Newbie sailor - suggestions on first boat?

[schmidla]

Long story short -- recently I saw this documentary called Maidentrip and discovered this crazy thing call cruising and decided that I MUST do this one day...whether it's around the world, the caribbean, crossing an ocean, not sure. But I must learn to sail!

So now I'm a member of the local sailing club on Lake Michigan and currently taking a 2-week basic course where, upon passing a test, we'll be rated for up to 10 knots of wind to take out the club boats.

So now I'm looking for a good beginner boat that is ready to sail but still gives some opportunities to spruce it up and do some work on it. I am considering this to be my "practice" boat for a couple years while I learn more about sailing and just gain some experience. Just to sail around lake michigan basically.

I stumbled upon a local person selling an Ericson E-27 for $2,500. Here's the listing:

https://milwaukee.craigslist.org/boa/6132048781.html

Thoughts? Not really sure what I should be looking for in a first boat.

[Don C L]

Hello, welcome aboard! The Ericson 27 is perfectly good boat. I had a good friend who lived on one off the beach of UCSB here in southern Cal for a short time while he was going to school and loved that boat. He often took it out to the local islands. My only concern about it is that it is kind of big for a first learner boat. I mean it's not a bad choice, and if it is in good shape, the price is good. It looks to be in good shape and a good choice from the ad. And it is a responsive boat, good to sail and learn on. I actually like the outboard for a boat that size.
When I was learning as a kid I spent most of my time on Lasers and Capri 14s, and they were great for teaching me with their immediate feedback and forgiving nature. When I moved up to a Victory 21 it felt very big and sluggish to me! Then when I bought my first boat, a Columbia 24, I thought it was an enormous yacht! I would recommend that even if you decide to get the Ericson, that you also get a small fast, fun boat to learn on if you can. It will teach you all the basics safely and you can take it out easily and frequently, and you won't worry so much about making mistakes or hitting anything! Don't rush into the larger boat just because you think it is a really good deal though. There are plenty of other good deals out there waiting when you are ready for them. Good luck and keep us posted!

[JPA Cate]

Hi, there schmidla,

Well now, what i think you might need is a lesson in reading boat ads. I'm going to comment in blue to the blurb, but what you need to see first should be in red. The boat has a balsa cored deck. Now, this need not necessarily be a problem, but if any deck fittings have not been properly sealed when installed, there is the possibility of the dreaded deck balsa rot. You'll find threads on fixing this condition here on CF, use the CF Custom Google Search function.

Now, "1972 Ericson E-27 sailboat. 27ft LOA. This is an outboard model. Includes good running Nissan 9.9hp long shaft. Dual batteries, roller furling head sail, 6'2" head room in cabin, sleeps 4-5 people, shore power connection. What condition?

Interior cushions have no rips or tears or funky stains. Oh, how nice! are we next to history?

I didn't have all of the cushions onboard when pics taken. What condition? Mainsail with 2 reef points, 135 furling headsail, spinnaker and spinnaker pole. Sails are older but still serviceable. This is the opinion of the seller, and may be open to question. UV cover on headsail has a small area that needs to be restitched. No holes or tears in any of the sails.

Running and standing rigging is fine. What on earth does that mean,
original?

Solid decks, fresh bottom paint. It is an older boat that needs some TLC, what TLC,
exactly? might it have something to do with balsa rot? but it is a solid boat that sails fine. Ready to sail as is. Whose lives are at stake here?Cradle included. Clear Wisconsin title. Winter storage and spring launch paid for. $2500 OBO. Selling due to purchase of a larger sailboat.

The unamended ad sounds pretty good, but it did bring some questions to mind for me, anyway.

What it is, I think, is that sellers want to make the boat sound attractive, and, well, perhaps, truth is smudged.....

Just my opinion. I haven't seen the boat, and I merely point out some ideas that arose, reading the ad. And to be perfectly clear, I think it likely the sails are only minimally "serviceable". "Serviceable" depends on how much you care about how well the boat sails. You should expect to replace at least one headsail and the main. Otherwise, the ad would say when they were new, because it's a selling point.

Ann

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, schmidla.

[AgPilot]

You're on the right track. There's nothing wrong with educating yourself by asking for other's opinions........after that, do what's best for you. Let your boat choose you. As long as it's seaworthy and you feel that it will fit your needs, do it. There's no perfect boat, you just have to jump in and get started. You can always sell and buy another, like we did. We're currently shopping for our third boat after starting with a Catalina 22, now a Catalina 30, and soon something in the 34' range. Get started, you won't be sorry.

[kclancy]

I started with a Flying Junior and now own a Catalina 22. I bought both to learn on - sailing and repairing. I picked up the Cat for next to nothing and it has been a great learning tool for me. I am learning everything from restoring the gel coat to re-bedding hardware. The hard part is not spending too much in repairs or wants. That's the toughest part. I would have liked a little larger boat, I'm 6'3", and one day I will. This is just a temporary stop along the path of cruising to near/far away places.

[Stu Jackson]

Catalina 22 has a some major positives going for it. Builder still in business. Great support on the internet (www.sailboatowners.com and own association website and many owner websites and blogs - you won't be reinventing the wheel), easy to find a good one (they made almost 12,000 of them) and also good resale value, wonderful boats to learn on: stable enough in heavier weather, sail great in light wind, have the sail controls necessary to really learn, responsive; good space down below; and most importantly: FUN to sail.

[Diesel Bill]

Hi Schmidla, Welcome to the forum, I would only say what I read many years ago.
" Small boat, small problems, Big boat, big problems.
I found this to be true. Small boats are lots of fun and get used more often cause they are so easy to use. Bigger boats are more work to use in general. I know I'll get flack for this, but for me it's just more preps to get ready to go out for a few hours than a little day sailor that you can just hop in and go.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by schmidla

Long story short -- recently I saw this documentary called Maidentrip and discovered this crazy thing call cruising and decided that I MUST do this one day...whether it's around the world, the caribbean, crossing an ocean, not sure. But I must learn to sail!

So now I'm a member of the local sailing club on Lake Michigan and currently taking a 2-week basic course where, upon passing a test, we'll be rated for up to 10 knots of wind to take out the club boats.

So now I'm looking for a good beginner boat that is ready to sail but still gives some opportunities to spruce it up and do some work on it. I am considering this to be my "practice" boat for a couple years while I learn more about sailing and just gain some experience. Just to sail around lake michigan basically.

I stumbled upon a local person selling an Ericson E-27 for $2,500. Here's the listing:

https://milwaukee.craigslist.org/boa/6132048781.html

Thoughts? Not really sure what I should be looking for in a first boat.

Go for it after seeing it, if you like it. Insure the engine does run like a clock. Ericson made a good boat. Can you get someone teaching the course to go with you. Survey, I wouldn't spend the money on a $2500 purchase.

[idylours]

learning to sail comes pretty quick when you have your own boat. if you have the bug spend as much as you can on a boat and buy a boat to grow into
I like the catalina 30 for a beginner
spending 5 or 10 G on a boat to learn is a bit of a waste IMO

[hamburking]

I've seen a lot of ads, and a lot of boats. That ad looks good to me. I see a clean boat and pride of ownership. I think it looks like a great deal...GET IT!

Of course make a thorough inspection of the boat yourself first. But if everything works, it seems like a great deal.

I also like an outboard on a boat this size and age. A 40 year old inboard has its own issues. A rebuild on an outboard is not expensive, or a whole new (used) engine is still quite reasonable. I think a feature not realized by some people here on the forum is that you have fresh water and a short season on Lake Michigan, so it is quite likely to be in good condition.

Don't forget to let us know what happens!

[boatpoker]

Marine Survey 101 ... how to survey a boat yourself

[fSymo]

2500? Looks like a steal. Don't see any stains or water damage, go take a look. If you like what you see (no rust, no stiff running rigging, no problems or rust on standing rigging), it seems to be a great starter boat if the engine runs good.

[FutureStories]

Ericsons are good boats! Bring a friend from the club. They tend to have soft spots. Take a good sea trial. If it sails and motors and is that clean for 2500 you've got a good deal! Sell it in 3 years for nothing and get a longer term boat.

[Oreopenguin536]

I'm sorry it is a long post but I promise it's good

IMHO First things first. A boat is a hole in the water in which you throw money, the bigger the hole, the bigger the pocket book. I say use the club boats for a bit until you know what you like, either that or start with a 22ft or even a 26ft if you want one in the 20s but don't forget about the sunfish, lasers and cats! . The only reason I suggest looking into smaller boats is because it gives you an out if need be. Though I haven't seen it with sailing, in motocross I've seen too many people to count spend thousands of dollars on bikes and gear and then found out a few months later that it either wasn't for them or they regret not getting a different bike. Same thing applies here. Before you go gung-ho maybe think about starting smaller.

If you buy a smaller boat like laser for example it will give you a chance to really focus on techniques, maneuvers, and understanding how boats in general will react to things plus it give you time to really hone in stuff like reading the water or the sails. Every boat is different but with that they are all the same. I can hop on a Ranger 22 I'm restoring and sail it. Is it the same as the CS 36 my grandpa had? Hell no, they both act differently and have different personalities, but the basic principles still apply with both of them and with that they are the same. It isn't about what boat you buy or how big it is, it is about you having fun, being comfortable and knowing your boat That right there is the joy of sailing, or building cars or bikes or whatever! Every boat has its own personality, quirks and weird little things that it does, the fun part is getting to know your boat in the process of sailing it. The more you sail the more you'll know what you want and the more you'll know what you are looking for in a boat. If it's a boat thats a small type (under 20 feet or so) Get used to capsizing, have fun with it, do it on purpose, push yourself to see where you are comfortable at and how aggressive of a boat you want.

The questions you have to ask yourself though are, are you soloing it mainly or will you have a second hand onboard? Do you need cabin space for weekend sleepover trips on it while on the lake or just a daysailer with no space other than that for shoes and lunch?
What do you define cruising? Are you like me where cruising is being aggressive, hiking out, going fast and having the occasional "Oh S***" moment? Or are you more of a mellow bird that wants to just hang out, fly straight and not get to crazy with everything?


Again, this is all my opinion and I am a very very competitive guy and have that type demeanor and lifestyle, so I can be overly precise on what I pick whether its shooting or sailing or motocross. You may not be like that and maybe you just want to sail and not worry about the particulars which is totally fine! But the 2 things I've learned in my life thus far is

1: Don't buy things right away just because you can or you might think you need to. If you have boats at your disposal to use then save some money, have fun with someone else's boat and learn on it, even write down what you like and dislike about them so when you buy your own boat you will know what you want. The last thing you want is to buy a boat to big and not have a fun time because it is too much boat for you to handle by yourself while learning, the same thing goes with a boat too small

2: Which i stated above. A boat is a hole in the water in which you throw money. The bigger the hole, the bigger the pocket book.

I hope this all helped!