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Old 28-07-2019, 22:24   #1
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What tickets do I need?

Hello again,
We are still making our grand plans to set sail next year and we are in the process of getting up to speed with First aid/Medic courses etc.

What I would love to know is what exactly do Insurance or Harbour masters?..(or other )require in the way of certification or qualification? We are looking ideally to leave on our journey from the Med . To leave New Zealand here its quite a huge and expensive exercise in order to gain enough sea miles/hours to qualify .

Is there a standard? RYA ? Course(s)

Thanks for any advice.
Tim
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Old 28-07-2019, 22:31   #2
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Re: What tickets do I need?

You will need an ICC license from RYA to sail in many European countries including Montenegro and Croatia which won’t even let you into the country with your boat unless you have one.
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Old 28-07-2019, 22:34   #3
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Re: What tickets do I need?

If you have your medic and sea survival courses that’s a start. I’d suggest RYA Coastal Skipper as an absolute minimum and preferably Yachtmaster (but not necessarily Ocean). More than that it’s about miles of experience. ICC is very much recommended for Europe — see the following list for countries that require/respect it:
https://www.rya.org.uk/knowledge-adv...f-the-icc.aspx

But most countries, NZ included, are looking for experience which doesn’t need to come from a specific qualification, nor from money necessarily (although money can help you get the required experience a bit quicker). I’d strongly recommend you crew on an offshore passage to start finding out what things are like and building experience.

People moan about the requirements for NZ-registered craft leaving the country, but forget that NZ is unique amongst sailing nations in that it is impossible to make a trip to another country that doesn’t require at least a 7-10 day sail (i.e. beyond a reliable weather forecast) in waters that often have quite challenging conditions. For any other country that I can think of you can choose a fairly easy sail to a foreign country before you set off on more significant passages.
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Old 28-07-2019, 23:05   #4
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Re: What tickets do I need?

Thank you.. thats just the info I needed to know., Much appreciated. Now I just need to find someone who'll teach the course (close to me) .

I have done a crossing NZ-Tonga and several coastals so am becoming more familiar with things.
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Old 28-07-2019, 23:23   #5
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Re: What tickets do I need?

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Originally Posted by Freedom Family View Post
Thank you.. thats just the info I needed to know., Much appreciated. Now I just need to find someone who'll teach the course (close to me) .

I have done a crossing NZ-Tonga and several coastals so am becoming more familiar with things.
It depends where you wish to go. I have RYA yachtmaster with commercial endorsements, but I have NEVER been asked for them in the pacific, SE Asia, Ausy etc etc. RYA is currently not recognized for commercial work in NZ, but it is taught here by coastguard. Or you can do it online (Like at Navathome) if that suits. The practical can only be done in Nelson or Auckland right now, that's where the examiners are.

If you need to come to Auckland for it, go on Articles - The home of New Zealand sailing - Crew.org.nz and ask for a boat to do it in - there are several of us there that will help. Oh - send an email to editor@crew.org.nz if you wish to join that forum.
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Old 29-07-2019, 04:20   #6
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Re: What tickets do I need?

Outside of first world venues you typically need nothing.
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Old 29-07-2019, 04:54   #7
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Re: What tickets do I need?

According to web site, it is only for chartered vessels? How come US does not require the same?

It is now mandatory to hold a recognized International Certificate of Competency (ICC) if you wish to charter a boat in certain European and Scandinavian countries. IYT is uniquely authorized to issue ICCs on behalf of the Irish Government and the British Maritime and Coastguard Agency (MCA).
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Old 29-07-2019, 13:57   #8
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Re: What tickets do I need?

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Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
You will need an ICC license from RYA to sail in many European countries including Montenegro and Croatia which won’t even let you into the country with your boat unless you have one.
?? Croatia will actually let you take a boat out as long as you have at least RYA Day Skipper Theory... Which you can learn and pass on your PC without ever seeing a yacht!

The important thing to learn about sailing is to be able to recognize how little you actually know!

If you think you know it all then you are heading toward a disaster, but please do it some where where I am not.

RYA Day Skipper practical (for which Day Skipper theory is a pre-requisite) actually includes 5 days on a yacht and should, in the terms of their syllabus, give you enough knowledge to take a yacht out in daylight in waters that you know.

OK so pass it, then send them £42, and hey presto you now have an ICC. An International Certificate of (PROBABLE) Incompetence, and can now hire a bare-boat in many countries (in waters that you do not know, and having never done a stern-to mooring in your life,(and certainly not with a Bf4 cross wind)).

I have an RYA Yachtmaster Coastal, and still find it challenging to get a 36ft+ yacht into (or out of) a stern-to mooring in a Croatian marina, especially if I haven't done it for a few years, and I am on a bare-boat that I haven't handled before. (Give me a week and it all comes back together and it looks actually looks like I know what I am doing, but by then it is time to go home again!)

OK so I admit that I don't actually have enough experience. I only have some 15,000 miles, 15 months at sea (but over 15 years) but I do realise that I am still learning every time that I cast off.

What I am actually trying to say is that Qualifications are a measurement, experience is what counts.

Yes some jurisdictions will require a certificate to show competence, but you need to know that that you are ACTUALLY competent, or even better too acknowledge that yes you do have the certificate but actually to admit to yourself that you aren't that competent when you get there.
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Old 29-07-2019, 19:59   #9
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Re: What tickets do I need?

I take exception to Belizesailor's response, only because I'm sure he was only referring to the overly bureaucratic European way to pronounce you as qualified. You need a hell of lot more than classroom time and a few days with an instructor.

Which is about what those 400hr pilots on Air France had when they flew a mostly good airplane full of people into the Atlantic.

There is no substitute for hours, days and years of sea time. Don't even think about the voyages you described without this kind of preparation. Or if you do, please go solo so hopefully you won't kill anyone else.
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Old 30-07-2019, 00:21   #10
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Re: What tickets do I need?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom Family View Post
Thank you.. thats just the info I needed to know., Much appreciated. Now I just need to find someone who'll teach the course (close to me) .

I have done a crossing NZ-Tonga and several coastals so am becoming more familiar with things.
Ah, well if you’ve done those kinds of travels then there’s nothing to scare you in the med, except the last mile which will be full of all sorts (many bareboat chartered) and the things you’ll need to learn are more about saving face and avoiding damage than protecting the lives of your crew. Get your ICC and get going, I say, while trying to get as much close-handling experience in the meantime as you can. No-one is stopping you from med-mooring in New Zealand, as long as you don’t get in anyone’s way.
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Old 30-07-2019, 13:41   #11
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Re: What tickets do I need?

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Outside of first world venues you typically need nothing.
And in our great free USA, you need no silly licence to get a little boat and go sailing. And you are welcome to enter and stay here without any "certificate". The thought is abhorrent to me. ..The thought of needing a sailing license would have kept me on land, when I was starting sailing and later as a boat buyer.

I suppose my insurance company gripes about my lack of papers, but my record is clean.
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Old 31-07-2019, 05:10   #12
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Re: What tickets do I need?

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And in our great free USA, you need no silly licence to get a little boat and go sailing. And you are welcome to enter and stay here without any "certificate". The thought is abhorrent to me. ..The thought of needing a sailing license would have kept me on land, when I was starting sailing and later as a boat buyer.



I suppose my insurance company gripes about my lack of papers, but my record is clean.
While philosophically I too bristle at government regulation, there are States in the USA which require training/liscencing.

Having spent a lot of time on crowded waterways in the USA, and seen nasty accidente there, the issue in high density areas is all the untrained idiots on the water. For that reason, esp in high density areas, I am in favor of mandatory training/liscening (much like getting a driver's liscence).
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Old 31-07-2019, 05:37   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waterman46 View Post
And in our great free USA, you need no silly licence to get a little boat and go sailing. And you are welcome to enter and stay here without any "certificate". The thought is abhorrent to me. ..The thought of needing a sailing license would have kept me on land, when I was starting sailing and later as a boat buyer.

I suppose my insurance company gripes about my lack of papers, but my record is clean.
One does not need anything to sail in the UK, just buy a boat and go for it.
Qualifications only enter the equation if you want to sail to say France or beyond.. which is fair enough.
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Old 01-08-2019, 09:03   #14
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