First timer, can use some help choosing a boat

[KTP]

Look for things on the boat like this:

holes drilled and not repaired/filled in

wires electrical taped together instead of crimps and heat shrink

non working bilge pumps

filthy raw sea water strainer (all clogged)

worn running rigging


If you see much of the above, you will know the boat was not maintained in the other 90 places you didn't notice.

[Belle25]

I'm in the same boat too. I have no sailing experience and want a monohull sailboat. I don't like the sailing dinghy idea at all. I wonder what kind of path I should take to start. Has anyone completely skipped the Lasers / Sunfishes and become a good sailor?

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by Belle25

I'm in the same boat too. I have no sailing experience and want a monohull sailboat. I don't like the sailing dinghy idea at all. I wonder what kind of path I should take to start. Has anyone completely skipped the Lasers / Sunfishes and become a good sailor?

There are a few who’ve skipped solo dinghys and been great sailors. You can certainly become a competent sailor starting on a small keelboat, but chances are you’ll never really develop the muscle memory a dinghy builds for being in tune with the wind.

[Belle25]

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

chances are you’ll never really develop the muscle memory a dinghy builds for being in tune with the wind.

I think I'm gonna take that chance. Some things are learned better when one is a kid. Music, even racing bikes, I think sailing is like that too. I bet somebody who has grown up among dinghies will always be better than the rest. Unfortunately, I'll be one of those who starts at 25 and wants to skip the dinghy phase...
I'm interested in what did you mean with small keel boat? I know what keel boat is and how it differs from the Lasers and such. My question is what picture comes to your view when you pronounce those words, keel boats - a 20ft sailboat, or a 30feeter?

[akprb]

Do you want to sail or do you want to go cruising?

Big difference.

[Belle25]

Originally Posted by akprb

Do you want to sail or do you want to go cruising?

Big difference.

both... in the beginning sailing.

[akprb]

(I went back and read through this thread and realized is was not your original question but that is ok, I don't think anyone will care. It has also been a long time since I have checked in and was good to see a lot of familiar names chiming in)

Next question. If you had a pizza pie and some toppings were "sailing" and some were "cruising" What would the pie look like?

"Sailing" being your desire to tack and jibe, run around the bouys, go as fast as possible, stay wet and laughing. It is having callouses on both hands from holding wet sheets and halyards. It is understanding the dynamics of sail shape and trim and on and on.

"Cruising" being your desire to explore far away places (or even close ones) from the deck of your own vessel. To drop anchor safely and securely and sleep soundly after a good passage. It is moving through the water with grace but not necessarily fast and enjoying the moments of a passage. It is less tacking and jibing more "set the sails" and enjoy the ride. You are not opposed to motoring when needed and enjoy the challenges of spending extended time in a small space fixing things :-)

So how many slices of the pie would be "sailing" and how many "cruising." (you have eight slices to work with) :-)

This affects how I think about answering your question, "how do I best get the experience I need?" Did I get that right? If not let me know.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Belle25

I think I'm gonna take that chance. Some things are learned better when one is a kid. Music, even racing bikes, I think sailing is like that too. I bet somebody who has grown up among dinghies will always be better than the rest. Unfortunately, I'll be one of those who starts at 25 and wants to skip the dinghy phase...
I'm interested in what did you mean with small keel boat? I know what keel boat is and how it differs from the Lasers and such. My question is what picture comes to your view when you pronounce those words, keel boats - a 20ft sailboat, or a 30feeter?

Lasers are sure fun, but you can do well with a Catalina 22 or 25. You can trailer it, they are common, they aren't too expensive, good resale and the sail well; you can develop some of that muscle memory... but Lasers really are fun....

[Belle25]

Originally Posted by akprb

... If you had a pizza pie and some toppings were "sailing" and some were "cruising" What would the pie look like?

So how many slices of the pie would be "sailing" and how many "cruising." (you have eight slices to work with) :-)

This affects how I think about answering your question, "how do I best get the experience I need?" Did I get that right? If not let me know.

Actually, I ended up ordering a pizza after reading your post.
I guess it'll be a mixed pizza. I wanna sail at the beginning, but as I build my confidence, I wanna start going places. No rush here, i know porgress takes time.
I sure won't enjoy the wet experience of Lasers. I don't care much about racing or in and out of water dinghy fun. I'd really prefer to skip that step. The bad thing about my personality is that I don't do well in social groups either, a loner here. I, also, would like to keep the taking classes kinda thing at a minimum level. I wanna somehow learn and start with a 20 - 25ft. I've read lots of conflicting opinions here. Some say start with a small keel boat. others say "oh no difference btw 22 or 37 when it comes to sailing."
Here I am with no experience at all and looking for a considerably 'dry' start.

[Belle25]

Originally Posted by Don C L

Lasers are sure fun, but you can do well with a Catalina 22 or 25. You can trailer it, they are common, they aren't too expensive, good resale and the sail well; you can develop some of that muscle memory... but Lasers really are fun....

wouldn't a 22 ft too big for a beginner? I'd rather go with a 25ft if could start in it with no prior experience. I was even looking at posts about 27 ft boats, but i think that would be a lot for my experience level, which is nothing at the moment.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Belle25

wouldn't a 22 ft too big for a beginner? I'd rather go with a 25ft if could start in it with no prior experience. I was even looking at posts about 27 ft boats, but i think that would be a lot for my experience level, which is nothing at the moment.

hmmmm I'm a little confused

[Belle25]

Originally Posted by Don C L

hmmmm I'm a little confused

I meant to say, "I have no idea where to start."

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Belle25

I meant to say, "I have no idea where to start."

Well, I'd start with lessons I think and see if you really do enjoy it and then renting something like the old Victory 21s or whatever is available locally for practice, though I think at first it is better to go with renting something smaller with only one sail to make things easier. And if you are set on buying a boat, do you have a budget to work with? An old but well cared for Catalina 22 would be a good way to start for the reasons I mentioned earlier. Here is an image of one I pulled off the web. Are you thinking of going bigger because you are looking for something safer, or less wet?

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by Belle25

wouldn't a 22 ft too big for a beginner? I'd rather go with a 25ft if could start in it with no prior experience. I was even looking at posts about 27 ft boats, but i think that would be a lot for my experience level, which is nothing at the moment.

22 can be quite manageable for a beginner. But it also depends on the 22.

Something like this is very dinghy like, yet more comfortable than a dinghy.

https://www.catalinayachts.com/sport-series/22-sport/

[Belle25]

Originally Posted by Don C L

Well, I'd start with lessons I think and see if you really do enjoy it and then renting something like the old Victory 21s or whatever is available locally for practice, though I think at first it is better to go with renting something smaller with only one sail to make things easier. And if you are set on buying a boat, do you have a budget to work with? An old but well cared for Catalina 22 would be a good way to start for the reasons I mentioned earlier. Here is an image of one I pulled off the web. Are you thinking of going bigger because you are looking for something safer, or less wet?

Catalina 22 or 25 are nice boats. Looks as if one of the very first advices could be the last one I'll need.
To be honest with you, me thinking of going bigger has no solid base. Less wet would be great, of course, but I don't want to sink the boat due to my noviceness either. A few folks here claimed that there was no difference btw 22 ft or 32 ft when it came to sailing a keel boat. I have no idea if they were correct with their opinions.
I've also thought about Compac 23, while looking at her bigger sister, but it has a cruising keel I assume - probably for shallow areas. I wonder how much it sacrifices from its sailing performance just to obtain that. Some Catalinas come with retractable keels, I think a good idea if maintained well.
According to what I've read, I guess Compac 23 will be slow and less scary, and Catalina 22 / 25 will be fast - and with Catalina, you can go against wind at a better angle as it has deeper keel. I think Catalina 22 / 25 will be better boats as probably, they must be more fun to sail. As my focus will be more on sailing at the beginning, decision is easy to make.
I think my decision is almost made. fin keel Catalina 25 (not the Capri)
Ballast/Displacement ratio over 40 and Capsize Screening Formula is under 2. Much better boat than both Catalina 22 and Compac 23. If I can handle it after a minimum amount of sailing classes...