Bluewater 38-42' choices on a budget

[Scubaseas]

Tartan TOCK if you can find one. Tartan 41 Maybe. I'm personally fond of Tayana V42s.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by sgwright

*Morgan 382/3/4

I circumnavigated on a Morgan 382. I would urge you to a 383 or 384 if you were looking at them. The taller rig will give you better performance, and the cockpit mounted traveler in the 382 is a real PITA.

I was often the slower boat in a group, but not usually by a whole lot. I made SF to Hawaii in 14 days, which I thought was outstanding. Upwind performance leaves more to be desired. The saloon is not as spacious as other boats of the same size.

Overall a good boat. It isn't the best at anything, but doesn't have anything so screwed up you hate it. A good balance. Very economical to purchase and fit.

I've never been on a C&C 35mk2, but you might not gain much if the interior of the C&C is well designed. A Catalina 36 has more interior space than I do.

[Lee Jerry]

Surprised no one has mentioned:
Swan
Baltic
Bristol

There should be several models in your range from each of them. Would probably have to add the inner stay, but that applies to many of the others previously discussed.

[off-piste]

Originally Posted by sgwright

I've been aboard a Saga 43, they are a beautifully finished boat, but even further out of our price range than a Nordic! Our budget and preferences pretty much dictate a design from the 70s or 80s...

Feels like most people replying don't know how much these boats are selling for

[Bowdrie]

Checking off all your boxes is not easy, especially the ones about sea-berths and quarter berth or aft cabin.
You do indicate some performance targets, which this boat should do.
Perhaps something like this would hit most of the marks.
Fuel/water capacity? That's not so easy.
Anyway.
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/198...n-371-8789996/

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by off-piste

Feels like most people replying don't know how much these boats are selling for

I was the one that mentioned the Saga. I own one, so I am very aware of what they cost. And I specifically stated that it was probably out of his price range. But there is a Saga 43 available today for $129,000. Given that all of his criteria will be hard to fit into a single boat, and many in his budget will be considerably older than a Saga (and therefore likely needing more work and money to make ready), it didn't seem too far out of line.

[sgwright]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

Checking off all your boxes is not easy, especially the ones about sea-berths and quarter berth or aft cabin.
You do indicate some performance targets, which this boat should do.
Perhaps something like this would hit most of the marks.
Fuel/water capacity? That's not so easy.
Anyway.
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/198...n-371-8789996/

Thanks, I've looked at that one, and a few similar Swan and Baltic designs, but I find the high bridgedeck and traveller placement not suitable for cruising. Yes, sometimes the traveller can be moved forward to permit a proper dodger, but getting in & out of the companionway in a big sea would not be ideal, having to crawl under the dodger. I have sailed on another Ron Holland boat like that, it sailed well, but the companionway setup got old quickly.

[sgwright]

Funny, I thought there were a few more posts here last time I looked suggesting some other boats, including a few models I hadn't looked into before. I guess they were deleted.
Just because a boat you suggest doesn't appeal to me, doesn't mean it's a bad boat. There are boats that I like from nearly every maker out there, but only a small subset that also meet my needs for the next boat. Every boat is a compromise...
Thanks to those who have weighed in, and I hope this thread may also help others with similar criteria.

[sgwright]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

I was the one that mentioned the Saga. I own one, so I am very aware of what they cost. And I specifically stated that it was probably out of his price range. But there is a Saga 43 available today for $129,000. Given that all of his criteria will be hard to fit into a single boat, and many in his budget will be considerably older than a Saga (and therefore likely needing more work and money to make ready), it didn't seem too far out of line.

Thanks, I thought I'd already replied, but some of the posts seem to have gone amiss. I agree, this one is very well equipped, and warrants a closer look. Location in Hawaii isn't ideal though.

[Lee Jerry]

Baltic 42DP

1. Performance - check
2. Sea berths - check (2x settees and pilot berth)
3. Separate shower - no
4. Cutter - need to add, if required
5. Tankage - check(ish) (170L of fuel and , 227L of water, per salboatdata)
6. Private aft cabin - check


Here's one in "project" condition (well within budget):
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/198...42-dp-8381625/

Here's one in cruising condition, just completed circumnavigation (somewhat above budget):
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/198...dp-42-8539963/

Both on the Left coast.




(Yes, a bunch of posts have gone missing.)

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Lee Jerry

Baltic 42DP

1. Performance - check
2. Sea berths - check (2x settees and pilot berth)
3. Separate shower - no
4. Cutter - need to add, if required
5. Tankage - check(ish) (170L of fuel and , 227L of water, per salboatdata)
6. Private aft cabin - check


Here's one in "project" condition (well within budget):
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/198...42-dp-8381625/

Here's one in cruising condition, just completed circumnavigation (somewhat above budget):

https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/198...dp-42-8539963/

Both on the Left coast.

(Yes, a bunch of posts have gone missing.)

These are excellent boat withs unsurpassed sailing characteristics. Also roomy.

What did you see in the first listing that makes it a "project" boat?

[Bowdrie]

Originally Posted by sgwright

Thanks, I've looked at that one, and a few similar Swan and Baltic designs, but I find the high bridgedeck and traveller placement not suitable for cruising. Yes, sometimes the traveller can be moved forward to permit a proper dodger, but getting in & out of the companionway in a big sea would not be ideal, having to crawl under the dodger. I have sailed on another Ron Holland boat like that, it sailed well, but the companionway setup got old quickly.

Yeah, I debated even posting that boat.
There are exceptions, but in general most anything from Ron Holland or Bruce Farr is going to be a "racer/cruiser" instead of a "cruiser/racer".
Swans have always been, (loosely speaking,) a "performance" boat, the old ones that were S&S designs are considered as good cruisers, but their tankage and general storage are quite limited for what cruisers want in a boat today.
The S&S Swan 43 is a boat I've always wanted, but 40 gal. of fuel in a 43' boat just won't cut-it for most people.

[Lee Jerry]

Originally Posted by wingssail

These are excellent boat withs unsurpassed sailing characteristics. Also roomy.

What did you see in the first listing that makes it a "project" boat?

Nothing in particular; I didn't look that closely. It just appeared at first glance to be a little more weekender and/or racer and would need some "upgrades" to make it offshore cruiser ready.

[MicHughV]

I owned a C&C Landfall 42 for a number of years. It first came out around 1976 and I believe they quite building it, in the early 80's.

I liked it, but it had some issues I ultimately could not live with.
#1 was the fact that it came equipped with rod rigging. Rod rigging might be all the rage on an out an out and out racing boat, but on cruising boat it is a pain in the rear end.
It is a relatively small diameter rod, which is very difficult to get ahold off, especially so when wet, when it was extremely slippery.
#2 is that rod rigging is unable to be jury rigged by an onboard owner. Should something happen to any shroud, you won't be able to fix it or otherwise jury rig it.
# 3. if you had to order a new shroud, it would have to pre-measured to the n th degree and shipping it would be difficult as it can't be rolled into a small diameter loop.
#4. The backstay had an hydraulic tensioner, which was another pain in the rear end. I never used it and just as well, as it was prone to leaking hydraulic fluid.
#5. My particular Landfall 42 had a generator installed right behind the main engine, which happened to be right over the prop shaft stuffing box. It was near impossible to get to that stuffing box, which was another royal pain in the rear end.
#6. The bilge pump was equally inaccessible and another pain in the rear end. It lived at the very bottom of the keel and would constantly have water running back down the discharge hose setting it off again, even though I had fitted a non-return valve. It really wasn't worth a damn, and it's output could measured in tablespoons per hour.
#7. The engine exhaust system was also routed in another almost inaccessible place, causing me a lot of headaches.
#8. The worst thing was that the boat was fitted with two heads. The forward head was fitted with an electro scan marine unit. For reasons I never understood, this unit exploded one evening, yes, exploded like a bomb, and the ensuing mess was beyond my ability to describe here without resorting to a number of cuss words.

Though the boat was well laid out and a reasonably good sailing boat, the above finally got the better off me.

I never thought the open transom concept would catch my eye, ala, the latest crop of French and other boats, but a Beneteau 423 hove into sight one day so I went and gave it a look.
One thing led to another, and I bought it. Hands down, it is a fantastic sailing boat with a very nice interior. Like most modern boats, most everything is led back to the cockpit. It too has it faults and foibles, but the sailing performance makes up for it.

I think most any boat will have its good points...and bad points...and the price factor will also certainly come into play.

I have stepped aboard some of the boats listed above. Were they nice...off course...but the asking price seemed to be out of context to what I saw.

The perfect boat does not exist. Some compromise will have to be made somewhere.
For me personally, the Beneteau 423 checks a lot of boxes. For the money, you certainly get a lot of bang for your buck. It's a boat you can take anywhere.
Within a given budget, a lot of the boats listed above, would exceed your budget.

It's time for you to step aboard some of these vessels. Info received here will only get you so far. It's time to put your walking boats on and see for yourself.

My personal opinion is that, the right boat will talk to you the moment you step aboard.

[Happ]

Originally Posted by sgwright

Hello all,

We've been looking several years for our next boat, with plans to sail from BC to Mexico, and eventually points beyond. Our current C&C 35mk2 is a great sailing boat, but a bit too small for extended cruising. We've sailed about 7000NM over the past 4 summers, including a 2800NM passage from Hawaii to BC, and are ready to head south. Here are some of the top criteria for our next boat, which we'd prefer to find somewhere between BC and Mexico.

1. Fin keel capable of good windward* AND light air ability, ie: no long/full keel or shoal draft or centreboard designs. *Able to point to ~40 AWA in 10kts of TWS and make ~5kts STW in calm seas.
2. Minimum of three seagoing berths, ie: two settees plus aft or quarterberth.
3. Head with shower, separate shower highly desirable.
4. Cutter or solent rigged sloop preferred, although I can add inner stay if necessary.
5. Decent tankage of at least 150L fuel, 300L water.
6. Private double aft cabin preferred.

Here are some of the top boats on our list, bearing in mind that some will only fit our budget in a somewhat "project" condition. Budget is ~50K USD, allowing for an additional 30-40K of upgrades to make her ready. My preference is to find a boat with solid bones in need of some upgrades so I can choose to fit her out to suit our needs. I am capable of doing all necessary work. I know some of these boats are out of reach, but one can dream.

The list (those with * are most likely to have candidates within budget)

*C&C Landfall 38, 39, 42, 43
Cheoy Lee 44
Cheoy Lee 38/41 (Pedrick)
Kelly Peterson 44/46
Mariner/Westsail 39
Moody 376
*Morgan 382/3/4
*Morgan 43/44/45 (45 has dubious seaberths)
Niagara 35/42
Norseman 447
Passport 37/40
Perry/Aloha 41
Hylas 44
*Tayana Vancouver 42 (aft or centre cockpit)
Valiant 40 (prefer to avoid the blister issue though)

Happy to hear from owners of any of the above, or similar designs that meet the criteria, although we have already excluded the following for various reasons:
Catalina, Hunter, Beneteau, Pearson and similar coastal cruisers.
Fast Passage 39, Pacific Seacraft 37, Sceptre 41

Thanks!

A few years back I was looking for a live aboard boat. I was talking with the owner of a very reputable yard. He told me in no uncertain terms go with the smallest boat that meets your needs. I asked him about a 39’ boat i was looking at. He said get under that size. Reason is the price of everything jumps. Sails need to be made with thicker cloth. Auto pilots need to be more robust. You need more paint. The engine is bigger. Wiring is bigger and easily becomes more complicated. The list went on.