Visit our Popular Forums

psjanker · 17-02-2020, 11:37

Try “twenty small sailboats to take you anywhere” by John Vigor. It’s a good read and has acknowledgement from Good Old Boats and Lin and Larry Pardey.

Basically talking about boats that you can sail anywhere from a local lake to around the world’s great Capes.

I myself love Cape Dories and the men and women in the supporting Cape Dory Association. The prices range from very reasonable to free but the truck to hail them around will cost you a pretty penny. My first trip after a year long renovation (it had been on the hard for 13 years) was down the Potomac and a month long exploring of the Chesapeake Bay. All told about 500 miles. Total fuel cost was 32 dollars! That bought me 1/4 gal an hour cruising as well as all my meals( diesel stove).

Pete

loneshark64 · 17-02-2020, 12:20

I went through all this same stuff aaa you for years, planning etc. I wanted a trailer sailor that could do it all and save me storage and marina fees. I ended up compromising and got an old boat that could do only some of what I dreamed of but sailed really well. I have learned a lot since then about the real costs of things, the work involved, and what was important to me. Some of my earlier ideas were right and some I was wrong about. I had sailing experience but not larger boat owning experience.

I got an 85 O’day 28 for $15k a few yrs ago. You can get them for much less but this one surveyed well and had a lot of extras like autopilot, stack pack, dinghy,, and a recentish Yanmar 3GM30. 6’ standing room cabin, 10.5’ beam, 4.5’ draft. I obviously had to give up on the idea of trailering but I keep it on a mooring and pay for storage in the winter. I couldn’t be happier. The boat sails great.

I put in new chart plotter, radar and head myself. Replaced the running rigging, lifelines and a bunch of other stuff I can’t even remember. Economically it doesn’t make sense to put this money into an old boat, because In a few years they will be giving these things away, but it’s my boat and this is the stuff I want on the boat.

The other compromise is it is a coastal cruiser. It sails better than I could have hoped around the islands here in Maine but I would never take this boat far offshore. Too light, too short, not designed rigged or equipped for it. Some people do in these boats but not me. As an aside, people diss O’days - I didn’t want one after years of reading online - but the 28s and some others are really good boats. They were well built for the design point, and quite solid, and they skimped on some of the hardware and Cabin aesthetics. Very functional solid and mine is faster than we expected. Not a rocket ship but a sleeper in our little friendly contests. Moves along nicely between 8 and 20 kts of wind and is very forgiving.

My other learning is that though this old boat was in “sail away condition” it was not in “sail consistently condition”. Almost none of these old boats are when they sell. If you get a good one you can certainly use it right away but the gremlins are There to be found and the first year you will work and spend money. Also the 2nd 3rd and nth years.

Having a Sailboat is all compromises in my opinion. You have to pick your battles and pull the trigger on something. If I get bored with this or want to do something else I will sell it for a loss and buy another (but I am taking my radar and chart plotter with me...)

My 2 cents

GregD · 17-02-2020, 13:06

Having owned smaller sailboats for over 20 years and being in the sailboat industry during the 80 & 90's I'm familiar with your requirements. In the end, I think you will have to compromise on some of the characteristics you want. Not that you can't have all of the items on your wish list but some are going to affect the others.

For example, wanting a trailerable boat that is ocean capable means both characteristics will suffer. The ideal Great Lakes boat will have a SA/Disp. of 16 or higher and a displacement of 5-7,000 lbs. This will make it easy to trailer and responsive when sailing in this area with lighter winds. An ocean capable boat doesn’t need that much sail area but needs a displacement of closer to 10,000 lbs. to be able to carry more supplies. This makes the boat harder to trailer and launch and very sluggish while you sail it at your current home or on a smaller lake.

My suggestion would be to look for boats that will fit your current needs of sailing in the Great Lakes and other smaller bodies of water and if you make the commitment to sail around the Caribbean or West Coast then replace the boat with one more suitable for ocean work.

A boat you should consider is the Pearson 27-2. Not the older 26 but the boat designed by Shaw and built at the Tillotson-Pearson yard during the mid-late 80's. I owned one for a number of years and was very very happy with it. Here are a few reasons to consider it.

Standing headroom.

Salon forward design eliminates the traditional V-berth which on a boat this size is very small.

Salon forward design gives you a large double berth when in port by lowering the table.

Rear quarterberth gives you a secure sea berth.

Solid hull with no core. A cored hull which is dry will be difficult to find on a 30+ year old boat.

Wheel steering which most of them came with. As a side note, when I originally bought my Pearson I had plans to convert it to a tiller for the reasons mentioned by others. This is easy to do because of the outboard mounted rudder. After sailing the boat for a season ( Lake St Clair) I ended up liking it for the ease it gave me when singlehanding. I would tighten the friction brake slightly then stand in front of the wheel and could reach all the control lines and reach back to adjust the course just as easily. Tacking, gybing, hoisting or dropping the spinnaker was a breeze. In the end I kept the wheel and although it does take up cockpit space it has some advantages.

Large well insulated icebox.

The boat sails very good. I won a number of singlehanded races against faster boats. Some of this was due to the ease of handling the sails, as mentioned earlier, but the boat really sails well in a variety of conditions.

Great ventilation. All the ports open and have screens. There is also a large forward hatch.

Universal diesel engine.

Secure cockpit with bridgedeck and short drain run.

Shoal draft wing keel with 3’4” draft.

Isomat spar with readily available parts.

Finally, the yard that built the boat had (and still has) a very good reputation. Pearson spent money to build a quality product. Some examples - they upgraded the prop shaft to 1” diameter where most boats this size are ¾”, bronze ball style thru-hulls instead of plastic or gate valves common in the era, large bronze Groco strainer on the engine intake, an icebox that drains via a hand pump to the sink instead of directly into the bilge thereby eliminating stinky water in the bilge or the loss of cold air thru an open drain, exceptional fiberglass work, etc.

I hope this helps and good Luck on your search!

larrys · 17-02-2020, 13:46

I was faced with similar considerations back in 1996, when I came across two books by Ferenc Maté: “The Worlds Best Sailboats” and “Best Boats to Build or Buy”. Influenced by these books, I purchased a Morris Frances 26, which has served me well over the years. Now, my wife and I are in our eightieth years and not in good health, so we are considering selling Acadia. Because she is a double ender, Acadia's tiller swings over just a small part of her cockpit. Ergonomic problems associated with long periods at the tiller are mitigated by use of her Fleming wind vane. Her Taylor kerosene oven is gimbaled, but only athwart-ships.

peteC · 17-02-2020, 13:51

Have you considered a Seaward 28?. It has a variable draft 1.5 - 6 ft. Many have wheels and 2 hp yanmars that push them @ 7 knots. They are very trailerable. They were designed for Florida waters that have ever changing bottom depths.

GregD · 17-02-2020, 14:48

LarryS,

Morris Frances 26. I take back what I said earlier. You can have it all

What a beautiful boat!

tomtriad · 17-02-2020, 15:17

Have you considered a folding trailerable trimaran such as a Farrier/ Corsair 27 or 31? The latter has 6' headroom and fair accomodation.
The former has less, but a pop top can be raised in fine weather or when moored.

A lot more performance - if you like to sail.

Outboard only - a 9.9 4 stroke will push you along reliably and cheaply - about 6 knots and 10 mpg.

Nucopia · 17-02-2020, 16:25

G’day all
I am from the East coast of Australia and just getting back into sailing after a long absense.
I was drawn to this thread, as I am also looking for a boat (trailer sailor) with similar characteristics as Great Lake Sailor , only available for me to buy in Australia.
I live on the shores of Lake Macquarie which is the largest salt water lake in the Southern Hemisphere, its a great place to sail and learn but I dont want to pay to moor a small boat if I can help it . Last time I sailed , it was on 16 ft skiffs and J24s but that was many years ago. Hence the reason I wanted a smallish boat to begin with and also one I can transport on a trailer for trips away. My intention was sailing on lake Mac and later transporting it up the North coast of Aust and sailing it around the great barrier reef port hopping , which woukd be a great way for both my self and my wife to gain more sailing experience.
Thanks for posting Great Lakes Sailor and all those posting replies . Some great helpful information which is much appreciated ..

**Don C L** · 17-02-2020, 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nucopia

G’day all
I am from the East coast of Australia and just getting back into sailing after a long absense.
I was drawn to this thread, as I am also looking for a boat (trailer sailor) with similar characteristics as Great Lake Sailor , only available for me to buy in Australia.
I live on the shores of Lake Macquarie which is the largest salt water lake in the Southern Hemisphere, its a great place to sail and learn but I dont want to pay to moor a small boat if I can help it . Last time I sailed , it was on 16 ft skiffs and J24s but that was many years ago. Hence the reason I wanted a smallish boat to begin with and also one I can transport on a trailer for trips away. My intention was sailing on lake Mac and later transporting it up the North coast of Aust and sailing it around the great barrier reef port hopping , which woukd be a great way for both my self and my wife to gain more sailing experience.
Thanks for posting Great Lakes Sailor and all those posting replies . Some great helpful information which is much appreciated ..

Welcome aboard Nucopia!

wingssail · 17-02-2020, 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreatLakeSailor

As I am researching and asking questions - hence the thread - please do explain what you mean.

To illustrate why I ask the question - go back to my 2nd point about wanting wheel steer due to ergonomics. The ergonomics I am referring to are not me getting around the cockpit, rather the operability of a tiller over extended periods of time/miles. In the way I am looking at this equation - the cockpit space is irrelevant if I can't hold up to the rigors of operating the boat. I've been down that road before - albiet in a completely different style of boat/environment (16' skiff with a 25hp motor) - but it was a tiller motor until I remoted it. So again - from an operational perspective of ergonomics - I don't like the idea of a tiller for obvious reasons if you read through what I said and understand the perspective from which I spoke. That is what I am asking for in your explanation.

How do you describe "cockpit ergonomics" and how can a wheel, contrasting to my perspective of operable ergonomics, impact that so much that it should be considered, or even viewed as an over-riding thought beyond that of ergonomics while under-way operating the boat?

I just want to say to you that your idea of sitting in the middle of your cockpit with two hands on the wheel for hours on end is based on a false assumption. That is the way most people motor, not sail, and it is for when the boat is level. But most people sailing are sitting on one side, next to the wheel, and steering with one hand. Not too much different from using a tiller.

When I see a cruising sailboat with a big binnacle mounted chart plotter and a captains chair right behind the wheel, I know they are not sailing very much, the boat is set up for motoring.

The solution is to get self steering, either wind vane of autopilot. And have a tiller or a wheel.

acem · 17-02-2020, 18:34

A catalina 27 would work. I would not want a lot of people on board for a long time but a couple could sail for some time.

Ours served us well until a tornado rolled up our marina. We trailered her home. She needs a mast and a little work.

Thx-Ace

micski001 · 18-02-2020, 02:39

i have a 1983 27' hunter with inboard diesel,9'3" beam and 3'3" shoal draft keel 6' clearance in cabin

Miatadude · 18-02-2020, 06:46

You might want to look at an Aloha, manufactured in Whitby Ontario. They check all your boxes and are built very well. I have an 8.5 (28 foot) and am very happy with it. They came standard with a tiller, and optional wheel, which mine has. They range from 27' to 34'.

Detailed specs can be found at the Aloha Owners website.

wyeiwyr · 18-02-2020, 19:03

I needed the same qualifications as you. After getting footitis, working myself up from 27 to 51 ft over the years, I decided enough was enough! Leaving a boat at a dock or on the hard can be costly. I decided to get a boat that I could trailer, and still go to the Bahamas or Sea of Cortez. I love the classic looks, so went for the 25 Bayfield! I have trailered it from Baja California to Miami and back, at 3500lbs, it towed well. I Sailed the Bahamas and Sea of Cortez. I am 68, and can still step the mast and launch by myself, and with the shallow draft, have no trouble launching. The 1 GM Yanmar burns little fuel. I am 5’ 11”, and headroom is adequate. I have spent a month gunkholeing, with 2 guests and a small dog aboard, and still parted friends! What more can you ask! Recently I have bought another 25 Bayfield, this one with a tiller. I think it will be better than the wheel, because there is more room in the cockpit, and I found with my first 27, more fun to sail with. I will also be installing a 2 cyl Yanmar, to get a bit more power. Handy in stormy weather! I hope you find the boat you are looking for, and enjoy every moment!