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13-05-2010, 11:57
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#16
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2006
Boat: Looking for a new boat
Posts: 2,552
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surveyor
What is considered to be the "low end" of the ratio scale for a boat to be thought of as a heavy displacement cruiser?
Thanks in advance!
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I think 250?
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13-05-2010, 14:36
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#17
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,420
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Tradewind. Endurance.
Both heavy, full-bodied, long keel.
b.
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13-05-2010, 14:41
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#18
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,420
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250 of what?
Heavy displacement is one thing, low SA/displ another, right?
There are plenty of 'under-canvassed' boats that are not / not quite heavy displacement!
b.
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13-05-2010, 15:22
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: No fixed address
Boat: Hallberg-Rassy Rasmus 35 Berzerker
Posts: 137
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Or one of these. This is one of the nicest boats with one of the nicest put together ads I've seen in a long time. Boat is sold, but the HR 35s can be had for 40-60k
I am completely biased.
Sojourner For Sale
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13-05-2010, 15:59
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#20
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,420
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Rasmus is not heavy displacement. The 94 is:
Hallberg-Rassy 94 Kutter
But it happens to be a d-ender, too ;-(
b.
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13-05-2010, 19:15
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#21
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cat herder, extreme blacksheep
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 18,967
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if an older boat is good for you--donot leave out the garden ketches..and hardin..seawolf--very similar to the ct and the formosa--these can be found inexpensively on the formosa end, or high--up to 250k for a vagabond 47. some of these are actually in really good shape and cruise quite well--gorgeous inside.
they have a heart shaped stern--is a blend of flat and double end--move well thru the waters.
downeaster 32, 38
formosa /ct 36/ 41
hardin seawolf 41
transworld..donot remember the sizes..
others...
bayfield 36(gozzard designed)
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14-05-2010, 05:11
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#22
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2006
Boat: Looking for a new boat
Posts: 2,552
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel
250 of what?
Heavy displacement is one thing, low SA/displ another, right?
There are plenty of 'under-canvassed' boats that are not / not quite heavy displacement!
b.
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No not SA/displ, we are talking about D/L ratio, Displacement to Length, and I think I was wrong, the Annapolis Book of Seamanship classifies a heavy displacement sailboat clocking in around 325. But of course, as with all things, it is not that simple.
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14-05-2010, 06:06
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#23
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Ft. Pierce, FL - Bislig, Philippines - Gladstone QLD
Boat: 1968 Alberg 30 #329
Posts: 451
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unbusted67
No not SA/displ, we are talking about D/L ratio, Displacement to Length, and I think I was wrong, the Annapolis Book of Seamanship classifies a heavy displacement sailboat clocking in around 325. But of course, as with all things, it is not that simple.
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True. Hull shape is really more of an indicator of the type of boat I am considering rather than pure displacement. It just happens that these broad, beamy, old world style fiberglass boats are over built for the most part and thus high displacement.
Now, I wish to drop the very smart interior of a Hans Christian into the hull of a WS32, add 8 feet, splice on the cockpit of a Downeaster and magically attach a Beneteau full beam sugar scoop transom!
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14-05-2010, 09:52
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#24
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,420
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surveyor
Now, I wish to drop the very smart interior of a Hans Christian into the hull of a WS32, add 8 feet, splice on the cockpit of a Downeaster and magically attach a Beneteau full beam sugar scoop transom!
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True again!
The hull, looked from abeam, may look same on two boats. When you look from the bow you will see a completely different story. So, we can have long-keel, mid-displ boats vs. fin-keel, heavy ones, much as many people will state this is not so.
The DPL/LWL is definitely a good measure to measure just this.
I found the same as Surveyor above- best cockpit here, best transom there, best interior entirely somewhere else. Doh! ;-)))
Today, on the water, sailing someone else's boat: a wave comes then big bang - we get wet and the boat gets on her ear (Jeanneau). In my own (lon-keel, mid displ, double-ender) I get wet, only ... !!! Off course, I do not have half the interior space against the Jeanneau ... ;-(((
b.
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14-05-2010, 10:13
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#25
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Houston
Boat: ‘01 Catana 401
Posts: 9,626
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go to yachtworld at look at the entire allied lineup, or even older pearsons like the invicta or the countess.
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14-05-2010, 10:30
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#26
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CF Adviser
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
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stand your ground!
Quote:
Originally Posted by unbusted67
No not SA/displ, we are talking about D/L ratio, Displacement to Length, and I think I was wrong, the Annapolis Book of Seamanship classifies a heavy displacement sailboat clocking in around 325. But of course, as with all things, it is not that simple.
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Honestly, I think the Annapolis Book of Seasmanship is a bit outdated. Equally so is US Sailing in its calculator D / L Ratio where they use the same number of 325. But really, by any modern standard 250 is fairly heavy displacement. US Sailing wants to qualify anything under 200 as a light-displacement racing boat, but there again, those are numbers that might have been true 25 years ago, but not now. For example, the D/L of a Catalina 42 is 172, and I'd hardly call that a light-displacement racing boat.
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
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14-05-2010, 10:34
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#27
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CF Adviser
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
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a typical Volvo 70, by the way, has a D/L ratio of around 40. Now THAT's a light displacement racing boat.
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
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14-05-2010, 11:52
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#28
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: West Palm Beach
Boat: Parkins Herreshoff 28
Posts: 932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bash
the D/L of a Catalina 42 is 172, and I'd hardly call that a light-displacement racing boat.
a typical Volvo 70, by the way, has a D/L ratio of around 40.
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are we measuring displacement in lbs or kgs?
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14-05-2010, 12:02
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#29
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: West Palm Beach
Boat: Parkins Herreshoff 28
Posts: 932
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nevermind, found the real formula, i thought it was literally disp/lwl
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15-05-2010, 15:29
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#30
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,420
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Yep. But to get her (heavy displ/lwl) going we need a good spread of sail which can go all the way to the point of impossibility - the boat WILL be slow, if built too heavy.
Then again, I like Marchaj's comment on displacement where he finds that in fact the bare displacement does not by itself limit the boats speed potential as much as some other factors - e.g. the hull's shape. So we may have a heavy "" boat which will achieve a good turn of her top speed potential relatively easily ...
Arghh, boat building ... ;-)))
b.
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