Second sail - jib only - is this unusual?

[jimTheSailorMan]

Second voyage out on my 1970 American Fiberglass trailer boat. First was a disaster where I did a Jean-Claude Van Damme splits between the dock and boat and slipped and hit the boat with my butt - bruise looks like North America on the map.

Anyhow, got a small 2 hp Honda engine and wanted to check it out. That all worked fine(almost lost the engine off the mounts but grabbed it and had safety change hold it). Learned to bring a screwdriver to cinch down the motor mounts better next time (and adjust motor angle)

Real question, decided with all the learning going on to just test the motor and put up the jib sail.

Winds were maybe 3-5 mph. When sailing 90 or closer degrees to the wind, the boat felt like it was being blown sideways and the center board and rudder were having minimal effect. I had to keep moving the tiller until I ran out of tiller. Luckily, I just used the motor to get me back to the path I wanted to go.

So my real question, was this unusual or is there someting wrong or am I doing something wrong?

Next voyage I plan on using the main only.

[jwing]

No that is not unusual. You probably did lots of things wrong, but none that you wrote about here. Actually you did something half-right: put yourself in a learning situation and experimented. Congratulations! The second half of that is to figure out why you got the result you did. Hint: Did you sail DDW (directly down wind) with just your jib? If so, what happened?

Yes, a good next step is sailing with your mainsail only. Safety tip: do not sail DDW with your main. Before you try that or even close to DDW, get on Youtube and watch a few videos of 'unintentional' jibes (or 'accidental', or 'uncontrolled'). Then make sure you understand what causes them, how to identify when they are about to happen, and how to prevent them.

[thomm225]

Another simple way to think about it is that you can use the jib to move the boat's bow off the wind (away from the wind)

Use the main (sheet in) to move the bow toward the wind.

So in this way you can actually steer the boat with just the sails if the wind is nice and steady

If there is enough wind, the sails can actually over power the rudder and hold or turn the boat regardless of where the rudder is

Also, it's best when learning to use the motor as little as possible. Just coming and going from the dock at most

[jimTheSailorMan]

Did you sail DDW (directly down wind) with just your jib? If so, what happened?

Eventually, after running out of rudder, the boat swayed slowly downwind. I didn't really experiment with DDW just used the motor to go back to 90 degrees.

I had watched this set of sailing lessons

and it said to use light wind day and sail 90 to wind and turn INTO wind when turning. Due to limitations of the rudder could attempt but eventually the boat couldn't be steered into the wind - kinda stalled - then swayed back towards DDW.

I had seen the jibe stuff on Youtube and used the motor to keep things where I wanted to be but since we only had the jib up, the boom wasn't an issue.

Thanks for your reply. I have a list of issues to resolve before next time out - big ones are:

1. want to put main up in backyard a few times so I am comfortable with boom, sail and lines issues. Should this always be done at the dock or is it safe to try in the water or on dockside?

2. Motor mount, angle and safety cable squared away

3. BRING BUG SPRAY - with little wind the flies were bad on this lake.

[Don C L]

Yeah I occasionally will sail out with just the jib, BUT remember the jib has very little driving horsepower compared to its effect trying to windvane the boat's bow around especially if it is sheeted in too tight. So until the the boat gets some decent speed up, she will NOT respond to the rudder trying to engage a turn. To make it work you need a good breeze and you need to start off with the jib sheets loose running off the wind a bit and then sheet them in gently as she gains speed and bring her around closer to the wind as you go. Not really a good idea in close quarters! The success of this depends on the boat's design and rig too.
Oh yeah, and jwing's warning about accidental gybing, or jibing, is a VERY important one too. A gybe preventer vang is a good idea.

[jimTheSailorMan]

Originally Posted by Don C L

Oh yeah, and jwing's warning about accidental gybing, or jibing, is a VERY important one too. A gybe preventer vang is a good idea.

Thanks.

Will post a picture of how it looks once I get the sail up in the yard. Not sure if I have one. Maybe over the weekend.

[thomm225]

When you have the least momentum, the sails work best for steering.

[jimTheSailorMan]

Originally Posted by thomm225

When you have the least momentum, the sails work best for steering.

Definitely felt like we had no momentum. Glad I had the motor to help. Will do another light wind day when I do the main.

Any suggestions for that voyage?

[roland stockham]

Once you have some basics and the wind is light try standing next to the mast with the jib sheet in one hand and the boom in the other. On a small boat you will find you can steer and maneuver the boat by adjusting the sail angles. It's a fun training exercise but I also used to use it for docking.

[akprb]

If you want to sail you need a wee bit more wind than a few knots.

Also you might enjoy learning more of the lingo. It’s part of the fun :-)

Side note jib only for nice long reaches is perfectly fine, fun and safe. You’ll find the combos that work for your boat.

Personally, on long single handed passages with a good breeze the genoa (big jib) is my preferred power source, simple and safe. The main just a hassle :-)

Enjoy!

[mikesailin]

What you experienced was normal and predictable. Visualize looking down on the boat. There is a point near the center of the boat called the "center of lateral resistance". If you were to push sideways at the stern, the boat would rotate around that point; push sideways at the bow and the boat rotates in the other direction about the same point. When you were sailing on the wind with jib only, the wind was pushing the bow sideways and rotating the boat around the center of lateral resistance. It is important to use both sails to balance those lateral forces. If the wind is too much for both full sails, then reef. An exception is sailing down wind when jib only tends to pull the boat through the water and keep it more steady on course.

[OS2Dude]

I often single hand under the jib alone when I jus want to relax a little. How your boat handles that way depends on the make of your boat and the size of your jib.


One other thing you may want to do is to GOOGLE using a spring line to control your boat. We can control our boat with a single line and the engine regardless of the wind direction. Leaving/arriving is also so much easier now.

[merlinuxo]

Put some tell tails on the shrouds as high as you can reach (can be light yarn) and the illustration below shows where your sails should be.
I print these and give them to new sailors when I take them out, visual guides are much better than verbal.
Also, the only point that requires sails to be hauled in tight is when sailing as high as you can, other points- ease the sheets until they luft and pull in until the lufting stops.
Stay calm and enjoy it. If things get confusing, toss out the anchor and take a break.

[ferrailleur]

Originally Posted by mikesailin

What you experienced was normal and predictable. Visualize looking down on the boat. There is a point near the center of the boat called the "center of lateral resistance". If you were to push sideways at the stern, the boat would rotate around that point; push sideways at the bow and the boat rotates in the other direction about the same point. When you were sailing on the wind with jib only, the wind was pushing the bow sideways and rotating the boat around the center of lateral resistance. It is important to use both sails to balance those lateral forces. If the wind is too much for both full sails, then reef. An exception is sailing down wind when jib only tends to pull the boat through the water and keep it more steady on course.

great explanation. Thanks

[knockabout]

sounds normal / alls fair in love, war and sailing / we run 3 headsails on furlers and a rotary reefing main / with a bit of wind she sails upwind well on her headsail / we run a DIY boom brake system on the main to prevent chinese jibes while messing around with the headsails / it is important to balance the sails so you have neutral trim(your tiller is not pulling or pushing against you) /if you have reefing points it's good to practice with a reefed main and small jib / it is easy to sail with good wind it's hard to sail in light wind / then to complicate things your hull may be affected by tide and current / good luck with your experimenting / sail safely and enjoy