the rest of the interior the kitchen sees most use while anchored or in the harbor.

I often cook for several days in advance, and then just heat up stuff when dinnertime comes. And if we're close hauled, and the boat heeling at to big an angle to comfortably work in the galley we just ease of a bit for the time it takes to heat up the next meal.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by K_V_B

On most modern boats if you are heeling that much that your outboard sink doesn't drain anymore you have to much sail on. So you reduce sail. Anyway, who will cook an elaborate 4 course dinner when close hauled?

There is occasionally some rolling also so traditional sinks can't be filled much at all. I'm installing the sinks on the same gimballed counter with the cooktop.
And a bit of foresight in designing the plumbing. A little sump below the sinks and diagraph pumping out from the stern. One seacock less..

[Sandero]

Originally Posted by K_V_B

On most modern boats if you are heeling that much that your outboard sink doesn't drain anymore you have to much sail on. So you reduce sail. Anyway, who will cook an elaborate 4 course dinner when close hauled? Just like most of the rest of the interior the kitchen sees most use while anchored or in the harbor.

I often cook for several days in advance, and then just heat up stuff when dinnertime comes. And if we're close hauled, and the boat heeling at to big an angle to comfortably work in the galley we just ease of a bit for the time it takes to heat up the next meal.

I have sailed for days on a beam reach with a fair amount of sail on and I had to cook and I did... Of course on a ocean passage I when it was time to prepare a meal in the galley I would change to a more comfortable course... cook... and then return to my course for eating on the tilt. Same routine if I must have a shower... flatten the boat... do what I need to do and then return to course. I have no issues with the way the U galley works in the Contest 36.

[Tortuga's Lie]

I have a great galley for offshore work with plenty of cabinets to brace yourself against, but the newer Euro designs are designed for what sells: open floor plans that gives the owner a sense of being in a SoHo apartment and truthfully, most people don't sail offshore for more than a day or so and therefore, the boat is designed for weekend gunkholing.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by K_V_B

On most modern boats if you are heeling that much that your outboard sink doesn't drain anymore you have to much sail on. So you reduce sail. Anyway, who will cook an elaborate 4 course dinner when close hauled? Just like most of the rest of the interior the kitchen sees most use while anchored or in the harbor.

I often cook for several days in advance, and then just heat up stuff when dinnertime comes. And if we're close hauled, and the boat heeling at to big an angle to comfortably work in the galley we just ease of a bit for the time it takes to heat up the next meal.

I hear what you're saying regarding cooking ahead. And doing so is one of the Key "to do" items, when you see weather headed your way.
But too, it being difficult to cook onboard when close hauled, or out in heavy weather is; dangerous for the cook, bad for morale, & saps the crew's energy. Especially given that you sleep a Lot better, in poor weather, when expending a lot of energy, if you have a full, hot meal in your belly.

And if the crew's energy & morale are low, due to bad food, & or lack of a couple of hot meals every day, when they need it most. Then their decision making skills also take a nose dive, as does their seamanship.

Which, obviously, is a safety issue for both; them, AND the boat. As it's difficult enough, to coerce yourself up out of the cockpit, & take a tour of the decks, sails, & rigging; regularly. When it's nasty, but your morale & energy are okay.
But when you're cold, tired, wet, & hungry, then it's a Lot harder to make yourself take said same tour. Let alone to make good judgement calls regarding sail changes, etc.

Or as a Skipper, it's tougher under those circumstances, to make unpopular calls which will make the crew work harder, for the safety of themselves & the boat.
I mean, who likes having to make the call to beat to weather for a day & a half in F8, as opposed to continuing on while taking a mid level beating, on a beam reach? So that by switching gears, to going close hauled, you can get out of the worst sector of the storm.

Especially when it means all hands on deck, & several crew having to go forward & hank on the staysail, after taking down the #3. When everyone's already whipped.

--> Yeah, as I, & several others have said, it's a $ driven, condo-maran thing. NOT a decision made by sailors.

Hell, as another example, look at how big (wide) "modern" cockpits are, on monohulls. You need handholds to get across them in any kind of a blow. As opposed to proper seagoing cockpits. Which are designed for sailing (in All conditions), instead of as being primarily, entertainment centers.
The cockpits on modern mono's are designed to come as close to those on spacious multihulls as possible.

[Cheechako]

On a smaller boat I found the side mounted galley not an issue. Some side galley, big boats have a floor mounted rail down the center, which is a better hand hold on a beamy big boat anyway. So I would think that would be nice. But for general use, I think a U shape is hard to beat.
My 44 footer had a U shape but the U opened forward. That was a great idea, as you had no open side in the direction a boat rolls.

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

On a smaller boat I found the side mounted galley not an issue. Some side galley, big boats have a floor mounted rail down the center, which is a better hand hold on a beamy big boat anyway. So I would think that would be nice. But for general use, I think a U shape is hard to beat.
My 44 footer had a U shape but the U opened forward. That was a great idea, as you had no open sie in the direction a boat rolls.

Good galley for offshore, sink in proper location, good storage throughout the boat.

[exMaggieDrum]

When getting ready for a long(er) passage, we would always try to provision foods that required minimal cooking and precooked when possible. While on passage we would take advantage of good weather without much heeling to do some more cooking than we would in other conditions.

I think everyone would do that whatever type of galley/salon layout they had.

Whenever I look at one of the newer, beamier, wide open galley/salon boats I especially look for handholds for an aft, and also for areas where you spend any time or frequently have to pass through. Ceiling handholds are good for going fore and aft but not much help when cooking or getting things out of the reefer or pantry.

My OP was to hear experiences from those that have the open style boats. No one has replied??? I am sure some have made it work somehow (or not?). There has been lots of discussion about the benefits of older seagoing "tubs" versus the newer, lighter, large cockpit, etc. boats. There must be some sailors out there who have crossed oceans and could share some information.

Cats are a special category. Some have galleys that are inside of an ama and relatively closed in. But even those who have the galley in the main salon area, and are open, don't have as much pitching and rolling to deal with so I would think it would be easier with an open space.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by exMaggieDrum

When getting ready for a long(er) passage, we would always try to provision foods that required minimal cooking and precooked when possible. While on passage we would take advantage of good weather without much heeling to do some more cooking than we would in other conditions.

I think everyone would do that whatever type of galley/salon layout they had.
Not me, no precooked please. As my stepdaughter used to say " we have no food in the fridge, only raw materials" Besides frying some veggies and fish on a pan takes only five minutes so it's no brainer not even in a gale. Coq au vin when the weather permits

Whenever I look at one of the newer, beamier, wide open galley/salon boats I especially look for handholds for an aft, and also for areas where you spend any time or frequently have to pass through. Ceiling handholds are good for going fore and aft but not much help when cooking or getting things out of the reefer or pantry.

My OP was to hear experiences from those that have the open style boats. No one has replied??? I am sure some have made it work somehow (or not?). There has been lots of discussion about the benefits of older seagoing "tubs" versus the newer, lighter, large cockpit, etc. boats. There must be some sailors out there who have crossed oceans and could share some information.
Perhaps they just eat cold tin beans... ???

Cats are a special category. Some have galleys that are inside of an ama and relatively closed in. But even those who have the galley in the main salon area, and are open, don't have as much pitching and rolling to deal with so I would think it would be easier with an open space.

If I had open style interior and inline galley I'd defineatly build a wall or something...