Occupancy of Boats

[versace]

Thanks a lot for the help so far guys, and to give Ann a better response, I am not "joking". I don't have the level of knowledge about sail boats that the people responding to my thread do so I don't understand most of the technical things and as a result can't reply specifically to them. However I am joining a sailing club at my university this Monday for the next 6 weeks and should learn a lot from them because they are one of the best in the nation. Then once I have adequate knowledge I was going to come back here and review these comments, this time through the eyes of an experienced sailor.
P.S.-Feel free to undo the 1 star you gave me because you THOUGHT I was ungrateful

[colemj]

Those stars under your name are not "given" by anyone - they simply relate to the number of posts one has made. The number of stars under your name will increase as you post more. I don't know the post number break points between each star.

Mark

[versace]

Please let me know what you guys think go the Albin Vega 27 vs the Catalina 27, the Albin Vega seems a lot bigger and roomier.

Albin Vega

sailboat Albin Vega 27' sloop

Catlina 27

Catalina 27 Sailboat

1976 Catalina 27 Sailboat

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by versace

P.S.-Feel free to undo the 1 star you gave me because you THOUGHT I was ungrateful

Stars turn from blank to filled with yellow depending on how many posts you have made. Steps are at 10,50,100,400 or 500 and 1000.

On your user profile and sometimes in the threads there will be a green box that appears next to your name like the stars below your name This is related to the number of "Thanks" that people have left you for a good post. Generally there is one square and as you get more Thanks the title that pops up when you hover the cursor over the square cahnges. So far for me steps for me have been at the same counts as for posts. At some point there are steps adding squares up to it seems 8, then further steps change the color. I have no idea what the Thanks counts are for those steps.

[Island Time O25]

I don't know what planet the other posters are on but here in New England (MA area) you can get a very decent 25 footer for about $5K if with working diesel or around $3K with a working outboard. I just sold mine 1979 Oday25 which was in good condition (for a 35 year old boat) which was last advertised at $3K for well under that asking price b/c I just did not have time to attend to the tire kickers or be left at the dock by the no shows. First real interested person who came along, part of 2 guy dreamer team (i.e. "we want to learn to sail and sail beyond the blue yonder" type of thing) came with cash in hand, no equivocations, no requirement to have "a friend of a friend look at the boat 3 weeks later" etc, etc and I sold them the boat on the spot for a sweet price. Sweet for them, a loss for me. But I'm glad these guys will have a decent boat to learn on at the cost of a season's membership at the local sailing club. And they did have a marine pro friend stop by apparently ready to battle for them thinking they've been had but having inspected the boat pronounced the deal a good one and wandered why I sold her so cheaply. I explained that for me, living an hour away from the mooring was a real PITA driving there at the whim of every yahu tire kicker, considering half of them would cancel while I was stuck in traffic trying to get to the boat. My time is way more valuable than this.

Anyway, don't get tied up to your local area, look far and wide in any area from which you can sail the boat to your locality and look for deals not on overpriced and broker fed Yachtworld but on craigslist, sailboatlistings or other FSBO sites. In the 20-30+ years old range 9 out of 10 times a similar make and condition boat on FSBO site will be 2-3 times cheaper than it's sisters on Yachtworld, opinions of CF ex-brokers notwithstanding.

And as with many things in life - luck finds those who are ready to accept it. Good luck in finding the right boat for you. Just make sure you are ready to grab one when you see one.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by versace

Please let me know what you guys think go the Albin Vega 27 vs the Catalina 27, the Albin Vega seems a lot bigger and roomier.

Albin Vega

sailboat Albin Vega 27' sloop

Catlina 27

Catalina 27 Sailboat

1976 Catalina 27 Sailboat

While the Vega is slightly longer than the Cat is is also significantly narrower so there is going to be less actual volume in the boat. There are no dedicated berths in the main cabin, both offwatch crew will be on settees that convert every morning and evening and the on-watch person will have to sit in the companion way (on the other hand this makes it easier for them to check the horizon regularly.) The Cat had a post under the mast which is sturdier than the under deck bridge the Vega has.

On the other hand the Vega is slightly shallower than the Cat which should be a slight advantage in the Bahamas. Also the side decks are much wider which is a safety advantage and there is a bridge deck separating the cockpit from the cabin which both strengthens the boat and decreases the potential for down-flooding. The Vega has a reputation for being sturdy, there have been numberous offshore volyages by these boats and one recently sailed the NorthWest Passage shich has been a very difficult and rare feat.

Of these 2 boat designs I like the Vega the best because of the reputation and the sailing oriented design evidenced by the bridge deck, wide side decks and other design features.

Of the specific boats you linked to, I would not take either of the Catalina because they both have inboards, plus the first one had a wheel and already exceeds your price limit.

Catalina C27 with dinghy
27' Sailboat
1974 Catalina 27
NEW PRICE 1978 Catalina 27 Sailboat Tall Rig NEW PRICE

Pearson 26 Sailboat
Pearson 26' sailboat
30' Pearson Sail Boat
26 Ft. Pearson Sailboat

1968 Jensen (aka California) Cal 28 Sailboat

27' Cal Sailboat
SAILBOAT CAL 29'


These last 2 boats violate my advice about inboards but in these cases the price is so low you could buy an outboard, a bracket and fuel tanks if the existing inboard turned out to be toast. I would actually buy the motor, bracket and tanks anyway, store the motor on the bracket and use it for the dinghy when needed.

Don't be set on buying in your area. Your location in Florida gives you access to both the Atlantic and Gulf Intercoastal Waterways that make delivering boats relatively safe if somewhat time consuming. If you bought a boat in Virginia you could expect to deliver it back to Miami in about 30 calander days. Thats making 40nm per day, with one day off per week.

Doing so would give you opportunity to get used to the boat in relatively safe conditions, plenty of practice anchoring along the way and a regular group of other boats you can ask questions of.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by Island Time O25

I don't know what planet the other posters are on but here in New England (MA area) you can get a very decent 25 footer for about $5K if with working diesel or around $3K with a working outboard. . .


Anyway, don't get tied up to your local area, look far and wide in any area from which you can sail the boat to your locality and look for deals not on overpriced and broker fed Yachtworld but on craigslist, sailboatlistings or other FSBO sites. In the 20-30+ years old range 9 out of 10 times a similar make and condition boat on FSBO site will be 2-3 times cheaper than it's sisters on Yachtworld, opinions of CF ex-brokers notwithstanding.

Apparently on Planet MA 3 relatively tall men can satsfactorily co-exist on a 25' boat for months at a time.

Seriously we all live on the same planet, but prices vary region to region and you have to draw a line somewhere for maximum distance you are willing to go no matter how good the deal. Until you actually see the boat you don't know how good it is. In the mean time you have spent money traveling a long distance to see the boat and put yourself up. If the boat doesn't pan out for whatever reason that money is lost.

Having acquired a boat you are looking at 1 week transit time for each 300ish miles you are from home including food, fuel, repairs and lost wages. If you drove up you now have a car with you that needs to go back home while you get the boat going or some arrangement where you drive home and fly/rail back for the boat.

I would put that distance limit at about 1000 mi if I were living on the east coast so the DC area and New Orleans are about as far as I would go from Miami.

[Island Time O25]

Originally Posted by Adelie

Apparently on Planet MA 3 relatively tall men can satsfactorily co-exist on a 25' boat for months at a time.

Seriously we all live on the same planet, but prices vary region to region and you have to draw a line somewhere for maximum distance you are willing to go no matter how good the deal. Until you actually see the boat you don't know how good it is. In the mean time you have spent money traveling a long distance to see the boat and put yourself up. If the boat doesn't pan out for whatever reason that money is lost.

Having acquired a boat you are looking at 1 week transit time for each 300ish miles you are from home including food, fuel, repairs and lost wages. If you drove up you now have a car with you that needs to go back home while you get the boat going or some arrangement where you drive home and fly/rail back for the boat.

I would put that distance limit at about 1000 mi if I were living on the east coast so the DC area and New Orleans are about as far as I would go from Miami.

Certainly Oday25 (with its 5'6" cabin) is not for 3 tall dudes although the 2 guys who bought mine were a bit taller than myself and I'm about 5'8"-5'9". On the other hand with the available funds they would probably spend many a months looking and still would not find a boat in their price range with tall enough interior height. So they apparently did what most reasonable people would have done in their place - compromised. And they will get a full sailing season out of that compromise and if the boat turns out to be not for them in the long run they will be able to recoup their purchase price by selling it quickly, provided they sell it just as cheaply as they have acquired it. Beats wasting time and $$ looking for that perfect 1st boat instead of learning to sail and actually sailing. I myself learned the hard way and wasted valuable time looking for that 1st boat. If I could change anything I would just buy the first nondecrepit boat that came my way and was within my budget and just sail it and then would move on to a better suited boat.

[Adelie]

Here's another option. Kind of out there, but has enough sleeping space, has its own trailer so you can get it home and is in the right price range.

1980 Dufour T7 sailboat for sale in Virginia

[avb3]

Originally Posted by versace

Please let me know what you guys think go the Albin Vega 27 vs the Catalina 27, the Albin Vega seems a lot bigger and roomier.

Albin Vega

sailboat Albin Vega 27' sloop

Catlina 27

Catalina 27 Sailboat

1976 Catalina 27 Sailboat

If you can get a hold of an Albin Vega, don't even hesitate. They come with a very well deserved reputation, having made many blue water trips and as someone else has mentioned, Matt Rutherford circumnavigated the Americas from north to south non stop with one.

Read some of his trip on the blog he kept.
http://www.solotheamericas.org/

No one in their right mind would attempt that with a Catalina. They are a great coastal boat, but that's it.

The Albin Vega will be more "cozy" though.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[versace]

Awesome I guess I will be leaning towards an Albin Vega instead of a Pearson or Catalina then!

[Leo Ticheli]

You might enjoy this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lwbHYOFD-4

Best of luck on your sailing adventures!

Fair winds,

Leo

[Don C L]

Ok I speak as one who lived on and sailed a Columbia 24. (When you are twenty, anything is possible.) That little boat looked odd to me at first with its high cabin, but after a I saw how well she sailed and how well she was built, I was glad I had been talked into buying her. Albin Vegas are very nice boats, people who actually sail a lot will almost universally come down on that one over a Catalina. Hope I didn't offend anyone. In any case, I loved that Columbia 24 so much I figured one day I'd get the 29, a little more room and speed, but still small enough to be easily handled, sailed and paid for! Don't discount the old boats from the 60s, if they are fixed up, they can be great bargains. Look at atomvoyages.com for some good advice and good old boats. So my Columbia 29 is not as roomy, not as modern, has no modern conveniences, no shower, no pressurized water, no windlass, and doesn't turn as fast as a more modern boat.. so why do enjoy it so much and feel so confident in its abilities? Crazy, I guess. By the way, Columbia 26 MKI is a nice, inexpensive pocket cruiser too. There is one in the middle of restoration that is being given away in Maryland (see classifieds.)

[Don C L]

Oh and don't turn your nose up on a Pearson just yet, especially those from the 60s. The Ariel (26), Triton (29) and the Vanguard(32) all have very good reputations too, for good reason. They too are part of the old school, thick, hand-laid up fiberglass, narrow beam, long keel tradition that many of us old timers appreciate...

[Don C L]

I actually admire your spirit of adventure here... don't be discouraged... many of us here started the same way. You need to find a boat in good shape and of a design that will take good care of you. The ones I have mentioned are in that category, but there are many more... and there are a few to avoid. Just because a boat is older and less expensive does not mean it is necessarily a poor choice. In my own case my Columbia 29 was in fair shape, cost $4000 and I have put a couple thousand into her, and I feel very confident in her abilities. BUT I knew this boat well before I bought her and I knew how I wanted to fix her up, and how to do it inexpensively. I would not recommend that to you because you are just getting started. My particular boat, or one like it like a Pearson Triton, or Alberg 30, or Bristol 27, or Albin Vega, in really good cruising shape would be around 10K I'd guess. You should be able to find a well-found and well-built boat in your price range. Don't go for a fixer-upper unless you love working on boats for years at a time. In my own case, in my 29, it could cruise 4 people who get along really well and who don't need showers or fancy food. But see, really, it is the ocean that is your home, not just the boat. Cruise with people who love the ocean and who love to sail. And then cruise the Keys for a while and see how it feels before the big cruise. (I haven't cruised around Florida, but I am saying stick close to home for a while to get your skills up.) Good luck to you!