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Old 24-11-2019, 00:13   #31
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

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Originally Posted by Pizzazz View Post
I would approach the dream the following way.

First, how long do you intend to cruise for? Six months? One year? Or many years.
I will think out aloud here. I assume that after five years it will start out as about a month at the time, with many months in between. Heading in the general direction of away from Finland and towards smaller latitudes. After a few years of that, there might be the possibility to extend the sailing months to maybe half a year or a year. A combination of staying professionally active bur spending increasingly more time on the ”second home”.


Quote:
Next, you have two options, buy new and take the depreciation hit or buy second hand and take the increased maintenance expense.
In the ”buy new” camp here, for a lot of different reasons. We’ve had good experiences.

Quote:
Next, do understand that most modern boats (last 10 years) are very similar. They have modern hull shapes, sail easy and well, have good light inside and look fresh. The most innovative boats come from Beneteau as they are the volume leader and dominate the market.
In a way, they are, but when going by intuition, they feel really different. (That’s why we ended up with a Hanse, the other ones clearly behind in the ”what feels best” category.)

Quote:
Halberg Rassy is the volume leader for capable cruising boats but they are slow to innovate and generally a bit slower than the average. However, their build quality is close to unrivaled.
They are.

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In terms of amenities, you need to focus on draft, light and size of the head. Everything else is easy these days. Tankage is irrelevant as you can have multiple watermakers. A washing machine, diesel heater, generator are all easy to retrofit and come in different sizes. Solar is a personal preference but most larger boats do very well with a generator and you can have electric cooking, smart TVs, anything that you have at home. Internet at sea is pretty much a solved problem these days with Iridium Certus. So you can have it all for relatively little money.

If you will be reselling the boat in a couple of years time I would suggest you stay with a high volume vendor (Beneteau, Hanse, HR) as these are easier to buy and sell.
Yes. I’m a fan of mass production processes as a means to achieve better quality and better after-sales service potential. That’s one of the reasons I prefer new and everything ”factory installed” from the start.

Quote:
You can go as low as 30 ft (my H31 has most of the things you listed or as high as 60 ft). The choice will be made by your wife most likely.
My wife is the interior designer and ”feng shui guru”. I, on the other hand. also want something that can move graciously by sail, also upwind, also with not much wind. I don’t like motoring.

Quote:
My dream boat used to be a HR around 42 ft but I started moving away from HR when I saw the innovative designs of Beneteau (e.g. Sense, large windows, a nice swim platform). I do not find boat shows that useful. Go around the marina and pay a visit to the other boats. Or go to the ARC and tour the boats. Will be very revealing.
Heading to the ARC (without participating): great idea!

I do like boat shows for the ”look & feel” part. Up to this date, I’ve never had a sail trial with any boat I’ve bought, but this will have to change

Thank you for your great advice!
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Old 29-11-2019, 11:14   #32
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

Get a new co-captain, this one sounds like a problem.
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Old 29-11-2019, 23:28   #33
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

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Originally Posted by daveball View Post
Get a new co-captain, this one sounds like a problem.
No!

Co-captain is <3

Whether we have a boat or not, sail or not, is very secondary.
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Old 30-11-2019, 01:37   #34
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

Allures 47.9 Aluminium Catamaran: An Outremer 45 design with more sturdy hulls
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Old 30-11-2019, 01:54   #35
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

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Allures 47.9 Aluminium Catamaran: An Outremer 45 design with more sturdy hulls
Oh, nice!

And I had no idea Allures, Outremer, Gunboat (and Garcia Exploration!) belonged to the same family!
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Old 30-11-2019, 09:08   #36
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

Sailboats are a compromise between "getting there and being there"

A bluewater sailboat is designed to work well in the open ocean, this is seen in the way they are built, systems they use and the layout. these boats compromise "being there" good eg. of such boats are the-

Rusler 42
https://www.rustleryachts.com/rustler42/

Outbound46
https://outboundyachts.com/outbound-46/introduction-46/

A good reference site is https://www.morganscloud.com/about/
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Old 30-11-2019, 09:38   #37
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

Reading List

Yacht Design According to Perry, Bob Perry

Desirable and Undesirable Characteristics of Offshore Yachts, Technical Committee of the CCA, edited by John Rousmaniere

The Nature of Boats: Insights and Esoterica for the Nautically Obsessed, Dave Gerr

Principles of Yacht Design
by Lars Larsson (Author), Rolf Eliasson (Author)

MY YACHT DESIGNS and the lessons they taught me
by Chuck Paine (Author)

Catamarans: The Complete Guide for Cruising Sailors, Gregor Tarjan
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Old 30-11-2019, 11:31   #38
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

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Originally Posted by daysgoneby View Post
Reading List

Yacht Design According to Perry, Bob Perry

Desirable and Undesirable Characteristics of Offshore Yachts, Technical Committee of the CCA, edited by John Rousmaniere

The Nature of Boats: Insights and Esoterica for the Nautically Obsessed, Dave Gerr

Principles of Yacht Design
by Lars Larsson (Author), Rolf Eliasson (Author)

MY YACHT DESIGNS and the lessons they taught me
by Chuck Paine (Author)

Catamarans: The Complete Guide for Cruising Sailors, Gregor Tarjan
Thank you for these!

One thing that I've thought about: I don't think you should have to be a yacht design engineer to be able to buy a great boat. I would, personally, leave all things relating to 'epoxy' and 'vinylester resins' (just to mention a few words out of many) to someone who has the latest insights into building modern and great boats.

There's the chance that we end up (or have ended up) buying something that doesn't fit our needs, obviously, but I'm counting on good and insightful customer service here.
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Old 30-11-2019, 11:54   #39
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

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Originally Posted by mglonnro View Post
Thank you for these!

One thing that I've thought about: I don't think you should have to be a yacht design engineer to be able to buy a great boat. I would, personally, leave all things relating to 'epoxy' and 'vinylester resins' (just to mention a few words out of many) to someone who has the latest insights into building modern and great boats.

There's the chance that we end up (or have ended up) buying something that doesn't fit our needs, obviously, but I'm counting on good and insightful customer service here.
It's about being knowledgeable enough to know what the look for.

eg. you buy a great looking boat from abc, you find out after purchase that it pounds like crazy and your wife refuses to go out on it.

https://www.morganscloud.com/ is a great place to start.
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Old 30-11-2019, 12:18   #40
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Re: Suggestions for Next Dream Boat?

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Originally Posted by daysgoneby View Post
It's about being knowledgeable enough to know what the look for.

eg. you buy a great looking boat from abc, you find out after purchase that it pounds like crazy and your wife refuses to go out on it.

https://www.morganscloud.com/ is a great place to start.
Yes, that sounds smart.
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