Boats Less Than $30K Recent Noteworthy Finds

[SuW]

1986 Aloha 32 in Georgian Bay, Ontario. $29K Canadian (about $23K US).

https://www.kijiji.ca/v-sailboat/bar...986/1602572972

I like these boats. This designer (Ellis) had some interesting ideas back in the day. Good use of space, no v-berth; double and single berth aft of the companionway, and two single berths/couches forward in a cabin that can be closed off with a door and a sliding bulkhead.

They are reputed to sail well. They sell well in Canada at least. I've known several families cruise from Canada to the Caribbean and back on Aloha 32s and 34s. Hauled and mast down every winter, I think, which cuts down on wear and tear.

This example appears to be in good shape for its age with some good gear for cruising in no particular order (anchor platform, windlass, heater, wind vane, wind generator, 4 opening ports, recent instruments, recent canvas dodger/bimini, dinghy and outboard). No mention of engine age/hours.

The downside for anyone outside Ontario is this is relatively hard to get to. You could sail it from there to anywhere but it would be an adventure!

The price is in the right ball park for a boat like this, where it is, if the engine is good.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by Steadman Uhlich

That's my view of how this discussion was started, of course others may see things differently.

Yes, you've created a monster Steadman that has taken a life of it's own! That will tech you to go silent on us.

Originally Posted by Steadman Uhlich

Yes. My thoughts too. I would not want to cruise in them.

While an old racing boat may be less expensive to buy initially, I suspect there will be higher costs (and tradeoffs) later, due to stressed condition, old sails, lack of tankage (you mentioned), and other issues.

For one thing, many lack opening ports (something I would want for tropical cruising.

Another thing: some have low trunk cabins, or less (and may have little storage, small lockers inside, rudimentary heads and galleys, etc.

I think this thread is better served with more "cruising" oriented boats, rather than racing boats, though there are of course exceptions. No hard rules, just some opinion.

Yet the post below leans heavily towards a racing boat(Racer/Cruiser). No opening ports in the salon area and I know the storage on these are not great.

Originally Posted by Steadman Uhlich

1979 C&C Landfall 38

ASKING PRICE = US$29,900

LOCATION = Islamorada Florida USA

LISTING LINK: https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/1979-c$c-landfall-38-7836603/



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STEADMAN'S QUICK OBSERVATIONS:

This boat's layout has always appealed to me. I like the layout and design for these reasons:
1. Head and galley amidships
2. Head looks spacious (I think this would appeal to liveaboard or couples)
3. I like the galley, with cabinets, and notice the stainless handrail.
4. I like how the aft berths are located and how they look. Looking at the photos in this ad, the spaces look clean and comfortable for sleeping.
5. I like the use of wood in the interior.
6. Draft is 4.92 feet

__________

A quick look over the photos in this ad gave me the impression this boat is:
1. In nice condition
2. Clean (looks like recent upholstery in the interior)
3. Well equipped for Florida or Caribbean cruising with newer electronics including RADAR
4. Has several features in the cockpit area that make for comfort (Bimini, Dodger, BBQ, Rail Seat, cushions, etc.
5. Not sure if the hard bottom dinghy is included, but that would be nice if so
6. has swim ladder on stern
7. Engine looks clean(er) than most old boats

8. Self-tailing primary winches
9. Dorade vents near the mast

My overall impression is this boat looks like it was recently renovated or updated and kept clean. It looks like it is in better condition than many others of this age.

In short, this boat may be close to "ready to go" at this price point.
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NOTE: See earlier posts in this long thread (see first few pages) for more examples of this boat, with following comments about hull construction etc.
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[Tetepare]

I love this thread. It's my favorite thread on the whole internet.

You know what gets me? The classic 70s and 80s boats under 30 ft and often under $25k.

Odd, most people like looking at larger boats than they own. Nope, I eagerly run through the most recent posts to see if there's some old Cape Dory 27 or the like...classic lines, WAAAYY more teak in the cockpit than I'd like, no running water. So simply, yet cruisable, and so beautiful.

Mind you, I won't buy any of the beauties that have been posted, but I often think "I COULD BUY THAT NOW!" and see myself sailing off for a weekend. Heck, I dream that I have a fleet of full keel oldies that I saved and savor. But, of course, I need another boat like I need another kid.

So thanks all, and keep it up.

[ArmySailor]

Originally Posted by Don C L

You know, pertinent to this thread, I think you will find that once you are there, either in a harbor or cruising, you will find many kindred souls just sorta show up to help. You can't really predict it or quantify it, but you won't be just buying a boat, you will be joining a community too. Things and tips and a helping hand and "good deals" on things just start to show up. You won't have to do, or know, everything yourself all the time, or right off the bat.

This is something I've been experiencing for the last 4 years of boat ownership, but never heard articulated like this. Hammer --> nail --> head

[JoeRobertJr]

Originally Posted by sv_pelagia

Landfall 38:

That looks like a great deal for a nice boat. Not sure about the engine.

We owned a LF38 for 7 years, and loved her. This one looks identical (in layout) to ours.

Things to consider:
- The hull is balsa cored, so it needs to be checked for water ingress. (We found out the hard way... $$)
- the V-berth is too short for tall people (>6ft)
- the so-called "double" quarter berth on the port side is too narrow for 2 adults (but very comfortable for 1 tall adult, as is the single starboard quarter berth)
- there is no real "nav station/nav desk"
- the head is large, but "wet" for showers (no separate shower stall). Its location is excellent.
- icebox insulation may be very poor (we tore ours apart and found <1" insulation with several gaps)
- main salon is large and great for entertaining.

A good boat. Sails great.

Thank you for your observations! Thanks also to Steadman for posting this one in the first place. This boat is close enough to what I am looking for that I put it on my tracking list, and I included your commentary.

[CaptWho]

40 Foot William Garden Design Sailboat - $3,000

https://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/b...435424960.html

[hpeer]

Now that tickles my fancy. I like the hard dodger and the gallows and the high combings. I think this would make a very attractive cruiser extending your seasons nicely. She gives a lot of protection to the top side crew. Depending on how that dodger is finished, if it is not open to below it may be a decent sea boat, but if open the big glass is a vulnerability off shore.

Almost looks like mast steps. Profurl furling. Superficially she looks like a lot if care was taken with the original construction and fit out.

It would be interesting to know what engine wa in the boat, maybe a 4-108, in which case a repower may be pretty economical and easy.

[AKA-None]

Originally Posted by SuW

Absolutely! That's what it's for. Although if it's your own boat, be prepared for questions.

Also, I guess if you are looking for something in particular why not ask? There are some useful voices on here - and the advice is free

And worth every penny

Also post in boats for sale

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by CaptWho

40 Foot William Garden Design Sailboat - $3,000

https://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/b...435424960.html

Hellava deal. But without an engine, you better live in Washington and have a place to keep her.

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

I love this thread. It's my favorite thread on the whole internet.

You know what gets me? The classic 70s and 80s boats under 30 ft and often under $25k.

Odd, most people like looking at larger boats than they own. Nope, I eagerly run through the most recent posts to see if there's some old Cape Dory 27 or the like...classic lines, WAAAYY more teak in the cockpit than I'd like, no running water. So simply, yet cruisable, and so beautiful.

Mind you, I won't buy any of the beauties that have been posted, but I often think "I COULD BUY THAT NOW!" and see myself sailing off for a weekend. Heck, I dream that I have a fleet of full keel oldies that I saved and savor. But, of course, I need another boat like I need another kid.

So thanks all, and keep it up.

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by sv_pelagia

Landfall 38:

That looks like a great deal for a nice boat. Not sure about the engine.

We owned a LF38 for 7 years, and loved her. This one looks identical (in layout) to ours.

Things to consider:
- The hull is balsa cored, so it needs to be checked for water ingress. (We found out the hard way... $$)
- the V-berth is too short for tall people (>6ft)
- the so-called "double" quarter berth on the port side is too narrow for 2 adults (but very comfortable for 1 tall adult, as is the single starboard quarter berth)
- there is no real "nav station/nav desk"
- the head is large, but "wet" for showers (no separate shower stall). Its location is excellent.
- icebox insulation may be very poor (we tore ours apart and found <1" insulation with several gaps)
- main salon is large and great for entertaining.

A good boat. Sails great.

Good to know. Thanks for adding your observations.

I was aware of the hull composition, but in a hurry with my OP, and did not post about that, but am glad you mentioned it.
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MY SINCERE POV:
I am glad to see other CF members, especially owners of these boats, contribute their observations, opinions, and experience with any of these boats.

I have not owned them, and am just sharing what I see/like and as a stimulus to more discussion and more observations from more experienced sailors like yourself.

I think it is good when many eyes look, and share what they see/like/dislike or any cautions about a boat/design/condition.



That knowledge sharing is very good for this community, and over time I hope it helps other sailors who are new to the boat search process to learn things, avoid pitfalls (or money pits), and have better chance of finding a good boat for them. I know I have learned a LOT from the many CF members who have contributed their observations and experiences with these boats.

Thanks. .
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It appears the saloon does not have any opening portlights (Celestial Sailor and I noticed this, and he mentioned it in a comment). How was the ventilation in the saloon when at anchor?

The boat in the OP does have some Dorades on deck, but I assume those are optional or may have been added by an owner, not aware if they came standard on this design. Do you know if they were a standard feature of the design?

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Hellava deal. But without an engine, you better live in Washington and have a place to keep her.

What follows is written in a friendly tone of voice.

I like the exterior design (from what we can see in the few photos).
I do like the dodger.

As I know some of the readers of this thread are less experienced sailors or may have never owned a big sailboat yet...

What do you (or any CF member) think it would cost to re-power this size boat with a suitable diesel engine?

I am guessing several thousand dollars for a new or used engine with possible necessary add-ons. Possibly $8K for used, or $12K new?



Would that be enough? Not enough? This is just a guess on my part, as I have not been focused on replacement engine costs for several years.
_____________

Since there are no photos shown of the interior, and the price is so low, I assume it would take a lot of "refit" inside, (or it may be gutted already).

[Steadman Uhlich]

1978 Hinterhoeller Niagara 35

LOA = 35'
YEAR = 1978
DRAFT = 5.17 feet
BOATS BUILT = 260

ASKING PRICE = $25,564 US ($32,000 CAN)


LOCATION: PRINCE EDWARD ISLAND, CANADA (near Nova Scotia)

LISTING LINK: https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/197...ra-35-8010153/

__________________

STEADMAN'S OBSERVATIONS:

1. This is an older boat (1978) with a newer engine (2002 Volvo MK2030D, 27hp)
2. This layout is unusual, but I like it.
3. There is a midships saloon and head, aft double berth
4. There is a workshop area in forepeak (where another boat would have a Vberth)
5. Nice teak joinery (interior)

6. From the photos, this appears to be in good condition and well kept.

7. LOCATION: Prince Edward Island is just off the coast of Nova Scotia Canada. I have read about it, and would very much like to see it and the surroundings and the nearby Cape Breton Island (just to the east of Prince Edward) with the Bras d'Or lakes there. It is also not far from Newfoundland, another wonderful place to cruise. In short, this could be a nice starting point for cruising.
_________________

This design was posted in this thread years ago, so you might find more comments from previous owners and other on it there, or use the Google search feature on CF to look for other discussions of this design. I noticed this sale listing and was reminded of the design.
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CAVEAT EMPTOR!
As always, take my comments with a splash of saltwater. I am not a boat builder, and I have NO connection to this boat or its owner or broker. I am not the most experienced sailor on CF and do not claim any expertise.

I am sharing my opinion on boats, based on my own likes and my personal experience (so far 8,150 offshorepassage miles) sailing on a wide variety of boats (from oldies to new million dollar boats).

I have some personal preferences too. I tend to like classic styled boats. I like traditional styling. I appreciate good looks, use of wood, fiberglass hulls, and comforts.

For the purposes of this discussion topic, I am sharing boats that are inexpensive ( Less than $30K), or may be within the budget of many people. I am merely sharing something in this discussion thread that I saw and thought might interest some CF Members.

I also know that not every sailboat buyer is going to take their boat on a circumnavigation, and some never spend much time in "blue water." For some buyers/owners, it is OK to simply have a boat at the dock. Or one to live on at anchor. So, different boats for different folks. 

And there is no shame in wanting to own a boat that may not be ready for blue water or ocean crossing. Most sailboat owners fall into that category. We can all enjoy boats for different reasons. 

I hope this helps someone.

[SuW]

Originally Posted by Steadman Uhlich

1978 Hinterhoeller Niagara 35
ASKING PRICE = $25,564 US ($32,000 CAN)
LOCATION: PRINCE EDWARD ISLAND, CANADA (near Nova Scotia)
LISTING LINK: https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/197...ra-35-8010153/
__________________
STEADMAN'S OBSERVATIONS:
1. This is an older boat (1978) with a newer engine (2002 Volvo MK2030D, 27hp)
2. This layout is unusual, but I like it.
3. There is a midships saloon and head, aft double berth
4. There is a workshop area in forepeak (where another boat would have a Vberth)
5. Nice teak joinery (interior)
6. From the photos, this appears to be in good condition and well kept.
7. LOCATION: Prince Edward Island is just off the coast of Nova Scotia Canada. I have read about it, and would very much like to see it and the surroundings and the nearby Cape Breton Island (just to the east of Prince Edward) with the Bras d'Or lakes there. It is also not far from Newfoundland, another wonderful place to cruise. In short, this could be a nice starting point for cruising.
_________________

This design was posted in this thread years ago, so you might find more comments from previous owners and other on it there, or use the Google search feature on CF to look for other discussions of this design. I noticed this sale listing and was reminded of the design.
__________________

Yeah, this is a good find! Another Mark Ellis design, very well reputed in Canada. (If this was in Lake Ontario, it would be sold already, imo).
Ellis designed the Nonsuch, Aloha and Niagara. I would recommend these.

We know a family of three who cruised extensively from Canada to Caribbean in a Niagara 35. The boat worked really well for them. They said it sailed well too.

The galley design is especially good with full-height standing room and good flat footing for the cook. Lots of light (hatch overhead). Sink on one side on the boat centerline, stove on the other. The only thing I really (really, really) don't like is the propane water heater. I think they came standard, because they all seemed to have them. Some people shrug, but insurance companies do not like them.

I think the head compartment has two doors, making a thru passage so the cook won't be disturbed

The anchoring system, iirc, is good. Not many small boats can fit a Manson and it has a manual windlass (which I prefer). Also self-tailing primaries.

Dodger, bimini, sail covers are pale grey, not my choice as they show dirt and don't block light as well. The interior upholstery is whitish too, and perhaps a few buttons missing.

Opening ports; I can see 4, the listing says 6, perhaps there are a couple in to the cockpit for the aft berths.

These boats have a good reputation and not many come up for sale. They were expensive when new and are a considerable step above the finish of all the other Canadian boatbuilders (apart from Gozzard, perhaps).

[Tetepare]

Iirc the Niagara 35 has a balsa cored hull which can be problematic up north.

On Lake Ontario most are pretty old and tired and now sell for about US$25k. That said, an old salt couple sold theirs last summer, near Bristol, and it went fast at about $50k.