The go/no go list

[captmikem]

"Spinnaker running rigging (I have a kite, but I need to run a halyard for it).
NO - You or you wife will be saililing the boat while the other tends to the child. I'm all for having a light air downwind sail, but there is no way you'll be able to manage a kite essentially singlehanded in anything but the most sedate conditions. "

4arch, I do not mean to be harsh here, but you simply do not know what you are talking about. It is fine to give your opinions, but unless you have experience with the items you are talking about you are just blowing smoke.

I sailed a 90 ft cutter around the world with my wife, and I would say we used our chute about 30% of the time. You must not have any experience with a chute, as most people who say such things. People are afraid of them because they do not have experience with them . True Spinnakers are well worth their space. I do not care for asymmetrical “cursing" chutes, as they are useless down wind, you need them out on a pole to work. And a spinnaker pole is invaluable when running downwind with a jib boomed out.

I have carried a chute most of the way across the Atlantic twice. And yes, I have damaged one or two when I foolishly kept them up too long, but if you use one sensibly they are wonderful. I like a sock, and with just the two of us on a passage, we have a standing rule we pull the sock at 20 kts. Blow the guy and pull the sock, an easy one person job. (we use a martin breaker to blow the guy). Also I over-trim the sheet, which keeps you from having to tend it. You will find most of the wind you see is under 20 kts, and when it is on the stern, rather then roll roll roll, and run the engine, your chute becomes a favorite sail.

And about the Pactor. If you bought a brandy new ICOM with tuner and a pactor, you might spend 5K. but there are plenty used ones around that you can get good deals on. You can pick up an icom 700m, tuner, and pactor for under $1500 total, and have email, nearly continuous synoptic charts, and talk to your friends on the net. Trust me there is nothing better than Grib charts. If you ever try getting your wx from WWV, NMG, NMO, NMN, or KMI, you will find out getting weather by listing to an hf radio is tenuous to say the least.

Michael.

[4arch]

I don't know how you presume to know my experience and I never said that a having and using a spinnaker was a wrong choice, just that it wasn't a sensible choice for myself (or, IMO, the OP) given the realities of having a very small child on board. With the crew dynamics a baby aboard imposes, deploying and flying a chute falls really low on the priority list. There are times when the baby will need one parent's undivided attention, leaving the other parent to essentially singlehand. Although a spinnaker can be managed singlehanded, it's hardly the ideal or most conservative sailing choice, especially if you find yourself in the position of needing to jibe or douse. I agree with you that too many cruising couples are reluctant to use traditional spinnakers, but a baby boat isn't realistically the place to turn this trend around. Once the child is older and more self-sufficient, then sure.

Also whenever the expense of an SSB/Pactor combo is mentioned on this forum a poster inevitably replies with the assertion of used gear being available super cheap. If there really are used, working, complete, ready-to-go SSB/Pactor combos currently available for sale for $1,500 USD, please post some links! And remember there are install costs associated with used gear that can run several hundred dollars, or more. The $100 receive-only radio I mentioned, when coupled with a computer or tablet, is also capable of receiving GRIBs and WeFax.

[captmikem]

I have to confess I have ZERO experience with babies. Took my dog around the world on another boat, a real pleasure having him aboard, bit of a problem in OZ and NZ but other than that a real pleasure. (he was of no use handling a chute though).

As to the sideband, I purchased an m700 for 300 bucks on ebay, a NEW turner on ebay for 125 and a pactor modem on craigslist for 250 (only a Pactor II though, 170 to upgrade to III). Pretty easy to wire up, my boat had an insulated backstay already.

While in La Paz, getting ready to sail to Tahiti, I bought an M700 with a tuner for $150 off a fishing trawler (plus a large antenna which I could not use).

When crossing an ocean, it is pretty nice to be able to talk to other boats doing the same, and make an occasional phone call using the very helpful people on the mm net. These folks are so helpful they will do practically anything for you.

From this forum:

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...io-101089.html
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...dem-86442.html

from ebay:
Icom IC M700 Base or Marine Radio | eBay

Icom Single Side Band IC M700 | eBay

Icom at 120 Antenna Tuner | eBay

[hellosailor]

Having recently had a discussion with a 100%-feedback large seller of used radio transceivers and electronics on eBay...he's had a problem with clever folks who buy a used "whatever", then cannibalize parts and boards from it, claim it doesn't work, and send it back for a refund. They're using the good parts to repair equipment of their own, and sticking him with the bad ones!


This is not the only scam, or innocent problem ("I don't know, I never tried to use that") in used electronics, especially if you don't have the knowledge and experience and time to immediately lab test and install them.


The mythical "prudent mariner" might suggest that if you're going to buy a used decade-old SSB or Pactor, you figure to add $300 or so right away, to ship it in to the factory (not some local joe) for an alignment and overhaul and complete testing.


You can figure, fifty bucks each way for shipping, two hours at least at $100 per for labor, and if anything is wrong...just send money. You might get a 60 day warranty, which is only about 10 months less than the new stuff comes with, or 22 months less than the new stuff would come with if you used the right credit card. Of course you can buy the warranty from Square or someone else, that's only what, another $300?


Used, not always so cheap. Some luck, or assembly, required if you want to RELY on it.

[JPA Cate]

gathem,

IMO, you have not yet the experience to choose from among the advice received. Do start spending weekends out around the Bay, that's a good Start. Try anchoring up the Petaluma River. Try the Napa R. China Camp. Paradise Cay. See what you learn.

Spending weekends out with the wife and child will begin to show you how much fun your wife is able to have with the little one along. If you want to keep the wife and child, they, too, must have a good time, and your desires for cruising will be better implemented by your really noticing about their well-being. Beyond that, you will begin to see what you need, want, and can easily do without.

Confidence up? Try a trip to Drakes Bay, or Half Moon Bay. See how it goes in the ocean. If all goes well, try a trip to the Channel Is. I feel concerned that you underestimate the difficulties of traveling with a child who is not yet toilet trained, and who requires a lot of watching. There are some other issues traveling with a small child, and perhaps your good lady is on top of those. Don't let people scare you too badly: lots of cruising kids went home to the boat the day they were born, and one I know of is a regular poster here: "atoll".

Other than that...

*If possible, fit a windvane; ours steered us satisfactorily about 100,000 mi., silent above and below decks, no power drain

*Yes to the spinnaker; with a sock, for light air use, really, sometimes it is the only sail that will move the boat, and a great pleasure.

*Yes to the inverter; almost all our power tools run off it, all the battery chargers, shavers, computers, sewing machine, etc.

*EPIRB yes, you got the kid to consider, right? you're not infallible, but human, and s**t happens sometimes

*How's your anchoring gear now? You really want to have one really good anchor, and a kedge. If the Danforth you lost was a double fluke one, you'll need something for a kedge, and for a stern anchor when necessary. I have seen Bruces used this way, too.

*We've used the ham radio and Pactor modem for all our e-mail communications until recently, it can be done, but no pictures!

*Most boats with small children and pets use lifeline netting. You will definitely need sun awnings.

*watermaker, maybe, it depends almost entirely on how stingy you can comfortably be with water, and that is an extremely variable issue. We used to jerry jug all our water, and personally treated all the water we put in the tanks. Had no problem with water, even in Mexico, but we were extremely careful.

*stable, capable dinghy. If you cannot get up on a plane to go long distances, water trips, marketing trips, laundry, banking, can take forever; and of course, no offshore snorkeling, etc., have to take the big boat. However, with a hard dinghy, you can row it most of the time, maybe not to put out a second anchor in a storm, though. [you might be interested in brownoarsman's thread about re-anchoring in a storm, a google search in this forum should find it for you]

What makes a cruising lifestyle work? compassionate regard for those who are with you, flexibility in dealing with issues, determination to fix things yourselves, having lots of fun at it.

Ann

on edit:

I think it is a very poor idea to rely on one I Pad for all your navigation. Drop it. Take it outside and a wave gets it. You need backup, and IMO, paper charts for voyage planning, at least. (Exercise your imagination here, in retrospect, on the chart for Angel Island, what did you think those labels "ruins" meant for the bottom you might encounter? Everywhere you will go, someone has been there previously, and many of them have discarded stuff that winds up on the bottom: snarls of cables, old moorings, communications cables, and we once picked up part of a 1920's stove!)

[JPA Cate]

Sorry, forgot to answer about rigging her as a cutter.

Yes, do that. The boat was originally drawn to be used that way. You can make up dyneema running backs for it, but the attachments are probably there unless someone removed them.

Sometimes people use removable inner forestays, in order to improve tacking ability under genoa. We've gone away from that, but YMMV. Using the staysail in strong weather moves the center of effort aft, and makes for greater comfort (with the smaller sail, and often reefs in the mainsail.)

Ann