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Old 11-05-2018, 08:18   #16
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

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Originally Posted by mogulskibum View Post
Thanks, this is pretty much the conclusion I have been coming to as well.

Not as deep of a keel as you might like, but it's actually deeper than say an island packet 40.

The access to the tanks is apparently a nightmare, but the $50,000 cost seems absolutely absurd (and there are a lot of reports that the reality is in the 15-20 range - which seems much more realistic).

A potential lack of handholds (can be dealt with) and too much open space (harder to compensate for) really seem to me to be the only major potential shortcomings for off shore voyaging.

But then I'd see the line "not a blue water boat" in every single review just casually thrown in there like everyone knew that and it's just obvious so it's not worth even mentioning why, and it would make me think "what apparently obvious thing am I missing?"
5 ft draft isn't too bad really. Probably be 5-3 to 5-6 loaded. Tanks on old boats can be an issue. Often alternatives are available. My Hans Christian would have been a gut job to get them out from under the salon. But installing multiple plastic tanks instead of one big one can often be done, sometimes inside the old tank.
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Old 11-05-2018, 08:38   #17
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

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5 ft draft isn't too bad really. Probably be 5-3 to 5-6 loaded. Tanks on old boats can be an issue. Often alternatives are available. My Hans Christian would have been a gut job to get them out from under the salon. But installing multiple plastic tanks instead of one big one can often be done, sometimes inside the old tank.
Yeah I dont see that as a mission ending criteria. My own boat is a lot smaller and draws 4'-6". She wont point better than 40 degrees close hauled, but the utility of almost shoal draft out weighs the inconvenience upwind. In my view its not only a cruising ground thing, its anchoring and all else.

My water tanks are astride the bilge and almost maintainable plastic, but the fuel tank was gas welded mild steel, too big to get out of a sail locker. Once its useful life ends it means you have to either cut it up or pull the engine. These are typical issues for Pearsons and I guess boats of this era.

You haven't lived until you cut a tank to bits inside the boat in 109F temperature. Attached, the larger but final part of the tank emerges through the Stb sail locker.
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Old 11-05-2018, 08:49   #18
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

5 ft draft would be higher on my list than 6 ft draft actually. Who wants to sail to weather anyway?
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Old 11-05-2018, 09:16   #19
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

Boy this question has got some legs!

I agree, the “bluewater” boat question is tiring.

Most will do what 95% of us want to do.

You’ll learn a ton, have a ball and LIVE!

Read “Hunter, really” on blog.

I never thought I’d own one. I’d take this boat anywhere. (Almost anywhere)
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Old 11-05-2018, 09:22   #20
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

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Originally Posted by ZULU40 View Post
The Endeavour 42 Sailboat : Bluewaterboats.org

Buyers Notes

Endeavour is well known to have poorly thought out access. The molded liners really limit bilge access. To compound this mistake, Endeavour sunk the aluminum water and fuel tanks deep into the bilge on the Endeavour 42. These tanks last 15 years and then will need to be replaced. Replacing them is at least a $50,000 refit project because of the impossible access.
As of 2010 the asking prices are in the approximate range of:
Endeavour 42, 1985-1991, $75k-$125k USD
That's an exaggeration... The tanks are hard to get to but we we've replaced the fuel tank one
for for a 10th of that (about 5K including new, expoxy coated, tank. If you keep the bilge dry they'll last forever..
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Old 11-05-2018, 09:43   #21
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

I have been quoted about $20K to replace water and fuel on my IP with a custom fuel tank that increases capacity, and the sole is done so it’s removable in the future if need be, and I thought that was high, $50K is insane
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Old 11-05-2018, 11:02   #22
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

I have a 1979 Endeavour 43 CC Ketch that I have owned for 15+ years now as a liveaboard. Sailing in the Pacific NW and having been beat up more than once on the west side of Vancouver Island, I considered this boat totally capable of “blue water” sailing.
Yes, it’s a bit of a Grand Canyon below in a seaway but you have to ask yourself…what percentage of time will you be doing a crossing vs. actually living on your boat. I went for the comfort level and have enjoyed it immensely. Guests often comment on how much space there is for a boat this size. And for its size and weight I’m very happy with its sailing capabilities.
Through the years I’ve gone through the boat with numerous upgrades such as replacing the deck hatches, replacing all 20 opening portals with stainless/safety glass units and the list goes on and on. Regarding the aluminum water and fuel tanks sitting in the bilge, dumb idea. Bob Johnson was the designer who came up with this design. He’s also the designer responsible for the Island Packet and their issues with chain plate access. So, for the second or third owners, etc. of these boats the maintenance issues fall on them.
Another design issue on the 43, not sure about the 42 is the mast step. A 4 foot section of a steel I beam was glassed into the hull with the mast stepped on the forward end. I’m curious as to the design theory. The issue of corrosion comes up with this design. When the time came to address the tank issues the mast step was addressed also.
I ran a beam across the main saloon through the portals, pulled the floor section up and used a come along to pull the water and then the fuel tank out of the bilge where I then cut them up with a saws all. I found a fabricator that “welds” plastic tanks and had a tank built to my design that would fit through the companion way. That tank sits in the bilge impervious to the salt water. Cross beams sit above the water tank where two aluminum fuel tanks, again designed to fit through the companion way, sit.
While the tanks were removed and the bilge area was totally open, it was an excellent time to replace the mast step. Removing that rusted steel I beam was a hassle for sure and it probably didn’t need to be replaced but I wasn’t sure until it was off the boat. I know now however that I have a solid mast step.
In replacing the tanks, I lost 92 gallons of water capacity, down from 200 gallons but I gained 25 gallons of fuel capacity, 175 gallons total now. I also have a 30 gallon an hour water maker so total capacity is sort of mute.
So that big question of having to deal with Endeavour’s tank issues and/or mast step, yes, it’s a hassle. However, it didn’t cost me 50k since I was willing to put in the sweatectomy. Including pulling the mast I completed that project for around 8k.
A boat purchase is a very personal decision. I have no doubt my decision to own this boat is not someone else’s cup of tea. Yes, there are definitely some bad designs out there. Do your homework and give it your best shot. Good luck.
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Old 13-05-2018, 17:53   #23
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

For clarity . . . this is not an indictment of the OP but rather the absurdity of this perennial question. In my opinion, the majority of sailors I've met in the last 35 years who extolled the virtues of their "blue water boats" were dock sissies/captains who never went anywhere but were quick to criticize others' boats who had tens of thousands of miles under their keels. Yes, there are always exceptions but most of these sages buy these boats to mask their own insecurities about sailing because they want to believe the boat will save them from their own incompetence and stupidity. I just talked with a "sailor" in the yard last week with a 50' Valiant. The boat was in poor condition and needed much attention. The boat hasn't left the dock in the last three years with the exception of the launch and haulout. Being unable to avoid him, he told me "that boat will take me anywhere" to which I replied: How about off the dock for a daysail for starters?" Well, I suppose that's why I never wanted to run for Student Council. In Exodus Mode . . . Rognvald
P.S. I would have no problems sailing a well-found Endeavour 42 anywhere. Maybe I'm just lucky.
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Old 13-05-2018, 20:20   #24
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

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Originally Posted by rognvald View Post
For clarity . . . this is not an indictment of the OP but rather the absurdity of this perennial question. In my opinion, the majority of sailors I've met in the last 35 years who extolled the virtues of their "blue water boats" were dock sissies/captains who never went anywhere but were quick to criticize others' boats who had tens of thousands of miles under their keels. Yes, there are always exceptions but most of these sages buy these boats to mask their own insecurities about sailing because they want to believe the boat will save them from their own incompetence and stupidity. I just talked with a "sailor" in the yard last week with a 50' Valiant. The boat was in poor condition and needed much attention. The boat hasn't left the dock in the last three years with the exception of the launch and haulout. Being unable to avoid him, he told me "that boat will take me anywhere" to which I replied: How about off the dock for a daysail for starters?" Well, I suppose that's why I never wanted to run for Student Council. In Exodus Mode . . . Rognvald
P.S. I would have no problems sailing a well-found Endeavour 42 anywhere. Maybe I'm just lucky.
Best answer award. Hands down.
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Old 13-05-2018, 21:10   #25
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Re: Endeavour 42 - why not a "blue water" boat?

On one of the other sides, I just met a dockmate whose double ended ketch is really decked out with teak and bronze art. Except the bottom has not been cleaned in possibly a couple years, the rest of the boat is well found and the details are meticulous. He told me that it has been an 12 year labor of love. He is about 7 or 8 years my senior, and I am 65, judging by military stories. I did not ask him if he is going cruising, because the work is his journey. I have been friends with many like him over the years. I have another friend who lives in a trawler in a boatyard for about 4 years this time. He is a retired engineer and he is getting ready for a cruise across the ocean. He has figured out or copied some really cool and innovative hardware and such things at a professional level. Last time I saw him he said he was debating adding 2 feet to the stern to add more storage. They both enjoy and revel in the work, I don't know if the second fellow is actually planning any cruise, or just says it as an easier explanation.
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