just wondering about liability release

[toddster8]

In my state, the supreme court has pretty much thrown out the whole concept of "liability waivers."

[Cthoops]

Oh my goodness. I work as a lawyer and I would NEVER have a guest sign a liability release. The thought has never even crossed my mind.

Having said that, I also wouldn't take someone I had just met out for a sail. Not because I'm worried about the liability, but rather I don't want to discover that I can't stand the person in the first hour of a three hour sail!

[S/V Illusion]

Rule 1: nothing changes a captain's liability.
Rule 2. stupidity and negligence are not defenses to liability

[jhulmer]

Yeah! the lawyers will tell you the release and waver gets dismissed in the first 5 min of court because the Wife, Husband, son, daughter, mother, father, etc didn't sign a release of said person yata yata.

I was a SCUBA instructor in my younger days and the release just showed that you informed them of the dangers. So It has value and is necessary in this situation.

So, to the bigger point:

Always do a Safety briefing on board before the outing. I do this and keep it informative and lighthearted.

"The life jackets are here."

"The fire extinguisher is here ... In the UNLIKELY event of a fire, don't pull the pin and trough it at the fire it's not a grenade... you actually have to pull the pin and squeeze the lever and shoot at the base of the Fire"

"In the UNLIKELY event of someone going overboard we will immediately throw a cushion or life ring to them, I will appoint someone to spot them continuously, we will stop the boat, etc. etc... and then I will finish by saying when we arrive back to the person overboard we will throw fish chum in the water around them as punishment for falling over board and scaring the hell out of us and making us work this hard....no just kidding...kind of"

and so on! it worked great on dive boats. kept everyone's attention and you fulfilled your duty to inform your passengers.

I do this on my own boat whenever I have new people/friends on board. This puts them at ease and will pay big dividends if you have an emergency on board. Especially if something happens to you the skipper/captain.

If I don't have someone on board that I know can handle an emergency then I go through the procedures in more detail so someone can call for help if needed.

Prevention is the best policy!

[wandering rober]

It would be about the same , driving your neighbor downtown in your auto , would you get a signed waiver !

[evm1024]

I always do a safety talk as noted above. This is just part of getting everyone up to speed on the boat.

Also, and I'm not sure of its value - I never take "Guests" for a sail. Everyone on board works the boat, they are Crew. It is agreed that they will be learning something about sailing too (er, increasing their sailing skill set).

I cycle each through a turn at the helm and give them all duties. Everyone is expected to keep a lookout.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by StuM

You don't say where you are, but I guess it's the US. I doubt anyone sailing anywhere else would even think to ask that question

Gee, you think we need torte reform. I see ambulance chasers on TV and it makes me puke.

[taxwizz]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

The whole question strikes me as rather sad. Maybe it’s b/c I don’t take guests out,.

"b/c".....British Columbia ?

I am confused.
In British Columbia you don't take guests out ?

[goat]

b/c = because

[taxwizz]

Originally Posted by goat

b/c = because

Thanks, Goat.
Is that a new official spelling, or do we just make these things up as we go?
or...Is th a new o/s or do we just MTTUAWG?

J/W
(just wondering)
(And I keep rem how much effort I wasted in skule lurning to spel)

[roland stockham]

Just to clarify as a few people are mentioning instructing. If you are a sailing club or acting in the capacity of an instructor for any reason whether for pay or on a voluntary basis the rules change and you do have very different liability. You need evidence of competency as an instructor as well as competence as a skipper and should look at liability insurance. If you take people on your boat you should make it clear that they are coming as crew and that you are the skipper not an instructor. Does not mean you can't show them how you want things done on your boat of course!

[Dave22q]

Great idea. Why not your car as well? Sadly it is no defense against your negligence so it is essentially worthless.

[Cheechako]

That's what insurance is for. Never heard of it.

[jmschmidt]

All encompassing insurance coverage is your only real protection. Releases and waivers are not worth the paper they are printed on, at least not in the collapsing legal system in the US, which is run by lawyers, politicians and judges who don't care about the people, only their fees and lofty positions in the Deep State.

[Cadence]

JMHO, I believe it is folly trying to make money from it, apparently not even having a PAK. The liability probably out weighs possible income. My father did it for the CG aux,
Pro bono. There seems to be a number of voluntary orgs. or clubs that provide that opportunity to learn free.

This may be redundant, to a degree. But I hate to see someone chase the impossible dream.