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31-05-2015, 03:54
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Wicklow, Ireland
Boat: Ruffian 23
Posts: 4
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Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Hi All,
I've recently acquired an elderly Ruffian 23 and plan on cruising it in the Irish Sea this summer. The hull is in good condition, no osmosis, or cracks etc. Some of the deck fittings allow water in, but that is just a case of rebedding. The deck itself is solid as it the mast and rigging. The Keel will get some TLC next winter, but its fine for now.
Once I get the feel for the boat with the help of sailing friends, I can see myself doing a lot of solo sailing as racing round the cans doesn't appeal that much to me. Once I get the confidence, I'll probably mix it with the RTC racers on a Wednesday night, but venture further afield at weekends.
Now to my question.
The Ruffian No 1 sail is a mighty 150+% Genoa and really needs the boat to have the ballast of several bodies to control it. Single handed they are normally sailed on the number 2 which balances quite well with the smallish main.
Unfortunately the number 2 & 3 Jibs look like they haven't been used for a good while, the piston hanks are all seized solid and seriously crusted and corroded. After a few days lubrication with a healthy dose of WD40 and some scrubbing they look a lot better, but the pistons are done for. Most of the springs are gone and the pins have corroded through.
The sail fabric appears to be in good condition, so I'm dropping them into a local sail maker for servicing and repair. My question is do I go for pistons or something along the lines of the Wichard Snap. The Snaps look handy for single handing. Your views would be greatly appreciated.
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31-05-2015, 04:16
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 5,629
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
The answer to your question, is with zero doubt, go with the Wichard's. As unlike piston hanks, they can be operated with one hand. Leaving your other one to perform other tasks, from; holding on, to clipping/un-clipping other things, handling the halyard etc. And my answer stems from the below linked, excellent work.
BTW, to prevent damaging the pressed rings in the jib while removing old, non-operable, "knock on" (not sewn on) hanks, is to use bolt cutters/croppers (and an assistant or vice to steady things). Or barring that, a hacksaw or Dremel. - Prying them off with a screwdriver, etc. is what can damage the rings, or the sail, if force gets applied to anything but the hanks. And even then, when pried open, they can @ times be a PITA to remove.
There are a lot more answers here Single handed headsail changes - Sailing Anarchy - Sailing Anarchy Forums=
Plus a link to an E-book on single handing tips here Single handed headsail changes - Sailing Anarchy - Sailing Anarchy Forums And, the author of the E-book has a lengthier version available for purchase on Amazon.
Also, visit the San Francisco Singlehanded Society at www.SFBaySSS.org
__________________
The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
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31-05-2015, 05:23
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#3
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 49,140
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, mcgranec.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"
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31-05-2015, 05:43
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: U.S., Northeast
Boat: Currently boatless
Posts: 1,643
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Definitely Wichard snaps. Much easier to hank-on and take off. I've used both, and there's no comparison!
__________________
... He knows the chart is not the sea.
-- Philip Booth, Chart 1203
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31-05-2015, 08:46
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 10,208
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
If the jury isn't in yet snaps!
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31-05-2015, 09:15
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Wicklow, Ireland
Boat: Ruffian 23
Posts: 4
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
We may not have a full Jury yet, but the vote is 3-0, 4-0 if I'm allowed to vote. I only asked the question because snaps seemed to make more sense to me, but I had only come across pistons in my short career. Monday is a national holiday, so I don't have to decide until Tuesday. In the meantime, I now have to explore costs and balance that with how soon I can get on the water. :-)
Thanks to Uncivilised for the links. Some good reading there.
Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
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31-05-2015, 12:05
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#7
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Carlsbad, CA
Boat: 1976 Sabre 28-2
Posts: 7,505
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
The question I have is if the Wichard snaps are stainless steel, will they cause wear to the headstay wire. After thousands of miles, the bronze piston hanks showed considerable wear from the head stay. Would rather replace the attaching hardware on the sail than a possibly compromised headstay.
__________________
Peter O.
'Ae'a, Pearson 35
'Ms American Pie', Sabre 28 Mark II
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31-05-2015, 12:50
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 971
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Opening piston hanks with cold wet hands is a misery.
Snaps for sure, no worries.
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31-05-2015, 13:15
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#9
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 28,438
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
mcgranec,
Welcome aboard.
We used the Wichard snaps for our storm jib on our first Insatiable, an old IOR one tonner. They were wonderful.
The comment about the wear is interesting, and I'm not wise enough to evaluate it. I certainly have seen very worn piston hanks, so obviously the potential is there. Perhaps it would be less if your headstay is of dye formed wire, as you don't have the radii on the individual strands standing proud.
Let us know how it comes out.
__________________
Who scorns the calm has forgotten the storm.
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31-05-2015, 13:29
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 10,208
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Quote:
Originally Posted by roverhi
The question I have is if the Wichard snaps are stainless steel, will they cause wear to the headstay wire. After thousands of miles, the bronze piston hanks showed considerable wear from the head stay. Would rather replace the attaching hardware on the sail than a possibly compromised headstay.
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I may not be know about Wichard snaps. The ones I have had where bronze and yes they wear but the stay doesn't. A one hand on or off is great in an unexpected condition. So replacement periodically is well worthwhile.
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31-05-2015, 14:02
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lorient, Brittany, France
Boat: Gib'Sea 302, 30' - Hydra
Posts: 1,245
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
I have Wichard snaps on all my headsails. The bronze snaps are softer than the headstay but they seem to last longer than the sails. Their only disadvantage is their sensitivity to corrosion: it is necessary to lube them from time to time, to make sure that they close easily. The stainless ones need less maintenance but could cause wear on the stay.
A few weeks ago, we had just hoisted the spinnaker and not yet taken the jib down when the helmsman lost control on a bigger wave, the boat luffed and the spinnaker luff was caught on a snap from the jib. Maybe this snap wasn't properly closed.
Alain
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02-06-2015, 11:25
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 99
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
I would recommend piston hanks. You can get over the problem of needing one hand for holding on if you sit on the deck with one leg hanging down each side of the bow. This lowers your centre of gravity, allows you to grip on with your legs, like on a horse, and leaves you two hands free for dealing with the hanks etc. If you have to make sail changes under way, reducing sail in deteriorating conditions, for instance, you will find this the best technique, allowing you to sit on the sail, preventing it blowing away, until it is ready to hoist.
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02-06-2015, 11:49
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 10,208
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritofGlenans
I would recommend piston hanks. You can get over the problem of needing one hand for holding on if you sit on the deck with one leg hanging down each side of the bow. This lowers your centre of gravity, allows you to grip on with your legs, like on a horse, and leaves you two hands free for dealing with the hanks etc. If you have to make sail changes under way, reducing sail in deteriorating conditions, for instance, you will find this the best technique, allowing you to sit on the sail, preventing it blowing away, until it is ready to hoist.
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I don't want my legs straddling the bow if "needing" to strike a sail. Sitting on it, I might leave brown spots? Maybe not the green water might wash them away. It may be a good way on a day sailer.
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02-06-2015, 12:16
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 99
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadence
I don't want my legs straddling the bow if "needing" to strike a sail. Sitting on it, I might leave brown spots? Maybe not the green water might wash them away. It may be a good way on a day sailer.
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"Always reduce sail when you first think you might need to"
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02-06-2015, 12:28
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 93
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Re: Jib Sail Hanks - Piston vs Snaps
You will be spending some money on those hanks - have you thought about a basic fuller instead? The Schaefer Cf500 is very affordable - you can then furl/reef based on the wind and it's safer than you solo sailing and having to go to the bow to drop the headsail...
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