Pirate Attacks Ship- 1 Dead

[conchaway]

If you don't have the means, ability, and determination to defend yourself, you will be prey.

[Island Time O25]

In all the discussions of return of piracy one pertinent fact is missing. How the marine insurance industry is using it as an excuse to hike up the rates for shippers. I remember reading a few years back, toward the end of the then piracy wave, that for every $1 paid out as ransom by the insurers,the overall premiums are raised by $5-6. The actual figures were as I recall were $100m in ransom paid vs. $500-600mil in additional premiums collected.

If the insurers could not do that I'm sure they'd be very quick to hire merceneries to deal with the piracy problem. But since they make a killing raising rates there is no incentive for them to do anything.

[NorthernMac]

Originally Posted by tarian

And that is how you take over the World without firing a gun or invading another country, seems we in the West have been getting in wrong for many years , good luck to them

Good luck to china? Ehhhh


Per the issue at hand, guns, this is why you go armed. These “pirates” are cowards and are just attacking for a few bucks, when their ROI starts going pear shaped, they just turn around and look for a softer target. This is basic laws of nature stuff, problem is lots of tin pot dictators REALLY don’t like the idea of the peasants having guns, which is why I’d love it if any country that banned crossing ships from being armed would be held directly liable for any damage caused by pirates in their waters.

[alansmith]

China's end game is always long term planning. chinese are shrewd and have the ability to stay with a plan. It helps that their system of gov't is communism. We, democracy, have startling changes in elections. We throw previous allies under the bus if suits are current leadership. We have knee jerk policies in some situations.

I don't like some of the things President Trump does. I didn't like some of the things President Obama did. I don't like some of the things President Clinton did. But addressing severe trade deficits and illegal immigration has been a change in direction.

It is pretty plain to see that China is becoming a handful to deal with. I expect in another 10 years she will be the dominant economic power on this planet and America sucking hind tete.

[Island Time O25]

We need some historic perspective here. 1930s-1940s were all about ascending Germany and its allies. 1950s-1960s were all about the Red Scare, nuclear attack shelters, etc. In 1970s-1980s the scare was that we were going to lose economically to Japan and suffer nuclear winter in the meantime. In 1990s-2000s we were going to be blown to bits by Islamic terrorism. Now its China, not the Red Scare China of the Vietnam War years but Japan-like China of ascending economy, military, etc.

While there was a kernel of truth in every scare the US pretty much overcame each and came out on top. We are still the most dominant economy in the world, with the most sought after currency, the most desireable place to move to, our technology and the culture based upon it is the most envied, despised and immitated at the same time by pretty much the whole world, including the Chinese.

One of the reasons IMO is the flexibilty of our approach to such challenges (at least up to now). Even the fact that we elected Tramp, instead of going with same old same old, speaks volumes of such flexibility. And contrary to the media negative view of this changed approach (in contrast to the media psycophant labeling of purported "change" by Obama administration when in fact it was in all but the name a Bush 2.0 presidency), I find it a refreshing way to counter decades of bowing down to the US' detractors and ill-wishers.

[Captain Scott]

Island time has a refreshing and optimistic take. I have been to China for business about 20 times in the last 25 years. It seems to me that the rise of China during this time is akin to the rise of the USA in the late 19th/early 20th century. China will roll past the USA economic and many other levels in only the next few years.
My question is: Will the USA meet the challenge like a bully or a chess player?
My suggestion is to GET THE FACTS, rally your allies, be smart, plan. The ultimate victor wins the war without firing a shot.

[33trippindaisy]

At 64 years young, I can't remember China ever being a partner to us. We allowed them to survive the Japanese. Our mistake there. The ink was not yet dry when the Chinese took to war on the Korean Peninsula, and my family was one of many who bore out the hardships of their decisions. My Father served in Korea, and my Uncle was captured and held POW. They both then ended up as career soldiers in the Vietnam conflict as well. We should never forget we were fighting the Chinese and their influences there as well. My Dad was wounded twice, and received two Purple Hearts and two Bronze Stars for Valor. My Uncle died 93 days into his first combat deployment. They were not boys. My Dad was 39, my Uncle was 41, and exempt from combat, but he was a true soldier, and volunteered for Vietnam. My cousin and I were both in the Army but his orders to Vietnam were cancelled, and mine never came. The 82nd Airborne was done with Vietnam, but we should not ever believe for a second the Chinese are not our most dangerous enemy, for they are that and much more. None of it any good. The thing that always strikes me about our enemy's are the people, and the food. If we could just figure out how to live in this World, enjoying each others company and sharing food at the table, we might well get out of this mess before the Governments kill us all with their infinite wisdom. Some of you may not like Trump, but he has tried to take on China. More so than anyone else in my memory. They will take over South America as well, and if you think we will be sailing these back yard waters like we do now......well, please don't be so foolish. They will take our most precious cruising grounds very soon if they are not knocked on their butts really soon. Some times I wish I was back in the woods, dumb to the World, with a notion to catch a little brookie or two for lunch, and having the biggest problem of being a bit short on my firewood. Truth is, its too late for that now.

[Cpt Pat]

Originally Posted by tarian

And that is how you take over the World without firing a gun or invading another country, seems we in the West have been getting in wrong for many years , good luck to them

The West plays "chess," while the Chinese play "Go" where the goal is to surround your opponent by removing their liberties.

China is playing a long game. We can't remember what happened last week. Our only advantage is our ability invent and innovate. And China just steals that like candy from a baby.

It doesn't help that the US borrowed $1 trillion from China to fiance Gulf War II. If we ever want to go to war with China, we'll have to borrow from them to finance it.

I've encouraged my grandchildren to learn Chinese. It'll be a survival skill in the future.

[Saleen411]

I could easily go off all day on China I've been driving my "glorified bus" there for over 20 years...mostly to HKG but China too.....PVG, PEK, XMN.

I have witnessed HUGE changes.....bicycles to cars baby.

Back in the early 2000's I had the Secretary of the Treasury, Paul O'Neill, riding with us on the way to Shanghai for some economic summit He sat in an upper deck seat near the cockpit and spent a fair amount of time talking with us before boarding.

Bottom line, he was in AWE of China's economic potential and correctly predicted almost exactly when China's GDP would be number TWO behind the USA. Back then China's GDP was about the same as Italy's...only number SIX in the world. As you know Italy only has 60 million people or so compared to China's 1.4 BILLION.

Well, the writing is on the wall....doesn't take a genius to see where all this is going.

As to the PIRATES...I think this thread was about pirates. I don't think the west coast of Africa is a very popular cruising ground anyway.

Oh what the heck....I don't mind bashing China if the mods don't care.

Like locusts, taking over the world. I've already seen a bunch of great tourist destinations RUINED by the Chinese hoard. HKG is also being ruined by the mainland Chinese. Don't get me started.

I wonder how world CRUISING may be affected some day.....more whistling.

[Cpt Pat]

Originally Posted by Saleen411

Bottom line, he was in AWE of China's economic potential and correctly predicted almost exactly when China's GDP would be number TWO behind the USA.

According to the CIA's World Factbook, China has now surpassed the USA and is Number One: https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...s/208rank.html.

[Saleen411]

Originally Posted by Cpt Pat

According to the CIA's World Factbook, China has now surpassed the USA and is Number One: https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...s/208rank.html.

Well that's interesting. Most sources I've read still show the USA as number One, like the IMF.....

International Monetary Fund World Economic Outlook Oct 2019-2024.....

World GDP Ranking 2019 - StatisticsTimes.com

Regardless of being number one or two, China's growth the last couple of decades has been remarkable.

[Night_Sailor]

Consider that the US is now and has been for years the world's reserve currency. There is a major effort to unseat the US as the world's reserve currency. The country with the strongest military typically holds that status. Next is the grip on oil--the petrodollar. This is the real reason we attacked Libya, and want to attack Iran now. They are/were trading in Euro's. Libya was trying to create a currency based on gold--a huge threat. Likewise the real reason for the conflict with Russia is they are trading oil in their own currency though direct trade deals because of US sanctions. Losing reserve currency status will make us like Britain. Large scale unemployment. People eeking by. I have not been to England in 10 years but things are quite bad over there except for the elites.

So what else. Our national debt. The US has an economy based on growth. Right now it is not growing except for poor immigrants. Most of the immigrants are returning the bulk of their incomes to their home countries. I've seen this throughout the tech industry for decades now. So the US has been bleeding out at a rapid rate. This happened to Spain when they were the superpower, England, France, and all the way back to Roman times. Massive wealth coupled with massive spending followed by decline.

Some people say the world's population will stabilize at 11 billion. I don't agree. That theory is based on several factors. Education, wealth distribution, and I'll add culture and intelligence. There are places where people are not very smart, as the smarter more competitive people have left. Those will always lag and cause conflict. Wealth redistribution is affected by greed. Look at any banana republic. Venezuela, the pearl of South America, ruined in short order. Who want to eat their pets? The money was stolen from the population and made billionaires of a select few. I feel the only humane solution is to directly pay people not to have children. That places resources directly in the hands of those who need the money and stops them from reproducing.

How long will the US be the world's reserve currency? I heard estimates ten years ago that this would end around 2025. I feel it could last longer. Trump seems to be trying his best to keep America Great, while the progressive forces want the US economy dragged down and it's wealth spread far and wide.

I read that when the food price index is above 210, riots can break out spontaneously anywhere. That has been true for a long time. Food prices indicate riots will happen, while the media reports these riots as caused by other reasons--the real reason is the cost of food--a basic human need.

I'm not alone in foreseeing massive economic disruption in the future. China has the key advantage of a stable government with a long term vision. Others have pointed out our fickle government, that changes often, is not as stable and has no long term planning. NASA is a classic example Obama gutted it. Trump restored it. China? They stole our technology and are making slow but steady advances. A base on the moon? The progressive movement is winning, students are programmed to believe nonsense, act violently, and spread social unrest. China will take as many resources as it can, and they have a big stick. Soon they will dominate everywhere while we argue and our politicians like Biden and the Clintons steal as much as they can. The Chinese have their own solution to corruption. In the meantime. They will take everything they can, and they are doing a good job of it in Africa. They have a plan and it's working.

[PADISail]

Originally Posted by Paul L

Your man Trump killed it and tried going it alone. With not much success.

TPP never worked !
It was still placing America Last, and we were still getting raped by ChiCom...
Just like the carbon laws, we agreed (but didn't sign), and were doing all the work, while China (etc) never contributed a great deal of funding (at least according to their GNP), and kept on polluting along with a few other Countries...

So, Our Man Donald walked away from the agreement.
Doing all the work ourselves and then being screwed by the lame arse Countries, was just plain stupid to try and foot the bill all by ourselves...

I understand that you are a Trump Hater, and if you know of a place you like better than America - perhaps you should toddle off there...

Trump 20/20 Perfect Vision for America
JMHO!

[AiniA]

Originally Posted by PADISail

TPP never worked !
It was still placing America Last, and we were still getting raped by ChiCom...
Just like the carbon laws, we agreed (but didn't sign), and were doing all the work, while China (etc) never contributed a great deal of funding (at least according to their GNP), and kept on polluting along with a few other Countries...

So, Our Man Donald walked away from the agreement.
Doing all the work ourselves and then being screwed by the lame arse Countries, was just plain stupid to try and foot the bill all by ourselves...

I understand that you are a Trump Hater, and if you know of a place you like better than America - perhaps you should toddle off there...

Trump 20/20 Perfect Vision for America
JMHO!

There is just a lot of incorrect info in this thread. I could provide a couple of hours of explanation but just one thing. Trump did not kill the TPP, he merely removed the US from it. At this stage China is trying to figure a way to become part of the TPP process. Trump has wanted to pursue an isolationist path and the Chinese are quite happy to benefit from this. I was in Colombo a couple of weeks ago and the Chinese are building a huge port extension. At this point it is for cargo use but not hard to imagine it becoming a naval base in the years to come. The Belt and Road Initiative technically does not include Africa and South Africa but the Chinese are big on both continents. The problem the Chinese economy faced was there became little room for growth domestically. The real estate and infrastructure segments were basically fully built - in some cases overbuilt and domestic demand for consumer goods was huge. Almost five times as many cars are sold in China compared to the US. The B and R and other overseas projects are there to keep the Chinese economy growing at something north of 6%, down from 10%+ in the past but still phenomenally high. Xi realizes that if he keeps his people relatively happy, he can do what he wants to become a modern emperor.

[Uncle Bob]

A LOT of political commentating here (largely by relatively new members) and not much discussion re the original question.
The piracy risk is very small and proportional to the area one is sailing in, in my opinion if one recognises this and stays away from problem areas the risk becomes much lower.