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Old 06-12-2021, 16:39   #1
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WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

Having just read the interesting thread entitled "With In-mast Furling Do You Need A Trysail", I would be keen to hear forum member's views and experiences regarding In-Boom furling and trysails. New Zealand owned vessels departing for overseas destinations are required to obtain a "Category 1" inspection and certificate before being allowed to depart. The Cat 1 requirements were updated as of January 2021 to include a new requirement that all vessels fitted with In-Mast and In-Boom furling systems must carry a trysail (and by implication the means to deploy it). As someone noted on this forum, anyone can raise a sail, but getting it down under adverse conditions is the real challenge (and risk). I can see how In-mast furling may lead to problems given the very thin slot through which the sail is required to pass when reefing or dropping the sail, but do not see a similar problem with In-Boom furling. Thus I do not see the Cat 1 requirement as being justified for In-Boom furling systems. Your comments would be appreciated.
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Old 06-12-2021, 17:27   #2
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

If you can have reef points on your main then you could set the main at a deep reef using cringles and hooks for the tack and maybe just a matching clew cringle point with a gasket for the boom. That is as good as a slab-reefed main IMO. You could pull down the main and reef even without the furler doing that job for you. I sailed offshore with a friend whose in-boom furler line failed. You could still pull the main down manually if needed. A jam preventing any main being raised is another story but seems a corner-case. So maybe just rig your main for a deep reef?
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Old 06-12-2021, 20:16   #3
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

As with the other thread, the difference in durability between a sail made for general use (the r/f main) and a storm trysail built to be set in 50 kts+ comes up. You do not want your reefed sail to be blown to shreds - what do you do when the wind dies down? Do Cat 1 rules not require jiffy or slab-reefing boats to have a storm trysail too?
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Old 06-12-2021, 20:32   #4
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

Looked up the NZ Category 1 rules about storm sails for 2021-24, part of which follow:

STORM SAILS
Skippers should consult their sailmaker and designer to arrive at the best sizes. The sizes given below
are maximum suggested sizes only and should be followed only after due consultation.
65 percent of the luff of the largest headsail (0.65 IG) and of suitable strength for the purpose. A means of attaching the luff to the stay/foil, independent of any luff groove device. Aromatic polyamides, carbon fibres and other high modulus fibres shall not be used in the storm jib.
For new storm jibs made after January 1, 2010: One storm jib not larger than 3.5 percent height of the foretriangle squared, with luff maximum length 50 percent height of the foretriangle.
Note: Sheets must be permanently attached.
(c) One heavy weather jib of 70 percent of the fore triangle area.
(d) All mainsails should be capable of being reefed.
(e) Mainsails shall have a set of reef points capable of reducing the effective luff by 50 percent.
All yachts equipped with an in-boom or in-mast furling systems shall be equipped with a trysail.
Storm sails designed for a luff-groove device shall have an alternative method of attachment to the stay. Trysail slides must be metal and compatible with the mast track.
A suitable sail repair kit.
ACCOMMODATION: galley, toilet, ventilation, bunks, stowage, food, water.
There shall be no area of the accommodation from which a galley or engine fire would prevent exit.
Toilet securely installed.
(a)
One storm trysail not larger than 12% of the mainsail luff length x mainsail foot length. It shall be sheeted independently of the boom and shall have neither a headboard nor battens and be of cloth weight of suitable strength
for the purpose. The yacht’s sail number and letter(s) shall be placed on both sides of the trysail OR rotating wing mast in as large a size as is practicable. Rotating wing masts may be used in lieu of a trysail. Aromatic polyamides, carbon fibres and other high modulus fibres shall not be used in the storm trysail. All slides must be of strong metal construction and compatible with track being used.
OR if it is not practical to fit a trysail then the deep reefed mainsail shall have the luff reduced to 35 percent or less. The mainsail and reefing equipment must be in excellent condition and be specifically designed and constructed to withstand storm conditions.
If a separate trysail track is fitted, a stop is to be fitted to the top of the trysail track.
A spare main halyard is recommended.

It does not appear that they trust the r/f mains to work in storm conditions that would call for a storm trysail. There is the "OR" section if it is not practical to fit a trysail, but it is not clear who decides about the practicality. The stipulations about the luff length, the strength/durability of the sail material and the prohibition of certain popular materials in the storm sails may prevent those with r/f mains from complying. It might simply be cheaper and easier to get a really heavy Dacron storm trysail than to try to cobble something else together that will pass inspection. It also looks like they want to be able to identify the vessel from the storm sail. A reefed main might not show all the information wanted.
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Old 08-12-2021, 08:58   #5
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

I've used a storm trysail a number of times. Always set on a second track popped to the mast a bit off center (the rivets may not be perfect with a in mast furler unless they are covered making a smooth surface inside the mast).
The usefulness of a Storm Trysail is debateable and for example Skip Novak do not use it (he should know).
These days I've opted for a heavy storm staysail, I think that will keep me going sufficiently (haven't tried it yet). We'll see about heaving to where the storm staysail would be sheeted to leeward balanced by the boom which is longish and a bit high. I think it will work
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Old 08-12-2021, 09:14   #6
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

What is the reasoning for requiring boats that are leaving NZ to have storm sails?
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Old 08-12-2021, 18:01   #7
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jolly Roger View Post
What is the reasoning for requiring boats that are leaving NZ to have storm sails?

A big part of it is that NZ is responsible for a large part of the world’s oceans.
If a boat gets in trouble then NZ will deploy significant resources to come to their aid.
Requiring CAT 1 is one way of reducing this risk.
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Old 09-12-2021, 04:47   #8
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

I assumed it would be something along those lines, and I understand they would want to try to mitigate their exposure. On the other hand: freedoms are being eroded by bureaucracy and red-tape in every walk of life, on grounds of “safety,” or anything else that can be thought of.
I always considered that sailing, particularly ocean voyaging, was the last bastion of true freedom, but even that is being slowly curtailed by rules and regulations, all under the guise of one reason or another.
I would think twice about visiting a country which imposed conditions for my leaving! What might come next is anybody’s guess, satellite phones, watertight doors, certification of unsinkability…
Watch out fella’s, this will come to your country, once the rule-makers get wind of it.
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Old 10-12-2021, 16:11   #9
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Re: WITH IN-BOOM FURLING DO YOU NEED A TRYSAIL?

Thank you all for your useful responses - I appreciate that you took an interest.

Personally I have decided (as suggested by Weem) to have my sailmaker add some strap loops (with reinforcing) which will allow me to secure the main sail in a deep reefed position regardless of whether the in-boom furler is working or not. I have discussed this with my Cat 1 Inspector and he seems happy to accept that as a solution instead of a trysail. The loop at the luff will add a little thickness to the rolled up main which the furler will need to accommodate.

By adopting this solution I am assuming that my mainsail will withstand the wind strength it might be subjected to. Mitigating that is the fact that I would avoid storm conditions at all cost (with regular weather forecast updates), and also adopt a conservative storm sailing plan under which I would deploy the parachute anchor rather than attempting to continue to sail under strongly adverse conditions. I am after all cruising for enjoyment, and not in a race.

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