Sell it or sail it and import?

[Boat_Girl]

Hey there...import duty has everything to do with where the boat was built. And she's a Taiwan-built boat that has been around for a while so I'm guessing she was imported when she was first built but the records of that are probably long gone.

If import duty has been paid, you can easily sell the boat in the US as Canadians if that is a viable option for you. Look through all the ship's papers and see whether there is any record of duty being paid. Do you know where the boat went right after she was built?

Any broker, anywhere can list her for you. But be sure that you work with one who understand the import duty question. It can get sticky...

[Cheechako]

My friends shipped their 43 ft boat from Oz to the Pac NW. I actually think their boat was shipped to Vancouver Canada. Have you considered that? All your belongings could be shipped in the boat.

[TrentePieds]

I'm with the "sell and fly back" crowd. West coast of Canada realistically means Vancouver. Everywhere else is just a suburb :-)

Vancouver is GLUTTED with "stuff" - including good cruising boats at LOW prices. You'll get a 33 footer here, perfectly adequate for the benign Salish Sea, for about 20 grand, ready to go. By the sound of things - girls, father - you aren't gonna be going blue water any time soon after you reach Canada, so the condition of your present boat becomes an irrelevancy.

As for "stuff", I pursue a policy of never paying more than 10% of retail "sticker price" for anything I want. Or need. I tell you - the market is GLUTTED!

Real estate, and therefore rents, is hellishly expensive anywhere within commuting reach of Vancouver proper. A 33 footer will cost you 6 grand a year in moorage anywhere near Vancouver - provided you can even find any that permits live-aboard. Very doubtful!

Depending on your trade/profession you may, or may not, find work in or near Vancouver. But you family is "in the Rockies" (e.g. Nelson, Castlegar) and having to settle there for family reasons makes finding work even more problematic. Mining, forestry ain't wot it usta be.

And I am puzzled - are you not Canadian citizens? Why would the girls' "paperwork" take so long? Are the girls not still minors? I think you mentioned dual citizenship. Are you not eligible for a Canadian passport?

You say you are in your mid-forties. Ergo, you have twenty years left to secure your old age. Get on with it! Fly back and start from scratch! In the Salish Sea you can pick up a boat for peanuts any time. Or if you locate up-country, sail on the lakes, or rent a boat outta Vancouver from one of the many "charter companies"

TrentePieds

[mickelsen]

I fully agree with the post by"SV Destiny Ascen". The Northwest is a buyers market so will face steep competition in the sale of your boat back our way. Also the route provided by SV Destiny is the only call. Getting to Hawaii from your location is going to be a real bash and thrash take time and the upgrades will not be as fresh as you attempt to sell her in the NW. I have made the passage from SE Asia back to Seattle with playing the weather windows all the way. You could make your way to a point where you could make Palmira on a shy reach then the same to Hawaii then on a NNW heading to break out of the trades, the doldrums and NW breezes to the west coast.
Bottom line to me is sell her without upgrades and go home.
I feel in some ways I am preaching to the choir. All the best, Peter

[n13L5]

I do know one thing: You've asked the wrong people about container shipping.

I've shipped a container full of furniture and other belongings from California to Europe and the grand total was about USD 1400. And this was at a time when shipping wasn't in a slump, like it is now.

So keep going up the chain, closer toward the outfits that actually own the ships. And only ship from a large, industrial harbour.

For a lot less than AUD 10,000, you should OWN the used container afterwards


One possible way of looking for shippers, rather than agents of agents of agents would be searching for used containers on the internet...


But seriously, rather than spending that money on tickets and shipping, I'd stick with what you like and what's a real experience for your children: Just provision the boat and sail to Canada and see how it goes. For one thing, you arrive with a boat you can live on, when its needed - until you choose to sell it or whatever ends up happening after you arrive.


And remember a high chance of regrets and resentments, if things aren't going your way up there: Leaving a place where everybody had a good time, you and your wife and kids might find it all sorts of annoying after your return, after the boat is sold and after you're stuck in an 8-6 Job in the Fracking industry...

Might be cheaper to fly your Mom and Dad to Australia - that *could* just fix up his health.

[El Pinguino]

That boat would be an 'orphan' in North America and would not sell well when the time came to convert her into $$.
Sell her in Oz,
Get rid of all your other 'stuff',
Fly,
Buy new boat over there.

[gjordan]

Even if you sail back you are talking about a huge amount of luggage that you will probably have to ship anyway. If you put all of that volume into your boat, you will be tripping over things every time you want to move in the boat. Maybe I have missed it, but how much actual sailing experience do you have? A 1000 mile bash to windward can make the Queen Mary seem small, and no matter which route you take, it will be tough. You have many thousands of windward miles ahead of you. ___On a little cheerier note, I met a fellow that about 10 years ago had his Alberg 35 shipped on the deck of a Russian freighter from Oz to San Francisco for $10K. Of course he didnt have any import duty to worry about, but between the wear and tear on the boat and the lost wages for the time to sail it back, he figured that he saved a chunk of money. I suspect that there are freighters that go to Canada on a regular basis. I wish you well, but if the goal is for the Folks to see you and their grandkids, then sell and fly. Like most things on CF , this is just an opinion. _____Grant.

[millhouse_44]

Sorry to hear about your father. We just went through this. We were in the Solomons and our family members on both sides became very ill. We ended up turning south and going straight to Brisbane. Sold the boat and flew back to Canada. My wife's Mom passed away 5 days after we got back.

The boat will be charged duty in Canada unless you keep it registered in Australia. If one of you is an Australian citizen you can do this but then you'll need to sort visas out etc. If you sell it in Canada you'll pay duty either way.

When we left the boat we got everything down to 6 suitcases. Almost everything is replaceable except the most dear items.

My vote would be to sell in Oz and fly back to Canada.

Good luck!

[wolfgal]

You may be exhausted with the replies from each of our different and limited perspectives, but I'd suggest spending a week or so with your dad, just you, and then fly home and THEN take that long family trip.

My feeling is this: by spending time with him beforehand and explaining the trip (maps and all), he will be uplifted by it, will follow you closely during your travels and will feel the joy you and your girls feel the whole way.

Parents are nourished when their own kids are fulfilling their dreams. Including him in your project is caring for him.

I hope that you figure it all out and wish you good things.




Ps: I'd like to send you a pm but cannot because your mailbox is full...

[mischief]

Originally Posted by wolfgal

You may be exhausted with the replies from each of our different and limited perspectives, but I'd suggest spending a week or so with your dad, just you, and then fly home and THEN take that long family trip.



My feeling is this: by spending time with him beforehand and explaining the trip (maps and all), he will be uplifted by it, will follow you closely during your travels and will feel the joy you and your girls feel the whole way.



Parents are nourished when their own kids are fulfilling their dreams. Including him in your project is caring for him.



I hope that you figure it all out and wish you good things.









Ps: I'd like to send you a pm but cannot because your mailbox is full...

Sorry clearing my inbox now. [emoji6]

[buzzstar]

We all have opinions. Mine, in addition to selling the boat in Aus, would be to shop, shop, shop for airline tickets and prices. Also departure points. As an example, having only possible relevance to your situation, I have a son who flies with his family (two kids <7) from either Jakarta or Kuala Lumpur to Los Angeles every year or two. He typically has a change of planes in China or Taiwan, and always says the flights are exhausting and worse, but, but doable because of the savings. My point is that he is able to save a big hunk of change by carefully chasing prices and departure/change of plane cities (direct flights are more costly, he says). I can only assume you can also ship your "stuff" using similar shopping techniques. With luck you might be able to coordinate with buyer as far as a departure date or find some alternative living arrangements if needed. Last point: I am told that airfares from Aus are not good, but again this is not personal knowledge. Good luck and best wishes for whatever you decide.

[mischief]

Thanks for all the replies so far.
Just a few notes.
The boat is Australia built not Taiwanese. (Not sure how much difference that would make.)

Shipping charges. Yes I must be doing something wrong. I have contacted 3 companies so far (one was pack and save that quoted minimum 1m3 at $1675 plus clearance and shipping the rest of the way. That was dropped off to Sydney port to Vancouver.

I have heard about shipping cheap but I can't seem to find it. There's been some good suggestions and I'll try and follow those up.

I did first look at buying a container and that added about 3k To just shipping that was
every company I contacted. So definitely contacting the wrong places.

As for stuff. To strip down to the sort of 20 bags (that's an estimate. It may be less) that's all stuff that we want back in Canada and after selling and rebuying (as cheap as we can would cost more then shipping via suitcases.)
Say for example we have our family Mac mini computer. Super small light. To us it makes sense
to bring. Most items are things like that or gear that don't make financial sense to sell and rebuy.

Each item We first decide do we need it. Then if we do (like I play music so the guitar is worth shipping my Small Pa speaker would cost 1 suitcase value I can sell and rebuy my loss is cheaper then the shipping. So that will be sold.
Camping gear we will keep our Ultra light hiking stuff. It will take two bags for the entire family but we can use till we leave and use when we arrive. It would be cheaper to ship then the loss and it took a lot of time putting out kits together.
Clothes and toys will be minimal.
But making sure the kids are bringing important stuff with them that they will loose interest in is worthwhile to me. They need to not focus on what's left behind. I want them to be excited about the move. They will also learn that those things were not that important. Of corse my daughters guitar and the others ukulele and my wife's bass will all come with us.


I have always been unlucky with making a good income. I have worked 3 jobs at a time and had employers undervalue me again and again. I am very skilled and hard working and hold a plethora of certificates but no degrees.

After having our girls starting at age 35 I pulled back to two jobs. Now I have one and work only during school hours so I am with my girls as much as possible everyday. We are still low income but are happy. Over the years we have just learned how to manage our small income.

The reason I am saying that is I know back in Canada I won't be cruising into a good job where we can just buy things like a
Computer or climbing gear easily. (I was an avid climber before giving my mountains up for the ocean) now with kids if I sell my climbing rack I could get maybe $500 for it and would cost about $2500 to replace. I had already sold all my doubles and most all of my ice climbing gear. Reality if I sell stuff like that I won't replace it. I couldn't justify the additional expense. But for the price of two bags I can keep all my climbing gear including the kids harnesses etc.

We have started over a couple times in our life. Trying to find hunt and buy back stuff back is time consuming.
I also only buy stuff at heavily reduced rates. Already selling used stuff in Australia is not as easy as it was for us in Canada when we sold so much before we left.

At the end of it we only need each other it is just stuff.

However the stuff we are thinking of bringing are things that help us enjoy life together as a family. Our camping gear, climbing gear music gear and my wife's small vintage clothing collection she has for dancing etc. the other stuff we would bring are things like computer, photo albums small collection of important books. Or things that one uses everyday and is cheaper to ship then the loss incurred by selling.

Hope that makes sense

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by wolfgal

You may be exhausted with the replies from each of our different and limited perspectives, but I'd suggest spending a week or so with your dad, just you, and then fly home and THEN take that long family trip.

My feeling is this: by spending time with him beforehand and explaining the trip (maps and all), he will be uplifted by it, will follow you closely during your travels and will feel the joy you and your girls feel the whole way.

Parents are nourished when their own kids are fulfilling their dreams. Including him in your project is caring for him.

I hope that you figure it all out and wish you good things.

Ps: I'd like to send you a pm but cannot because your mailbox is full...

Mischief,

The above post that I quote here now as you are dealing with your inbox struck a chord for me. I'm probably older than your dad (check my profile, but I am 76.)

One time we met a woman whose father was in ill health, and lived in NY, and her own family were on their boat in Mexico. And we talked about the situation. Eventually, she decided that she would feel really bad if she hadn't gone back to say goodbye to him, if he died while they were on the way to the Marquesas. So, I think wolfgal has a real point.

If you resolve the issues you have with your dad, you may not need to uproot the family from Oz. However, in either event, quality time with him will help you with the rest of the decisions you'll have to make.

Incidentally, what's your wife's take on the situation?

Ann

[El Pinguino]

Don't know if this has already been mentioned or not but you get 2 x 23kg each on all Transpac flights... for 4 people that equals 192 kg plus another 32kg in total on your backs..... thats almost a quarter of a tonne ...

Checked Baggage Allowance | Qantas

[mischief]

Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate

Mischief,



The above post that I quote here now as you are dealing with your inbox struck a chord for me. I'm probably older than your dad (check my profile, but I am 76.)



One time we met a woman whose father was in ill health, and lived in NY, and her own family were on their boat in Mexico. And we talked about the situation. Eventually, she decided that she would feel really bad if she hadn't gone back to say goodbye to him, if he died while they were on the way to the Marquesas. So, I think wolfgal has a real point.



If you resolve the issues you have with your dad, you may not need to uproot the family from Oz. However, in either event, quality time with him will help you with the rest of the decisions you'll have to make.



Incidentally, what's your wife's take on the situation?



Ann

Thanks Ann.

My wife is excited about going back. She would be happy either way. Same with the kids. But I've lead a fairly adventurous life and know the payoff they would have from the trip. Of corse there's so much more to consider then just that.

On another note it was mentioned about the girls paper work.
My wife and I are both dual citizens
So the girls automatically are citizens. But we have to prove it. So basically jumping some hoops submitting our applications and waiting the process time 16months but can take longer or shorted. But after they get their citizenship papers then we apply for all new passports and have to wait for that.
We are making a two year plan. Whether we sail of sell. If we sell one year to finish all projects and put her on the market and one year to sell if needed.

We also need to sell other things and have all our affairs in order. Pay off a few bills and sell our car. Etc.

Regarding Dad, well he won't miraculously get better but he's not dying right away either (although that can happen).
It's also about our whole family. Not only Dad.
Our girls are so wonderful but I think it would be good for them to enjoy their too many to count cousins around 40 great uncles and Aunts etc. they don't realize they are part of a much bigger family then just the 4 of us. So moving back to the Rockies (in Alberta BTW) will happen regardless.