Cal 28 vs Cascade 29 vs Catalina 28

[Bash]

Originally Posted by benajah

Please, members come here looking for information, please do not jump on them, it's a big turn off.

Yes, most members come here looking for information. But some are just trolls.

When someone's objective is to slag someone else's boat, I don't mind "turning them off" at all. We don't need that here.

[burtonridr]

Originally Posted by Bash

Wrong. I do not currently own a Catalina, and have never owned one in the past. I crewed to silver in the Catalina 36 Nationals, and won the Catalina 42 division in the Doublehanded Farallones, but that's pretty much the extent of my relationship with the boat. And it's still spelled C-a-t-a-l-i-n-a.

Let me lay it out for you simply: there are forums where you can go to slag all sorts of boats, especially production boats, with impunity. This isn't one of them. I'm happy to recommend one of those other forums where that kind of trolling would be appreciated.

You're way off base claiming that everyone says they are flimsy. Everyone? That's flat out untrue. So what's the point of you slagging a boat you've never even been aboard? Do you think this makes you seem knowledgeable?

I have no interest in entering into your debate, especially if you haven't got the capacity to engage in basic research on these boats.

Bash,

I enjoy this forum, everyone here has been super nice and helpful. I really appreciate all the input from everyone, there is a lot I dont know and I'm grateful everyone else has been so nice. However, I dont feel you have been very helpful,

Originally Posted by Bash

Your source on the Catalina (note the spelling) 28 is flat-out wrong, and you ought to be ashamed of yourself for passing such misinformation along in a forum where first-hand knowledge is preferred over innuendo.

I found your first(and second) post to be rude and insulting. You are right, I have no first hand knowledge and I did not claim too. I started this thread looking for first hand information to clarify what I have read online about the catilina boats. I'm sure the catilinas are great boats, to me they all look like great boats, I dont know the difference. I might buy one, which is why I want to address the flimsy thing I keep reading.

[burtonridr]

Originally Posted by Butler

I've sailed on an older (wooden cabin) Cascade 29 and was impressed with the sturdiness of these boats. In remember it as having a pretty good turn of speed and decent tracking (large, skeg-hung rudder) I have read of two different 29s that have crossed oceans.

Thats interesting, so the Cascade is wood cabin, what are the other typically made of?

[zeehag]

cascade were kit boats with some factory finish, as were yorktown and westsail. finish depends on first owner. very sturdy and seem to be good cruisers.
cal 28 flushdeck is a decent and roomy boat can go anywhere.
catalina 27 is a lil more limited in function than either of the others.
cal and catalina were all factory nothing kit about them. both 100 percent fiberglass hull and deck.

[Cheechako]

No, Not all Cascades are a wood cabin. That was likely a quite old one...? As mentioned many were home finished, which makes the Cascades , in general, harder to sell in my opinion. However, I think the post that mentioned they are pretty well built is correct from what I've seen. Probably a cut above the others mentioned as far as hull/deck etc.

[Steve W]

"Flimsy" is not a word I have ever seen used to describe any sailiboat in any of the sailing related forums, magazines or books, especially when it comes to bashing production sailboats, so the OP's source may not be credible. There is a very nice looking, late model Catalina 28 in my marina and I've noticed the senior owner does not shy away from taking it out in challenging conditions and it seems to do just fine. Flimsy?? Not at all. Maybe a Macgregor, but not a Catalina 28 when compared to similar boats.

[Adelie]

CAL 28 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
CASCADE 29 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
CATALINA 28 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

Keep in mind there is a newer model Cal28 from the 1980's that is a completely different boat.

Cal 28:
PHRF-204 (207 w/ inboard engine)
Nice big wide deck and side decks to work on.
Single lowers would need to be modified into double lowers for cruising.
Ignoring ballast weight and adjusting for length and beam about the same amount of weight has been devoted to structure as the Catalina 28. This ignores quality of workmanship, quality of engineering and ignores the fact that the Cat28 has a more extensive liner which may or may not contribute to structural strength.
Although most models are driven by an outboard which cuts into fuel economy compared to diesel, repairing or replacing it will be a LOT cheaper.


Cascade 29
PHRF-228 Significantly slower than the other 2 boats in moderate winds. In light winds it may be comparable or bette depending on how much sail can be set. In heavy winds it will probably have a significant advantage upwind. Some examples of this boat have bowsprits which may improve performance in moderate winds.
Much more heavily build and likely much more resistant to capsize than the other 2 boats.
Side decks are narrow but not dangerously so.
Double lowers.
At least 2 have been round the world.


Catalina 28
PHRF-195 (186 w/ tall mast)
Single lowers and swept back spreaders are not the greatest for offshore work.
Side decks are narrow, but not dangerously so.
I would not be terribly enamored of the interior arrangements for offshore work: significant amounts of storage sacrificed to the undercockpit berth that may not be very usable in bumpy conditions.


On the whole I would go for the Cal or the Cascade, cheaper to acquire, easier to modify. If you are more interested in really bulletproof, go for the Cascade. If you want a bit more space below go for the Cal. Both are suitably strong for going offshore.

Whichever boat you get you will need a drifter and pole for light winds conditions, and you will want to build or buy a windvane. Better sails and more attention to sailing can make up significantly for having a slower boat.

Get an autopilot for motoring and very light winds but don't count on it for most of your sailing.

[evm1024]

I lived aboard a Cal 2-29 for about 4 years. I don't know if it was the same hull as the 28 or not. It is a very sturdy boat which will surf at 11+ knots. I ran mine up and down the Washington coast about 11 times from the Columbia to the San Juans. One time we were out in 45 kt winds and 18' seas laughing our arses off as we surfed off the waves. As I say very sturdy.

The thing that I liked most about the 2-29 was that is backed up in good control. I could back the boat over 100' into my slip with 2 or 3 turns in the path. Wish my current boat would back down like that.

Cascade Yachts have their factory here in Portland. You can drive down and talk to them all you want. Actually you can bring your boat down to their yard and do your own work or have them do it. New owners but still the same customer service.

THere are many Cascade Yachts in the moorage where I keep my boat. THe Prior owner of Cascade keeps his boat a few slips away from me. There are advantages to a company that is still around, local and willing to talk with you.

Regards, E

[crashkahuna]

I sail in Hawaii and have owned 2 Cals there which were great. I also have sailed on my friends Catalina 28 and it seemed well built. He takes it inter island. I would say hull is strong enough. And he has rigged it in a way that it can handle the conditions there.

[SkiprJohn]

The factory finished Cascade 29s have a molded fiberglass deck and cabin top. Most were owner built so will a glass covered plywood deck and cabin. If a surveyor feels that the finish of the Cascade you are looking at is good then it'll be a good strong go anywhere boat.

I could be wrong but the last time I was at the Portland Cascade yard it was gone or being used by a different boating group.

kind regards,

[evm1024]

Originally Posted by SkiprJohn

The factory finished Cascade 29s have a molded fiberglass deck and cabin top. Most were owner built so will a glass covered plywood deck and cabin. If a surveyor feels that the finish of the Cascade you are looking at is good then it'll be a good strong go anywhere boat.

I could be wrong but the last time I was at the Portland Cascade yard it was gone or being used by a different boating group.

kind regards,

Naw, I could be wrong. Been a while since I was in the yard. I do drive past there every other day so I might ask.

--E

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by burtonridr

Bash,

I found your first(and second) post to be rude and insulting.

Don't take it personally - he's like that with everyone .


BTW I think I know what it ryhmes with - do I win a prize? or 2 .

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by SkiprJohn

The factory finished Cascade 29s have a molded fiberglass deck and cabin top. Most were owner built so will a glass covered plywood deck and cabin. If a surveyor feels that the finish of the Cascade you are looking at is good then it'll be a good strong go anywhere boat.

I could be wrong but the last time I was at the Portland Cascade yard it was gone or being used by a different boating group.

kind regards,

The company changed hands about 2-3 yr ago, moved to Seaside OR, briefly, then up to a small town outside of Astoria,OR.


The Cascade 29 is, to the best of my knowledge, the fiberglass sailboat with the longest production run ever. It was introduced in 1961 and is still available to order.

More worthless trivia is that the Chinook 34 (built by Yacht Constructors, the original name for what is now Cascade Yachts) arguably predates the Triton as the first production fiberglass sailboat. The arguable part is that the original run of Chinooks was a bunch of buddies building several hulls for themselves. Others liked the results and wanted boats too, so a couple of the buddies established a company to fill them.

[burtonridr]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

Don't take it personally - he's like that with everyone .


BTW I think I know what it ryhmes with - do I win a prize? or 2 .

Lol

[Seafarer24]

I thought the New Horizons 26 built by Ray Greene in the '50s was the first production fiberglass auxillary?

Otherwise- in order to contribute -I say go for the Cal. The flush-decked designs can be modified to have a small raised section over the companionway like this one in FL:
'74 Cal 27' Sailboat