Insurance companies that are still writing for newer owners

[sail sfbay]

Have a marine insurance broker find an insurance underwriter and do not declare as liveaboards.

[wizoc]

Try Gowrie brokers
Some of the carriers they used are no longer writing but I think New Hampshire Ins. a sub of AIG.

[jimjimmyjimjim]

I'll add to the suggestions for Progressive. I have USAA for all my other insurance and so I went to them for my Formosa 40 built in 1972. They contract with Progressive and I got a very nice rate. They were no fuss, no survey, just a declared value. Coverage is limited to 12 miles offshore but I can get a rider to extend that.

I haven't had a claim as yet, so I don't know how they will handle that. Hopefully, I'll never have to find out.

PS: I didn't mention to them that I plan to live aboard.

[nuru05]

Originally Posted by pcmm

from my perspective a few things here:

it sounds like aside from taking a few courses you don't have much sailing experience and:
1. want to acquire a large boat
2. go offshore immediately

I would scale things back a bit. Stay "local" for at least the first season so you are learning the boat you pick in familiar waters. Don't go liveaboard immediately and if you do, become "cruisers". Liveaboards stay at the same dock all the time. Cruisers move around!

and yes there is a contradiction. If your lender understands marine you might get a better rate as they see lower risk in that you are at the boat all the time and can take care of it. but Insurance companies see it opposite. The more you are at the boat and using it, the greater their risk!

We didn't plan on going offshore immediately, our plan was to stick to the east coast or maybe the Bahamas for the first year or 2. We've scaled back to trying to get a 36 or 38' and sticking to coastal cruising for the first year or 2 but are so far still having trouble getting anyone to write us.

[svfinlandia]

Originally Posted by Shrew

I'd stay away from anyone who's bread and butter is really in the Home and Auto business who happen to cover RV's, Boats, and motorcycles.

I also don't like to a single company or agency representing a single company.

I'd prefer to go to an independent agent who represents multiple underwriting companies. For our boat, I prefer an Agency that specializes in marine insurance and carries some marine specific companies.

There are a number of them out there. If the agent your dealing with isn't intimately familiar with marine insurance, then hang up and move on.

+1 on the above.
Progressive insurance in particular will beat you way down if you have a claim.
I ended up getting $1700 for a totaled $4000 motorcycle and had to fight to get that!

Al, S/V Finlandia

[svfinlandia]

Originally Posted by jimjimmyjimjim

I'll add to the suggestions for Progressive. I have USAA for all my other insurance and so I went to them for my Formosa 40 built in 1972. They contract with Progressive and I got a very nice rate. They were no fuss, no survey, just a declared value. Coverage is limited to 12 miles offshore but I can get a rider to extend that.

I haven't had a claim as yet, so I don't know how they will handle that. Hopefully, I'll never have to find out.

PS: I didn't mention to them that I plan to live aboard.

The fact that they didn’t require a survey is a big red flag to me!
If I were a serious marine insurance company I would certainly want to know the condition of any boat that I was insuring.
I also hope that you never have a claim, and good luck if you do with progressive insurance! See my post above about my experience with them when I totaled my motorcycle.

Al, S/V Finlandia

[flightlead404]

Originally Posted by svfinlandia

+1 on the above.
Progressive insurance in particular will beat you way down if you have a claim.
I ended up getting $1700 for a totaled $4000 motorcycle and had to fight to get that!

Al, S/V Finlandia

Did you have an Agreed Value policy on your motorcycle?

I have one on my boat. At least for claims that would total the boat out that's the amount I'm getting (less deductibles ofc)

[svfinlandia]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

Did you have an Agreed Value policy on your motorcycle?

I have one on my boat. At least for claims that would total the boat out that's the amount I'm getting (less deductibles ofc)

They did not give me the option of an agreed value policy for my motorcycle. I think for vehicles that is called replacement value insurance.
They went by advance book value on the bike which was way, way lower than replacement price. Kelly blue book was much closer but they would not use it of course.
I ended up taking about $750 and the motorcycle and rebuilding it over the winter which cost about $1000.
I will never trade pennies ever again with progressive insurance on anything!

Al, S/V Finlandia

[Montanan]

Here you go, enjoy your new lifestyle and voyages.

References:

https://marineunderwriters.com/liveaboard/


https://www.globalmarineinsurance.co...e-live-aboard/

All the best.

[Peeew]

Markel insured me for a good price including usa easy coast and Bahamas as a first time boat owner on a 46 ft sailboat.

[TabbyCat]

Originally Posted by nuru05

So my wife and I are planning on buying a liveaboard this spring but are having trouble finding an insurance company that will talk to us. We are newer owners and have a somewhat limited resume (asa 101,103,104, offshore class, about a half dozen low 30' charter weeks).

According to my broker Progressive is not insuring liveaboards at all anymore and Geico is putting severe limitations on everyone. Do you guys know any good companies that would work with us? We are resigning ourselves to the idea that we may have to drop our search from a 44' to something like a 36 or 38 and stay in the US for the first year. Which wouldn't be the worst thing but we need to find a company that will work with us even at that.

If you have never owned a boat before, the underwriters will want you to have some hands on training on your new boat. Hopefully just a few days, worst case scenario, the entire first policy period. It really just depends on how good your sailing resume looks. Plan on spending more than you'd like on the first year policy, and then ask your agent to get competitive quotes in year 2, when you still have a recent survey.

Each company defines liveaboard differently. Some companies actually prefer liveaboards, others won't write them at all.

Most companies don't like absentee owners- situations where the primary mooring location is more than 150 NM from your mailing address. Other companies don't care.

Some companies won't write coverage for boats over 40 years old. Others will.

That's why it is best to have an experienced marine insurance agent help you with your search, instead of spamming all those underwriters with the "wrong" answers which prevent you from being a match for their program.

[doctorbill]

I recall when I got insurance for my 42 foot sloop back in 2013 the first screening question on electronic application was "is the vessel intended to be a primary residence?" If the answer was "yes" then it went to a page that said "we don't offer that."

It was an easily solution to change the answer to "no."

[GrowleyMonster]

BoatUS has treated me quite well. My premiums for liability only are low enough to laugh at for Brute Force. The boat was built in 1979 so 42 years old. You might try them. They did ask a lot of questions about previous owned boats, training and certification, years on the water, USCG documents, etc and I have never taken any ASA or RYA or similar yacht oriented courses though I am a retired merchant seaman and have owned a few boats. Honestly I don't even remember what I pay... something like $450/year? I will try to remember next time it auto-renews to notice when it gets pulled from my bank account or CC or wherever it is coming from.

[TabbyCat]

Originally Posted by doctorbill

I recall when I got insurance for my 42 foot sloop back in 2013 the first screening question on electronic application was "is the vessel intended to be a primary residence?" If the answer was "yes" then it went to a page that said "we don't offer that."

It was an easily solution to change the answer to "no."

.... and now you have just posted in a public forum that you changed an answer on your insurance application just to get coverage. Please do an internet search for "Uberrimae fidei" , which is part of every insurance contract.

Truly, the best thing to do is to contact a professional agent that has access to multiple companies, and work with them. One company that I work with calls a liveaboard anyone who no longer owns a home and will decline to quote. Another defines liveaboard as being onboard for anywhere between 3 and 12 months of the year and is happy to cover them. A third underwriter will ONLY cover you if you are a full time liveaboard cruiser. So there is no one "right" answer, you just need to be matched up with the right company for your situation by a capable agent.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by doctorbill

I recall when I got insurance for my 42 foot sloop back in 2013 the first screening question on electronic application was "is the vessel intended to be a primary residence?" If the answer was "yes" then it went to a page that said "we don't offer that."

It was an easily solution to change the answer to "no."

Surest way to have one's claim denied is to lie on the application.

No different than describing one's residency status when one owns multiple residences, I have three, only one is my primary at anytime. When I change locations with the intent to reside for more than a few weeks, I call the underwriter and have them revise their records indicating which of the three has become the primary and which is thence secondary residences.

Full and faithful disclosure if required with insurance policy underwriting. They are bargaining to acquire your risk exposures and if you don't tell them everything correctly and fully, well then you have not bargained in good faith and will enter any civil litigation with unclean hands.



I will add: As to dealings with disclosures to insurance company for their underwritings, what they don't know will hurt YOU!